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Carthusian Nun & Monk Video


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#1 brandelynmarie

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 08:37 PM

Enjoy! :)





#2 Mary's Margaret

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 09:09 PM

Absolutely beautiful. Thank-you for posting.

#3 brandelynmarie

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 09:33 PM

You're so welcome :) . It is rare to find videos on Carthusian nuns. :nun:

#4 Rocamadour

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 10:38 PM

Lovely!

#5 sistersintigo

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Posted 29 September 2011 - 09:12 AM

Regarding the monastery of Carthusian nuns in this video:
I recognize a few of these lovely slides/photos from a Sunday edition of a newspaper in Spain, but many of the photos are new to me -- so these images of the Spanish nuns come from more than one source.

Of note: there is only one Spanish community of Carthusian nuns. You can see that their monastery is centuries old. In fact it was built for monks in the Cistercian order -- that is O.Cist., centuries before the reforms of La Trappe [O.C.S.O., the "strict observance"]. So this is one of northern Spain's ancient Cistercian foundations, and thus it was designed and built for cenobitic, rather than eremitic, life.

After World War II, the Reverend Father, Minister General of the Carthusian Order -- a Spaniard, obviously not a coincidence -- negotiated with Spain's cultural bureaucracy in order to acquire this monastery -- a national treasure by this time -- for his own Order. He was dom Fernando Vidal, and he intended this acquisition, from the beginning, for the nuns.

Spain has had many centuries of Carthusian monks, but the Carthusian nuns were invariably outside of Spain before now. In fact, the foundress women for this charterhouse in northern Spain, were Spanish women who spent years in Italy, being formed and professed for cloistered life by Carthusian nuns from other nations.

Their charterhouse is La Cartuja de Benifasa in the province of Valencia.

#6 brandelynmarie

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Posted 29 September 2011 - 07:53 PM

Very razzle dazzle! So which is stricter...the O.C.S.O.?

#7 Aya Sophia

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Posted 29 September 2011 - 09:11 PM

"comparative study" of O.Cart and OCSO would be interesting ... O.Cart is famous for their motto "never reformed because never deformed" - they stuck to their traditions in the wake of V2 while OCSO instituted many changes. So, perhaps they differ from eachother more now, post V2, than before, with O. Cart retaining more austery than OCSO. Don't quote me, however - just musing.

Edited by Aya Sophia, 29 September 2011 - 09:12 PM.


#8 brandelynmarie

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Posted 29 September 2011 - 09:37 PM

Muse away...I am very good at musing about things myself. :proud: Must go check this out...

#9 sistersintigo

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Posted 30 September 2011 - 01:48 PM

Regarding the monastery of Carthusian nuns in this video:
You can see that their monastery is centuries old. In fact it was built for monks in the Cistercian order -- that is O.Cist., centuries before the reforms of La Trappe [O.C.S.O., the "strict observance"]. So this is one of northern Spain's ancient Cistercian foundations, and thus it was designed and built for cenobitic, rather than eremitic, life.


The quoted post (preceding)
says O.Cist. -- it does NOT say O.Cart. !

need to clear that up, as succeeding posts say 'O.Cart.' so somebody has two orders confused.
Summing up:

O.Cist. founded by St Bernard, St Stephen Harding, St Robert of Molesmes et al.

O.C.S.O. is a reform, with French roots, of O.Cist., at the monk's abbey of La Trappe; names associated with this reform include de Rance and Lestrange (Napoleonic era).

O.Cart. founded by St Bruno of Cologne.

Regarding the monastery of Carthusian nuns in this video:
You can see that their monastery is centuries old. In fact it was built for monks in the Cistercian order -- that is O.Cist., centuries before the reforms of La Trappe [O.C.S.O., the "strict observance"]. So this is one of northern Spain's ancient Cistercian foundations, and thus it was designed and built for cenobitic, rather than eremitic, life.


The quoted post (preceding)
says O.Cist. -- it does NOT say O.Cart. !

need to clear that up, as succeeding posts say 'O.Cart.' so somebody has two orders confused.
Summing up:

O.Cist. founded by St Bernard, St Stephen Harding, St Robert of Molesmes et al.

O.C.S.O. is a reform, with French roots, of O.Cist., at the monk's abbey of La Trappe; names associated with this reform include de Rance and Lestrange (Napoleonic era).

O.Cart. founded by St Bruno of Cologne.

#10 brandelynmarie

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Posted 30 September 2011 - 02:56 PM

Sooooooooooo..........Are both O. Cist. & O. Cart based on Benedictine life? Or are they different creatures all together? :huh: Maybe someone could flock draw a time-line/family tree for us? :topsy:

Edited by brandelynmarie, 30 September 2011 - 02:56 PM.


#11 Aya Sophia

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Posted 30 September 2011 - 07:24 PM

O. Cist (reform of the Benedictines) and OCSO (reform of the reform!) both follow Rule of Benedict, O. Cart does not.

Here's Thomas Merton (OCSO) writing on the Carthusians, commenting a little at the beginning about Benedictine influence in the Charterhouse
http://transfigurati...Carthusians.htm


Carthusian Statutes* (what isn't on the internet today?! amazing . . .)
http://www.chartreux...eng/st-en-1.htm


*ok, corrected "statues" to read "statutes" (Carthusian statues are probably still not available on the internet! :hehe2: )

Edited by Aya Sophia, 30 September 2011 - 07:29 PM.


