Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Mrs. Bro. Adam

Smoking And Ciggarettes...

Should smoking ciggarettes be illegal?  

118 members have voted

You do not have permission to vote in this poll, or see the poll results. Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

Recommended Posts

Mrs. Bro. Adam
Morph:


I know you don't see everything that goes on in America, but I have seen several petitions going around trying to get the topic of abortion (to outlaw it) being passed around, and we don't see too many of those where I live.

Remember, just because you don't [b]see[/b] something, doens't mean that it's not there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
azaelia
I agree with most of the people who are saying that they should be regulated, not banned. Yes it's bad for you, but so are trans fatty acids and partially hydrogenated oils in food. Burger King is bad for you. Can we ban Burger King? Can we stop using partially hydrogenated oils in food? Not really. Avoid it if you must, but don't full out ban it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
cooltuba
[quote name='Raphael' date='Aug 28 2004, 02:02 PM'] Ideally, I think it should be. Cigarettes are instinsically evil...no good comes from them...there is no situation in which they would help anyone with anything.

Alcohol, by contrast, is not intrinsically evil. Alcohol is enjoyable and jubilant. It does not require addiction to alcohol to enjoy alcohol (for instance, a first time drinker can enjoy it).

My brother is a Libertarian-leaning Republican, which means that he thinks anything should be legal, as long as it doesn't harm others. For instance, he thinks abortion should be illegal.

Now, I am of the opinion that it is the duty of the state to advance all moral things and make all immoral things illegal. While a libertarian would say that cigarettes should be legal, I don't see this because (1) it does hurt others and (2) even if it didn't, it still hurts oneself. Overt and immediate suicide is illegal, why not the slow kind? [/quote]
Intrinsically evil?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! That is a phrase best left for the truly evil things (eg. abortion), please don't apply it to benign things. Cigarettes are perfectly moral for the people who can only smoke occasionally. Tell me the number of people who have smoked too many cigarettes, gotten on the road, and killed themselves and or others because they had smoked too much. Yes, smoking is bad if done habitually, but drinking alcohol has much more potential for abuse, and harm from abuse than cigarettes. If anything should be illegal, it should be alcohol. We know from prohibition that this isn't possible; it would be the same way if you tried to make cigarettes illegal. I won't go into my opinions about the current system of drug controll or the so-called "war on drugs".

As far as the government advancing moral things and making immoral thing illegal, that's not to the greater glory of God. God gave us free will so that we may choose Him over sin. If a government makes all the immoral things illegal, so that we could only do moral things, how would that glorify God? We must be given the choice to do the wrong thing, and choose to do the right thing to really show our love for God. Don't you think that God would have made it impossible for us to do immoral things if he wanted us to have only moral choices? It is in these choices, these choices of good over evil that sanctify us, and you would have them taken away.

--Tim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
geetarplayer
But isn't it easier to become addicted to ciggarettes than to alcohol because of the nicotine? Perhaps I'm wrong on this, but it seems that it's very difficult to only smoke in moderation.

-Mark

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
cooltuba
[quote name='MorphRC' date='Sep 12 2004, 01:35 AM'] THey should be made illegal. Along with alcohol. [/quote]
You are trying to use the govt. to impose your moralistic ideals on the masses. It will not work. This is not an assumption, it's been proven. Morph, I respect you, but your ideas on this particular subject lack sound reasoning. To ban smoking and alcohol simply because there are health risks associated with them would mean that you'd have to ban all things that put your health at risk.

I guess this all boils down to a political issue. I believe that the govt. should be only as imposing as it has to be to guarantee the basic human rights. You believe that the government should be a moral watch-dog for it's people, not just protecting their basic rights, but restricting it's citizenry to what it deems is "good" for them.

Once again, as I stated above, we have to be given the opportunity to choose God over sin, and if the govt. makes all those decisions for us in the form of laws it distracts from the glory of God.

That's about all I have to say on the subject, Morph, if you have any new arguments I'd be happy to discuss more, but I'm finished dissecting your previous arguments.

