9 replies to this topic

[Alabanza]

Hi every one, I have a question, I hope this is the right place to ask this. Is the United Methodist Church a branch of the Catholic church, do they have some kind of affiliation ar relation?, I visit one on yesterday and the rituals and many of the prayers and responses are the same. I hope some one can help me with this. Thank you. I appreciate the input.

[Lisa]

The United Methodist Church is not part of or affiliated with the Catholic Church (except that they are Christian, which connects all Christian churches, including Catholics!)

Please, for those that know more, correct me if I'm wrong! This is my understanding of how it happened, with the help of Wikipedia.

Methodists were a reform movement within Anglicanism, so they are "two steps removed" from Catholicism, if that makes sense. Basically, Anglicans broke off from the Faith after King Henry VII wanted to divorce his wife and remarry, and the bishops said 'no,' so King Henry put himself in charge of a new church, the Church of England, or Anglicans. From there, John Wesley decided to reform Anglicanism in the 1700s. Eventually, that group broke off from the Anglicans and began to form their own doctrine; they became known as Methodists, because the group that started it had a very methodical "method" of study and self-improvement.

Since the Methodist Church, which includes the United Methodist Church, came from the Anglicans, their liturgy may appear to have many similarities: pre-selected readings and prayers, etc. Even though aspects of the liturgy may be similar, the Methodists (as most Protestant denominations) do not believe in the physical true presence of Jesus in the Eucharist, which is a central teaching of our faith. In the spectrum of Christianity, Methodists are sort of in the middle.

Pray for the unity of Christ's church.

[Archaeology cat]

No, thy aren't. Some Methodist congregations are very liturgical, with vestments and a lectionary and whatnot, and some aren't. They o have similar beliefs about baptism (some of them, at least), but very different beliefs about other Sacraments, especially the Eucharist. Methodists ordain women, as well. The Methodist ecclesial community was founded by John Wesley. They use the Apostle's Creed, but explain away the word "Catholic" in it.

Hope that helps a little. My brother nd parents are Methodist.

[Alabanza]

Well they pray out loud the Creed Nicene and the words for the offrering and consacration of the communion are the same and in the creed they declare that they believe in th Holy Catholic church. ( I don't have a problem with it) I'm just really wondering. Thank you Phamily.

[juchu]

Holy Catholic church

the original meaning of "catholic" - greek καθολικός - is "the whole". This καθολικός in the Niceene Creed was there before there were the separations of the Orthodox and the Protestant Churches. Some protestant churches choose to continue with "the universal" church instead of saying "catholic", because "catholic" nowadays refers to the Roman Catholic Church. But some protestant churches stayed with "catholic" as well... So this is not quite a marker to distinguish if a church is catholic or not.

Edited by juchu, 03 April 2012 - 09:32 AM.

[Archaeology cat]

Well yes, Catholic means universal, and Methodist use it as meaning that instead of the Catholic Church. However, doing so kinda confuses the original meaning of Catholic, for while it did/does mean universal, it has also always indicated a particular set of beliefs and practices. Methodists will consider themselves part of the universal church, but not part of the Catholic Church, if that makes sense.

As for their communion prayers, even if they use the same prayers (not doubting you; some might indeed use those prayers, though I know my parents' congregation doesn't. Their congregation also isn't at all liturgical), they are not connecting the Eucharist since their ordinations aren't valid and they aren't intending to do so. They don't believe in transubstantiation, but hold it to be symbolic only (in the modern sense of a symbol).

God bless

[Byzantine]

(in the modern sense of a symbol).

Would it be thread hijacking to ask for a more thorough explanation?

[the171]

So the Dread Pirate Wesley founded Methodism... You learn something new every day.

[Archaeology cat]

Would it be thread hijacking to ask for a more thorough explanation?

The modern sense is that a symbol is separate from what it symbolises; the ancient Jewish sense, though, is that a symbol also is what it symbolises. Apotheoun had a really good discussion of that in a thread on the debate table ages ago.

[LouisvilleFan]

Well they pray out loud the Creed Nicene and the words for the offrering and consacration of the communion are the same and in the creed they declare that they believe in th Holy Catholic church. ( I don't have a problem with it) I'm just really wondering. Thank you Phamily.

I grew up in a Lutheran congregation (the ELCA, which shares full communion with the United Methodist Church). Yes, you'll find many similarities, just as you'll find many similarities between the Spanish and Italian languages. They both descended from Latin, but today they are definitely not the same language while the Catholic Church is still speaking the same language she spoke a thousand years ago and a thousand years before that. It may appear to be a the same celebration of Communion, but what makes it a sacrament are the things you cannot see: the Methodist minister may look like a Catholic priest, but the Methodist was not ordained by a Catholic bishop. The bread may look the same, but the Eucharist is truly the Body and Blood of Christ.

Maybe in a certain way we do recognize all Protestants as a "branch" of Catholicism in that they share our faith in Christ and sacrament of Baptism. However, your local Catholic bishop has no jurisdication over the Methodist church. But he does have (along with all of us) a pastoral responsibility to draw all people into the full celebration of the Christian Faith in the Catholic Church.