#12 brandelynmarie

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Posted 30 September 2011 - 08:38 PM

:saint2: Thanks Aya. :hehe:

#13 sistersintigo

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Posted 01 October 2011 - 02:14 PM

Some further distinctions --

Saint Bruno really, really, REALLY meant what Greta Garbo says in the film:
"I vant to be ALONE."

People would not leave St Bruno alone, however, because they knew his holiness by reputation. This was true when he was a canon at the cathedral of Rheims. It was true when he went off to the Grand Chartreuse to be a hermit. In fact it was one of his former students who upset things. Here Bruno was with his companions, very near the locality of today's Grande Chartreuse charterhouse, living the hermit's life. And his former student found out where he had gone, and sent for him, And you know why Bruno could not just ignore his former student? Because said student had become....the POPE. One of the Urbans, I forget which number. Sent for him to come to the Vatican and be one of his advisors!

Well you don't say no to the Pope, so Bruno set some conditions. That his Grande Chartreuse companions ought to continue without him, and receive the support of the Church and its Holy Father -- thus the Carthusian Order was assured of its motherhouse. That Bruno would not be made a bishop -- an outright refusal to become a bishop. Bruno also had hopes of going back to the Chartreuse someday.

He never did so, although there were exchanges of letters. As long as Bruno was in Italy, though, when he had done some years of service to His Holiness, he succeeded in being allowed to retire to a different area of Italy to live out his life as a hermit. And there, too, he was surrounded with followers, so he died with a whole roomful of people around him when the time came. But the point is, Bruno really wanted to be a hermit, he loved the solitary life. Of course he knew about Benedict and monasteries a/k/a cenobitic life, but it was eremitical/hermit life he craved.

Therein the big distinction. St Bernard's Cistercian Order is cenobitic, not eremitic. There are abbeys with abbots, priors with priors, monasteries with leaders, and the emphasis is on community, not on the solitary life. Further, Bernard founded the Cistercians upon a reform of Benedictine practice, trying to live more strictly the Rule of Benedict. The Trappists did to the Cistercians what the Cistercians did to the Benedictines.

Some other points are relevant, to the nuns particularly.
The Carthusian nuns are truly scarce. Although a foundation has been attempted in South Korea, the nuns have otherwise never had monasteries outside of Europe, and there are parts of Europe that have had Carthusian monks but never Carthusian nuns. Carthusian monks have got further than that, with two foundations in South America and one in Vermont.

Trappistine nuns, on the other hand, are all over the map: the Philippines, founded from Italy; Canada, founded from France; I don't know about the rest of Asia or the Americas.

#14 brandelynmarie

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Posted 01 October 2011 - 10:33 PM

Some further distinctions --

Saint Bruno really, really, REALLY meant what Greta Garbo says in the film:
"I vant to be ALONE."

People would not leave St Bruno alone. [He] also had hopes of going back to the Chartreuse someday.

He never did.

Further, Bernard founded the Cistercians upon a reform of Benedictine practice, trying to live more strictly the Rule of Benedict. The Trappists did to the Cistercians what the Cistercians did to the Benedictines.



Poor St. Bruno! :ohno: And as to the reforms! :stars:

#15 nunsense

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Posted 01 October 2011 - 10:55 PM



Poor St. Bruno! :ohno: And as to the reforms! :stars:



Not at all! think of it this way... St Bruno was allowed to sacrifice the one thing he really wanted in love and service to God (solitude), according to God's will, not St Bruno's. And St Bruno must have been pretty good at it too because after all, he was sanctified and made even holier by it! Who knows if he might have become very self-centred if left all to himself - but God knew what was best for him while also using him for the good of all His Church! :) Nothing poor about St Bruno at all - rich in grace and mercy and surrender to God's will! :love:

#16 brandelynmarie

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Posted 01 October 2011 - 11:08 PM

Ah! Since you put it like that... :blush: :saint2:

#17 nunsense

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Posted 01 October 2011 - 11:21 PM

Ah! Since you put it like that... :blush: :saint2:



I've found that I have to look at everything from a different perspective these days - that's the only way it all makes sense to me. God is all love and all goodness and wants only what is best for our soul. So as long as we are trying to please Him, He uses our offerings for our good, and will lead on us the best path to holiness, no matter how difficult or contrary to our own nature that may seem. St Bruno is a great example of this.

#18 marigold

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Posted 03 October 2011 - 05:09 PM

So are the folks in the video Carthusians or Cistercians?

#19 brandelynmarie

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Posted 03 October 2011 - 08:23 PM

They are Carthusians of St. Bruno :). Sorry for the confusion. :blush:

#20 marigold

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Posted 04 October 2011 - 01:33 AM

They are Carthusians of St. Bruno :). Sorry for the confusion. :blush:


Thanks for clearing that up! I like the video.




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