Peace in Christ,

TIm

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MorphRC
[quote name='cooltuba' date='Sep 13 2004, 03:29 AM'] You are trying to use the govt. to impose your moralistic ideals on the masses. It will not work. This is not an assumption, it's been proven. Morph, I respect you, but your ideas on this particular subject lack sound reasoning. To ban smoking and alcohol simply because there are health risks associated with them would mean that you'd have to ban all things that put your health at risk.

I guess this all boils down to a political issue. I believe that the govt. should be only as imposing as it has to be to guarantee the basic human rights. You believe that the government should be a moral watch-dog for it's people, not just protecting their basic rights, but restricting it's citizenry to what it deems is "good" for them.

Once again, as I stated above, we have to be given the opportunity to choose God over sin, and if the govt. makes all those decisions for us in the form of laws it distracts from the glory of God.

That's about all I have to say on the subject, Morph, if you have any new arguments I'd be happy to discuss more, but I'm finished dissecting your previous arguments.

Peace in Christ,

TIm [/quote]
Let me re-re-read that, I couldnt get passed the first line.


[quote]You are trying to use the govt. to impose your moralistic ideals on the masses. [/quote]

I thought they used us, to impose their 'Moral' ideals. :rolleyes:

Theres no lack in reasoning.

1 Cigs Kill
2 Cigs are drugs
3 Cigs murder
4 Cigs make big bucks while ppl die.

Is there something missing? Like. They dont kill? or something along those lines.

==============
[b]BAN THE BONG[/b]
==============

:lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
cathoholic
Heard all the arguments for and against, and until the Church comes up with something on the subject I shall remain neutral. I don't like smoke though, so if the majority of people decide to ban those things, then I won't be mad but if they don't it makes no difference.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
popestpiusx
Hello again all! Just thought I would chime in on a few things then disappear again for a while.

The whole notion of the government making smoking illegal is absurd. I am mostly with Blazr on this one.

The facts about smoking are not as clear as some on here are suggesting. Not everyone that smokes dies from it. I know many people who have smoked for fifty years and have far exceeded any previous “life expectancy”. Here is a clip from an article entitled “'Oldest' title no big deal to Ohio woman, 114”:
“Dr. Stephen Coles, a UCLA stem cell researcher who is executive director of the Gerontology Research Group, has examined the background of the list's supercentenarians to identify their shared habits. It's been unproductive.
"There's hardly anything these people have in common," Coles said. "It's grasping at straws to try to put a story together, like Sherlock Holmes, of anything these people do in their lives to accomplish these records on the outer limits of longevity. ... All of these people are so extraordinary in longevity, but unextraordinary in every other way."
Obese people do not make the list, but Frenchwoman Calment was a smoker. Some others were heavy drinkers. Some both drink and smoke, and end up outliving the physicians who advise them to stop if they want to live a long and healthy life.”



The second hand smoke thing is loosing credibility. And the suggestion that smoking should be banned in all public places is the most absurd of all. If I own a bar or a restaurant there is no way anyone can justify forcing me to not allow smoking. If people don't want to go, then don't go. If no one wants to go, then I'll go out of business. What is more likely the case is that I will have a pretty solid customer base. In places where smoking in public is banned (like New York City, where you can put up near porn advertisements but cannot smoke in a bar) there are a few courageous bar owners who decided to just pay the fine. They are highly successful. Don't like the smoke, don't go. But don't come in my bar, which I own, and whine about the smoke. I would simply point toward the door. I'm not saying that you should be forced to smell it or sit in it if you don't like it, but you surely cannot tell a person that he cannot allow smoking in his privately owned business.


Furthermore, I know several women who have many children (in one case, 10 children) and smoked through every pregnancy. Not a single problem with any of the births, nor with any of the children. The only reason the medical profession condemns smoking while pregnant is due to statistical evidence, not to actual medical evidence. Why? Because it would be unethical as hell (which is pretty unethical) to do human testing. So they say, better safe than sorry. Their links are due to statistics linking premature births and some defects with women who smoked during the pregnancy. This is hardly proving a connection, but merely establishing a possible link. By the way, and for the record, my wife has never smoked during pregnancy. She believes, as I do, that it is better not to risk it. Better safe than sorry.

