Aya Sophia Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 Chiqui mentioned in another thread the matter of having one's Superior as Spiritual Director [size=3]("Something I definitely am going to look more into and try to get a clear answer on is this whole thing about how your Superior should not be your Spiritual Director. I experienced this (not in a Carmel) and it did create confusion, to say the least ")[/size] - thought this might be in an interesting topic on its own. [b]Those with no experience of religious life, those with experience, those currently in religious life - what do you think about having your Superior as your Spiritual Director? Or not?[/b] In my experience in Carmel the Superior is indeed one's "spiritual director" - if there is heart outpouring and soul baring it is done with and to her. While in the novitiate you meet weekly with the NM but this is mostly to work your way through the Rule, the customary and writings of the founders, to ask certain types of permissions, etc. You can share personally with the NM a little but you reserve the significant bits for your meetings with the Prioress. (The Constitutions allow all members of the community to request and speak to a Confessor/Priest, apart from regular confession, should it be so desired, but the conversations would be related to a particular matter and not be ongoing). It seems having one's Superior as SD is one of the many ways in which, in Carmel, a person still in the novitiate is mainstreamed into the life of the community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AccountDeleted Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithcecelia Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 This is one of the many situations that will vary dramatically from person to person and community to community. Each individual has the right under canon law to chose their own SD and confessor, allowing for the rules of a community/order etc to be kept - so for example a superior may say they cannot pay for direction for a member, or allow an nun out of enclosure every week for ongoing formation, but they certainly cannot (legally) tell the member who they can use. From experience I think it is beneficial to have an SD who is not the superior (and also pre-entry not the PP) as this gives more freedom of speech, 'space' to discuss and pray over issues concerning the community and ones vocation, etc. But I can also see that the superior would have more idea of the individual's general behaviours and an idea of how well they are coping, if they have changed, etc. Overall, I would say the most important thing is to have an SD who you are able to be completely honest and open with, who you can truely bare your soul to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithcecelia Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 [quote name='nunsense' timestamp='1315575151' post='2302511'] No. [/quote] If I had given a one word answer, it would have been this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juchu Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 [quote name='nunsense' timestamp='1315575151' post='2302511'] No. [/quote] I agree Especially in the beginning. I have not been in Religious Life yet. But knowing myself a little and having the experience from my life-ins, I would say that things get "messy" sometimes... Lots of feelings, things breaking up, being confronted with God, with community life, with the nakedness of oneself that no grad-school education can cover up.... During my first live in it was really crazy... I talked and cried a lot during this time with my "contact-sister" I have had before as a "guest". I talked also twice with the novice mistress. When I came for my 2nd live-in, being more sure to enter, I started talking more regulary with my novice-mistress-to-be. In my community you talk to the prioress at set-times as a novice (I think at least twice a year "officially" where you, the novice mistress and the prioress make sort of an evaluation of how things are going for you). As a solemly professed sister you talk to the prioress for all important things, since she is the one who is responsable for the unity of the community. But you are free to choose another sister or an outside person to be your "contact-sister" for the daily struggles. There is a very wise lady coming, who is trained as a psychologist, and one can also choose her as "contact" as a professed sister. So - to sum it up - especially in formation - I am happy to share with the prioress the "results" of the work done with the novice mistress... But not all the details of all that leads to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeresaBenedicta Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 Eh, I lean towards no. There might be certain things that flow over or are shared/discussed both in spiritual direction and in meeting with one's superior... but the roles are different. One is to form you specifically as a religious and as a religious within a certain institute and charism. The other is to guide and direct, which is slightly different than forming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AccountDeleted Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 The role of a SD and the role of a Superior are different. That doesn't mean one can't be close to the Superior, or even share many personal thoughts with her, in fact, this is a good thing, but it is a conflict of interests for her to be the SD for someone in her community because she has her own responsibilities to the whole of the community, as well as to each individual within the community. I do know of superiors who think that this is their role, but they are mistaken and this idea can cause great distress, confusion and eventual heartache for all involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HopefulBride Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 You know I hadn't thought about that. If I had the choice I think I would prefer to not have my formator as my SD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmaD2006 Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 [b]No no no no no no no.[/b] You start crossing the lines of interior and exterior forums. You need to have that separation. In the last experience I had you would talk with your immediate superior about the struggles you are having, but each sister was encouraged to have a spiritual director. The spiritual director was usually one of the priests in the institute. Some of the sisters had a "sister mentor" who was also involved. Even in that case there was a potential for a conflict of interest, but the priests were such that they did seem to keep things confidential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krissylou Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 Lillliabettt (I'm never sure how many Ls and how many Ts there are supposed to be in there) was talking about this too, with her former community. Without trying to put words in her mouth, she was also talking about "internal and external forums" as cmaria was saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MithLuin Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 I've not experienced religious life, but I would just say that I'd never want my boss as my spiritual director. I don't go to confession with the priest who is my dad's boss (my dad's a deacon), nor the priest who was my boss at the school where I taught.... and it isn't because I don't trust them to respect the seal of the confessional. It's just that I think that it crosses a boundary and isn't helpful for anyone involved. There are other priests I can go to for confession, and for spiritual direction. Why would a put someone in a position of feeling conflicted over that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithcecelia Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 [quote name='MithLuin' timestamp='1315588274' post='2302571'] I've not experienced religious life, but I would just say that I'd never want my boss as my spiritual director. I don't go to confession with the priest who is my dad's boss (my dad's a deacon), nor the priest who was my boss at the school where I taught.... and it isn't because I don't trust them to respect the seal of the confessional. It's just that I think that it crosses a boundary and isn't helpful for anyone involved. There are other priests I can go to for confession, and for spiritual direction. Why would a put someone in a position of feeling conflicted over that? [/quote] My former parish priest heard 3hrs+ of confessions a week and I heard from many people that he was a very good confessor. I have no reason to doubt that, but never went to him because he had very quickly become my friend, and especially so once I was also his secretary. Some of our conversations could possibly have been seen as spiritual direction, but the advice came out of conversations of friendship - I valued and respected his advice (still do) but I would never have chosen his as an SD because he was my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EWIE Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 [size=5][color=#800000][b]NO ![/b][/color][/size] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmaD2006 Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 (edited) FaithCecilia mentioned another no-no. A spiritual director needs to be either a spiritual mother or father. Not a friend. Now granted a sort of friendship develops over time (I would consider my 1st spiritual director a friend, but that developed over time). Friendship however was not the focus. I made the mistake of crossing that line with my last spiritual director ... and because of a disagreement now both the spiritual direction and the friendship were broken. If we weren't friends, he would still be my s.d. I would also suggest that your s.d. not be involved in ministry with you at all. Sometimes that can be difficult to do (there is a possibility that I will serve at the parish where my s.d. is at). But that separation I think is a good thing too. ------- ... this should have been a poll. Then again it would have been oh so lopsided Edited September 9, 2011 by cmariadiaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carmenchristi Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 (edited) I agree with all those who said no, and with their reasoning. BTW I have experienced a superior as a SD.... it was terrible and I'm glad that the practice has since changed! Edited September 9, 2011 by carmenchristi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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