Full Version: If a woman gets a sex-change, can he become a priest?
Or if a man does, can she become a nun? o.O I've always wondered this.
A woman who has a sex change operation is still a woman, only with added male parts. Same goes for a man. So, no, they could not become a priest/nun/brother.
Regardless, anybody who does this has severe psychological problems that would preclude them from becoming a religious. They couldn't even be married within the church much less ordained.
Regardless, anybody who does this has severe psychological problems that would preclude them from becoming a religious. They couldn't even be married within the church much less ordained.
DITTO!!!!
+JMJ+
In reality their is no such thing as "sex-change", only self-mutilation.
In reality their is no such thing as "sex-change", only self-mutilation.
I agree TOTALLY with OLAM DAD and FSW.....
sometime in the past several years...a woman & a woman who had a sex-change operation had attempted to get married...the court's ruling was based on their genetics...both had female chromosomes & according to that state law could not be married...so even though this is a secular example...it still flies with the above reasonings for our Church....
You know, I had never thought of that. But in today's bazaar world I guess you need to be prepared address strange issues like this. Thanks PM'r for the insight.
Mr. Ray
Mr. Ray
Hrm...
so, does the soul have sex? (I know I'm opening a can of worms here, but I thought it might be worth a revisitation, considering...)
so, does the soul have sex? (I know I'm opening a can of worms here, but I thought it might be worth a revisitation, considering...)
QUOTE(scardella @ May 22 2006, 03:18 PM) [snapback]987330[/snapback]
Hrm...
so, does the soul have sex? (I know I'm opening a can of worms here, but I thought it might be worth a revisitation, considering...)
Yes
That was me. 
Thank you for the answer. I've always wondered that o.o
because, we're not dualist and believe in teh inseparable nature of body and soul (hence,really, why their is a resurrection of the body), your body can't do anything without your soul and vice versa. this includes conjugal union 
So...perhaps the Bible verse that says (& I'm trying to remember how it goes!): "...in God there is neither Gentile nor Jew...servant nor free...woman nor man no more..." Okay, maybe I am quoting a song verse...but it is based on Scripture....is refering to mutual love & respect among Christian peoples rather than actual physical attributes? (I hope this makes sense!) Am I on track or is this refering to somethng else...like heaven? 
QUOTE(brandelynmarie @ May 24 2006, 06:53 AM) [snapback]989295[/snapback]
So...perhaps the Bible verse that says (& I'm trying to remember how it goes!): "...in God there is neither Gentile nor Jew...servant nor free...woman nor man no more..." Okay, maybe I am quoting a song verse...but it is based on Scripture....is refering to mutual love & respect among Christian peoples rather than actual physical attributes? (I hope this makes sense!) Am I on track or is this refering to somethng else...like heaven?
My understanding of that verse has always been that your dignity does not depend on attributes or incidentals (I'm forgetting the philosophical term here), but because you are made in the image and likeness of God. Therefore, in response to this fundamental human dignity, we are to love them. (Of course the external actions of that love do highly depend on those incidentals.)
Note that this is not to say that amendment for sins is not necessary. It is certainly a function of love to correct errors and repent for sins.
Ah ha! Thank you! 
QUOTE(brandelynmarie @ May 24 2006, 08:05 AM) [snapback]989355[/snapback]
Ah ha! Thank you!
Then again, I'm no final authority on biblical interpretation... note that Scripture in many ways often has layers and layers of meaning. There's a reason why it's called the Word of God. We can never truly plumb its depths, but we can say that some interpretations are certainly valid and some are certainly invalid. For instance, the Church has said that it is a fallacy to interpret the above quote as meaning that there is no fundamental differences between the sexes.
I believe I heard somewhere that "the body is the icon of the whole person."
QUOTE(ChrisZewe @ May 21 2006, 02:52 PM) [snapback]986341[/snapback]
Or if a man does, can she become a nun? o.O I've always wondered this.
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEH?.
QUOTE(brandelynmarie @ May 24 2006, 08:53 AM) [snapback]989295[/snapback]
So...perhaps the Bible verse that says (& I'm trying to remember how it goes!): "...in God there is neither Gentile nor Jew...servant nor free...woman nor man no more..." Okay, maybe I am quoting a song verse...but it is based on Scripture....is refering to mutual love & respect among Christian peoples rather than actual physical attributes? (I hope this makes sense!) Am I on track or is this refering to somethng else...like heaven?