Lastly, the medical profession has known about possible connections (which remain merely possible and not guaranteed) for many many years. Over a century at least. For instance, Ulysses Grant’s death from mouth cancer was immediately linked to his cigar smoking. This was in the 1877. Pier Giorgio died in 1925, a smoker. Pope St. Pius X also smoked, as did Blessed Miguel Pro. This is but a small list. All three died in the 20th Cent. Long after the connection was known.

This opposition to smoking is but another hangover from the Puritanism that has so infected the English speaking world. There is no moral, nor any social justification for completely banning smoking. There is much more to say on this (for instance, why a government that has no regard for human life would campaign so stridently against tobacco) but I’ve rambled long enough.

In closing, I will simply say, with Denis Roddy of the Post-Gazette:
"For now, let us grab what idle pleasures we can. So, if you don't mind, I'm going to buy a cigar. And if you do mind, just cough loudly. It'll remind me to light it."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
popestpiusx
This is one of my favorite poems:

Whene'er I take my pipe and stuff it
And smoke to pass the time away
My thoughts, as I sit there and puff it,
Dwell on a picture sad and grey:
It teaches me that very like
Am I myself unto my pipe.

Like me this pipe, so fragrant burning,
Is made of naught but earthen clay;
To earth I too shall be returning,
And cannot halt my slow decay.
My well used pipe, now cracked and broken,
Of mortal life is but a token.

No stain, the pipe's hue yet doth darken;
It remains white. Thus do I know
That when to death's call I must harken
My body, too, all pale will grow.
To black beneath the sod 'twill turn,
Likewise the pipe, if oft it burn.

Or when the pipe is fairly glowing,
Behold then instantaneously,
The smoke off into thin air going,'
Til naught but ash is left to see.
Man's fame likewise away will burn
And unto dust his body turn.

How oft it happens when one's smoking,T
he tamper's missing from it's shelf,
And one goes with one's finger poking
Into the bowl and burns oneself.
If in the pipe such pain doth dwell
How hot must be the pains of Hell!

Thus o'er my pipe in contemplation
Of such things - I can constantly
Indulge in fruitful meditation,
And so, puffing contentedly,
On land, at sea, at home, abroad,
I smoke my pipe and worship God.

Johann Sebastian Bach - 1725 (1685-1750)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
DemonSlayer
Yes it should be illegal, at least it should be banned in public or around babies, young children and pregant women, etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
CreepyCrawler
Smoking stinks and I would never smoke. But it cannot be made illegal logistically and logically. Just because something is bad for your health does not mean that it should be banned. Trans-fatty acids are SO HORRIBLY AWFUL FOR YOUR HEALTH but they are found in nearly all junk food and PEANUT BUTTER and it doesn't look like they're gonna be illegal ever. And what about coffee? It has caffeine which is highly addictive and is not good for your health but that's not illegal either. People need to be educated to make good choices but you can't make everything illegal b/c people won't even know why they're not doing it in the first place. I agree w/ Kilroy that there needs to be tougher regulations on what goes into cigarettes and I think that smoking in enclosed areas needs to be regulated, too. But I don't think that smoking is a mortal sin. It's smelly and bad for you, but not a sin.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
popestpiusx
[quote name='DemonSlayer' date='Sep 20 2004, 09:59 PM'] Yes it should be illegal, at least it should be banned in public or around babies, young children and pregant women, etc. [/quote]
Read my statement above on banning smoking in public places.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
RandomProddy
[quote name='MorphRC' date='Aug 28 2004, 06:49 PM'] Yes they should. And they should be deemed a mortal sin, since they are a drug. [/quote]

Jesus drank wine. Besides, if you banned all alcohol, how would you have Mass? Edited by RandomProddy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×