Best, Complete, Factual Account Of What's Happening In Ferguson

[KnightofChrist]

Okay, here fine.  The Plain Dealer is my hometown paper. Not the Times, ok, but not Glen Beck. 
http://www.cleveland.com/nation/index.ssf/2014/08/ferguson_missouri_police_offic.html
 
Same sources talked to ABC News:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/ferguson-shooting-grand-jury-decide-october-charge-cop/story?id=25047905
 
 
The sources were one person in the DA's office and a different person in the police department. 
 
Maybe they are collaborating in some elaborate scheme to get brownie points for the racist cop in the 15 minutes before everyone finds out it's a lie.
 
Like I said, I doubt it.

 
It is still my understanding that the source for those two sources is still Jim Hoft. Edited August 21, 2014 by KnightofChrist

[Winchester]

How does society justly find an accused person not guilty or guilty of a crime if not by trial by jury or by judge?

It would be a step in the right direction if society were involved in the court system. I think that would be much better than what we have, now.

[Lilllabettt]

 
It is still my understanding that the source for those two sources is still Jim Hoft.

 

 

nope. You can read in the article that ABC News talked to at least one of them independently. 

In that same story it says the Chief of Police went on public record saying the cop's face was beaten and swollen up. 

so yeah. Really really doubt he would look into the cameras and lie about that when he's gotta know they took photographs at the hospital.  

[Winchester]

If I start a fight over something stupid (like jaywalking), I get hit after starting the fight, and then shoot the guy after he's started running away, I'm probably going to the pen.

 

The wounds indicate the combat was mutual. It doesn't tell us who turned the incident into violence. There was a case in Austin where a police officer initiated violence with a jogger who "jaywalked" because she didn't heave to at his command. If she had driven an elbow into her assailant's face, it would clearly have been self defense, but she would have been charged with more than "resisting arrest" (not hearing a thug scream commands and get his ego wounded when not obeyed, driving him to initiate violence over the exercise of common sense in crossing a road). In another instance, a cop sexually assaulted a woman by grabbing her breast. When she defended herself, she was beaten and charged with a felony. The cop in the last example did present with injuries, but was the instigator of the violence.

 

Yes, I'm aware the shots that made contact are from the front. That doesn't mean the deceased was running at the cop. It means when the cop got on target, the deceased was facing him. Is it possible someone could be pissed just after a fight and shoot someone who was no longer a threat?

 

[Lilllabettt]

Is it possible someone could be pissed just after a fight and shoot someone who was no longer a threat?

 

Yes, that's possible. Seems like that is what most people think happened.

Because they "know" that if a white cop in Missouri shoots an unarmed black man 7 times it must be an unjustifiable case of racist police brutality.

I'm saying they need to have the air let out of their thought bubbles.

 

For example: 

why did the cop shoot Mike 7+ times? whack.

 

Ummmmmm ....  I can think of lots of possible non "whack" explanations?

 

Stereotypes are adaptive but the problem is they limit the imagination. 

 

[KnightofChrist]

nope. You can read in the article that ABC News talked to at least one of them independently. 

In that same story it says the Chief of Police went on public record saying the cop's face was beaten and swollen up. 

so yeah. Really really doubt he would look into the cameras and lie about that when he's gotta know they took photographs at the hospital.  

 

Perhaps, but I'm not sure that the source is not Jim Hoft. The police also had an evolving story on the robbery they accused Brown of committing that the store owner stated he never reported. Maybe the store owner lied out of fear, perhaps the cops are lying to protect one of their own. 

[KnightofChrist]

 

Yes, that's possible. Seems like that is what most people think happened.

Because they "know" that if a white cop in Missouri shoots an unarmed black man 7 times it must be an unjustifiable case of racist police brutality.

I'm saying they need to have the air let out of their thought bubbles.

 

For example: 

 

Ummmmmm ....  I can think of lots of possible non "whack" explanations?

 

Stereotypes are adaptive but the problem is they limit the imagination. 

 

 

 

I can think of a few whack explanations, but all the ones that I can think of are voided when I think of the whack idea that the cop could have gotten into his police car and rolled up the window and waited for back up, or drove to keep his distance from Brown. Instead of shooting at him as he ran away, and then blowing him away when he turned around even if he charged him. 

 

However, law enforcement officials say witnesses and forensic analysis have shown that Officer Wilson did sustain an injury during the struggle in the car.

As Officer Wilson got out of his car, the men were running away. The officer fired his weapon but did not hit anyone, according to law enforcement officials.

Source: NYT and LGF

[Lilllabettt]

Perhaps, but I'm not sure that the source is not Jim Hoft. The police also had an evolving story on the robbery they accused Brown of committing that the store owner stated he never reported. Maybe the store owner lied out of fear, perhaps the cops are lying to protect one of their own. 

 

 

So many possibilities. It's almost as if the situation is so opaque that no judgment call can or should be made at this point. 

[KnightofChrist]

So many possibilities. It's almost as if the situation is so opaque that no judgment call can or should be made at this point. 