Ah hah! you bring up an interesting thought. Being male or female is mostly physical characteristics based on function, but we all know there are phycological differences, emotional differences and probably others, you smart people could list. But how much of those differences are accually in the soul? There must be some. ummmm. There is no gender in personhood. But our "personess" is made up of body and soul. darn it! I just gave myself a headache
QUOTE(brandelynmarie @ May 24 2006, 06:53 AM) [snapback]989295[/snapback]
So...perhaps the Bible verse that says (& I'm trying to remember how it goes!): "...in God there is neither Gentile nor Jew...servant nor free...woman nor man no more..." Okay, maybe I am quoting a song verse...but it is based on Scripture....is refering to mutual love & respect among Christian peoples rather than actual physical attributes? (I hope this makes sense!) Am I on track or is this refering to somethng else...like heaven?
That would be "One Bread One Body"....it's a Eucharistic hymn usually sung during Holy Communion.
I've wondered too, what exactly makes a female a female, and a male, a male. Is it just physically, or does your soul have a sex? When God creates your little soul in the womb, your little body, He puts a sex, say he makes you female, your mind, intellect, soul, heart, emotions and physical body are female are they not?
http://www.ewtn.com/library/THEOLOGY/REMYBODY.HTM
Remember you are body and soul and they cannot be seperated.
Remember you are body and soul and they cannot be seperated.
That would be "One Bread One Body"....it's a Eucharistic hymn usually sung during Holy Communion.
Ah yes! Thanks Lauren!
Remember you are body and soul and they cannot be seperated.
Agreed!
true! Very true.
QUOTE(cmotherofpirl @ May 25 2006, 01:27 PM) [snapback]990355[/snapback]
http://www.ewtn.com/library/THEOLOGY/REMYBODY.HTM
Remember you are body and soul and they cannot be seperated.
Tis true, body and soul are one. However when you die your soul is separated from your body and will remain separated until the general resurrection. So the question is not completely answered. I think it is highly likely that gender is a constituative part of the soul but haven't a clue as how to express it.
I wouldn't be upset one way or the other since it is a God thing.
Mr. Ray
yeah and anyone who wants to get a sex change has SERIOUS phycological problums!
Archbishop Burke seems to think so, he received a transsexual nun's vows:
http://www.riverfronttimes.com/issues/2004...25/sidebar.html
QUOTE
At times his theological allegiance with these orders placed Bishop Burke in some compromising positions. Most striking, perhaps, was the case of Sister Julie Green, a member of the Franciscan Servants of Jesus:
"Julie Green is living a lie!" writes Mary Therese Helmueller in an October 25, 2002, letter to Archbishop Gabriel Montalvo, Papal Nuncio to the United States. "[She] is a transsexual, a biological male. He is really Joel Green, who had a sex operation to make him physically appear as a woman.... I fear that The Church in America will suffer another 'sex scandal' if Julie Green continues to be recognized as a Catholic Religious Sister, and if Bishop Raymond L. Burke receives his final vows, as a religious sister, on November 23rd, 2002."
Montalvo forwarded the letter to Burke, who on November 20, 2002, replied to Helmueller. "With regard to Sister Julie Green, F.S.J., the recognition of the association of the faithful which she and Sister Anne LeBlanc founded was granted only after consultation with the Holy See," he writes. "These are matters which are confidential and do not admit of any further comment.... I can assure you that Sister Julie Green in no way espouses a sex change operation as right or good. In fact, she holds it to be seriously disordered. Therefore, I caution you very much about the rash judgments which you made in your letter to the Apostolic Nuncio."
Adds Burke: "I express my surprise that, when you had questions about Sister Julie Green, you did not, in accord with the teaching of our Lord, address the matter to me directly."
"Julie Green is living a lie!" writes Mary Therese Helmueller in an October 25, 2002, letter to Archbishop Gabriel Montalvo, Papal Nuncio to the United States. "[She] is a transsexual, a biological male. He is really Joel Green, who had a sex operation to make him physically appear as a woman.... I fear that The Church in America will suffer another 'sex scandal' if Julie Green continues to be recognized as a Catholic Religious Sister, and if Bishop Raymond L. Burke receives his final vows, as a religious sister, on November 23rd, 2002."
Montalvo forwarded the letter to Burke, who on November 20, 2002, replied to Helmueller. "With regard to Sister Julie Green, F.S.J., the recognition of the association of the faithful which she and Sister Anne LeBlanc founded was granted only after consultation with the Holy See," he writes. "These are matters which are confidential and do not admit of any further comment.... I can assure you that Sister Julie Green in no way espouses a sex change operation as right or good. In fact, she holds it to be seriously disordered. Therefore, I caution you very much about the rash judgments which you made in your letter to the Apostolic Nuncio."
Adds Burke: "I express my surprise that, when you had questions about Sister Julie Green, you did not, in accord with the teaching of our Lord, address the matter to me directly."
http://www.riverfronttimes.com/issues/2004...25/sidebar.html
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