 

Remember that when you are suggesting people are being stereotypical when they find it hard to believe it would be justifiably to shoot a unarmed person 7 times. Still, I see no evidence yet to prove in any manner that Officer Darren Wilson was severely beaten. You find it hard to doubt an unnamed source that claims that he was, and I find it hard to doubt what I can see in the video of Officer Wilson walking around the body of Mr. Brown where Wilson appear to suffer no injury. 

[Lilllabettt]

I can think of a few whack explanations, but all the ones that I can think of are voided when I think of the whack idea that the cop could have gotten into his police car and rolled up the window and waited for back up, or drove to keep his distance from Brown. Instead of shooting at him as he ran away, and then blowing him away when he turned around even if he charged him. 

 

 

tut tut I think this one has just removed himself from the jury pool.

 

Remember that when you are suggesting people are being stereotypical when they find it hard to believe it would be justifiably to shoot a unarmed person 7 times.

 

Being unable to think of non "whack" explanations for shooting an unarmed guy 7 times betrays either a lack of imagination or maybe ignorance about guns or something.

Stereotypes limit imagination.

Are either of those two points incorrect?

[KnightofChrist]

tut tut I think this one has just removed himself from the jury pool.

 
Oh dear.

Being unable to think of non "whack" explanations for shooting an unarmed guy 7 times betrays either a lack of imagination or maybe ignorance about guns or something.
Stereotypes limit imagination.
Are either of those two points incorrect?

What are some of your many whack explanations? And could they be void by the officer just getting in his car and waiting for back up?

[CrossCuT]

Police should all have cams on them at all times to avoid stupid situations like this. 

An unarmed individual does not warrant 7 bullets...especially considering the police have not supplied any concrete evidence to quell the demands for justice.

 

 Non lethal force first. 

[Lilllabettt]

SCENARIO #1:

 

Mr. Brown is walking in the street. Common thing to do in certain neighborhoods, its a strategy to avoid getting jumped. An angry power tripping cop screams at him to get out of the street, even though there is no traffic. He's yelling so loudly that Mr. Brown can't even understand him. The cop rolls down his window and gestures at Mr. Brown to come closer. Mr. Brown knows from watching the treatment of others in his neighborhood that cops can make your life a living hell if you don't do what they say, so he goes over. Once he does the cop pulls him in through the window and begins hitting him. The cop has decided he's going to teach these disrespectful black kids a lesson. They should know their place. Mr. Brown is taken by surprise, but he defends himself. At one point the cop pulls out his gun and it discharges. The moment Mr. Brown can get free he does and he hurries away from his attacker. The cop shoots at him as he escapes, and screams at him to FREEZE. Terrified, Mr. Brown decides to obey. He freezes, puts up his hands, and turns around slowly, so the cop doesn't get jolted. He begs the cop not to shoot him. The cop gets closer to him and smiles. Then he decides to finish the lesson he's been teaching Mr. Brown about where his kind stand on the social totem pole. It's good that his friend and all the other blacks in this neighborhood are here to watch and learn. He looks Mr. Brown right in the eye and pumps the trigger 7 times.

 

SCENARIO #2:

Mr. Brown is walking in the street, laughing with his friend about how easily they stole cigars from a corner store minutes earlier. They are especially amused by the store owner's attempt to stop them. "Big Mike" as he is called, showed him who was boss. His friend strokes his ego: no one tells Mike Brown what to do. They walk down the middle of the street, blocking traffic. They don't care, they're big time. These fools can just wait. A cop rolls down his window and tells them to get on the sidewalks so the cars can pass. At first they pretend not to hear him. The cop repeats himself, louder this time, irritation in his voice. Mr. Brown and his friend exchange a look. Then he stomps over to the car and lunges into the open window, grabbing the cop by the collar, smashing his head into the steering wheel. The cop is taken completely by surprise. The world is a blur and all he can hear is Mr. Brown screaming obscenities into his ear. His face fractures, and he realizes he is losing consciousness.  He reaches for his gun; Mr. Brown grabs his hand, they struggle, and a shot is fired in the car. Mr. Brown gives the cop one last shove and maneuvers his frame out the window. The cop shakes the ringing out of his head and with a horrible groan screams "FREEZE." Mr. Brown laughs and keeps moving. The cop pushes open his car door. He unbuckles his seat belt and falls to the ground. Climbing up on his knees he raises his weapon and shoots into the air, screaming "FREEZE." Mr. Brown hears the shot. He stops, turns around slowly with his hands in the air and a grin on his face. "Oh you're gonna try and shoot me now?" The cop says nothing, blinking the stars out of his eyes and gulping at the 6 foot 4 300 lb man standing 10 yards from him. Mr. Brown sees that he is disoriented, and figures there is no way the cop can hit him. He decides to finish teaching this cop a lesson: No one tells Mike Brown what to do.  Its good that his friend and the whole neighborhood can see it. He looks the cop right in the eye and then charges him at full speed. The cop shoots. Mr. Brown's momentum carries him forward even after the first 4 bullets hit him. He doesn't drop until the cop has reflexively emptied his gun.

 

 

 

 

 

[CrossCuT]

too many words cant read

[Lilllabettt]

 oh give me a break its not mendelian genetics crosscut. its a narrative, i.e., a story. beach type reading. suck it up.