Jesus_lol Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 i think the only reason cigarettes(the bought kind, with horrible things in them) arent illegal is because of all the tax revenue the government gets from it. If the put 1/10 of the carcinogens/additives that are in cigarettes into ketchup, ketchup would either be illegal or taxed heavily within the week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PizzaSandwhich Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 As a smoker myself my bias is obivious, however even before I started smoking I never really saw any real reason to outlaw cigarettes. Sure they're unhealthy, but so is fast food, pizza, and in the quanities that most people around me drink, alcholol. People should be able to make their own descions about their health without the government interfereing in my view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zunshynn Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 [quote name='PizzaSandwhich' date='04 December 2009 - 07:56 PM' timestamp='1259981781' post='2014640'] As a smoker myself my bias is obivious, however even before I started smoking I never really saw any real reason to outlaw cigarettes. Sure they're unhealthy, but so is fast food, pizza, and in the quanities that most people around me drink, alcholol. People should be able to make their own descions about their health without the government interfereing in my view. [/quote] Someone eating fast food does not harm anyone else, smoking does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PizzaSandwhich Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 Second hand smoking is largely an overreported phenomen, and don't bother digging up FDA studies "proving" otherwise. I lost all faith in them when they suddenly switched the food pyarmid to conform to the Atkins diet when it became a fad. Yeah, they sell out to the highest bidder on these sort of things. Basically, unless you live in a house saturated with cigarette smoke, there is no evidence that second hand smoke harms anyone. You're not going to get lung cancer because 20 years from now because you sat next to a someone smoking a cigarette for five minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PizzaSandwhich Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 Oh, and alcholol destroys a lot of lives, and not just the ones of those who consume it. Yet no one seems to want to outlaw [i]that[/i] anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zunshynn Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 (edited) [quote name='PizzaSandwhich' date='04 December 2009 - 08:08 PM' timestamp='1259982522' post='2014653'] Second hand smoking is largely an overreported phenomen, and don't bother digging up FDA studies "proving" otherwise. I lost all faith in them when they suddenly switched the food pyarmid to conform to the Atkins diet when it became a fad. Yeah, they sell out to the highest bidder on these sort of things. Basically, unless you live in a house saturated with cigarette smoke, there is no evidence that second hand smoke harms anyone. You're not going to get lung cancer because 20 years from now because you sat next to a someone smoking a cigarette for five minutes. [/quote] My opinion on the subject is formulated largely based on experience rather than FDA studies, although many groups besides the FDA have done the same studies and shown the same results. My dad was a smoker, and although he didn't smoke in the house, I do have asthma induced by secondhand smoke. And I know that it is due to the smoke because I did not have it until after he started smoking again. Was it enough that I'll get lung cancer or emphysema? Maybe/probably not. But I still have other health problems due to that. Why should I (or anyone else) have to feel sick in a public place because you want to smoke? I don't necessarily think that smoking should be illegal. But I do think it should be more restricted in public places, and I also think it should be taxed much more heavily than it is, especially depending on what passes regarding the new healthcare reform. Smoking does cause a lot of known health problems, and even if those people don't care that it's unhealthy, than that's fine, but they, not other taxpayers, should be footing the bill for their healthcare. But I agree, junk food is the same way. But I also think junk food should be taxed more. And aside from that, Edited December 5, 2009 by zunshynn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lounge Daddy Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 [quote name='PizzaSandwhich' date='04 December 2009 - 10:08 PM' timestamp='1259982522' post='2014653'] Second hand smoking is largely an overreported phenomen, and don't bother digging up FDA studies "proving" otherwise. I lost all faith in them when they suddenly switched the food pyarmid to conform to the Atkins diet when it became a fad. Yeah, they sell out to the highest bidder on these sort of things. Basically, unless you live in a house saturated with cigarette smoke, there is no evidence that second hand smoke harms anyone. You're not going to get lung cancer because 20 years from now because you sat next to a someone smoking a cigarette for five minutes. [/quote] Couldn't agree more. Much of what the State does is arbitrary. And governments are pretty good at stacking numbers for the exclusive benefit of the Political Class. When the politicians want to demonize tobacco manufactures to score points, they stack the numbers to "prove" second hand smoke kills people. When the politicians want further control of the health care in this country, but they worry they are losing the public's support on it ... they stack the numbers for a flu, the president declares a national emergency, and they will congratulate themselves on defending us from H1N1 and hope we all agree that we "need" a great big expensive Federal State. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcts Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 I don't think that they should be illegal as long as you don't do it in public. My right to fresh air trumps smokers right to smoke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zunshynn Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 [quote name='mcts' date='04 December 2009 - 09:59 PM' timestamp='1259989173' post='2014754'] I don't think that they should be illegal as long as you don't do it in public. My right to fresh air trumps smokers right to smoke. [/quote] That is a more succinct statement of my position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philothea Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 [quote name='mcts' date='04 December 2009 - 11:59 PM' timestamp='1259989173' post='2014754'] I don't think that they should be illegal as long as you don't do it in public. My right to fresh air trumps smokers right to smoke. [/quote] What about women who smoke when pregnant, or parents who smoke in the home? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ardillacid Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 [quote name='PizzaSandwhich' date='04 December 2009 - 10:08 PM' timestamp='1259982522' post='2014653'] Second hand smoking is largely an overreported phenomen, and don't bother digging up FDA studies "proving" otherwise. I lost all faith in them when they suddenly switched the food pyarmid to conform to the Atkins diet when it became a fad. Yeah, they sell out to the highest bidder on these sort of things. Basically, unless you live in a house saturated with cigarette smoke, there is no evidence that second hand smoke harms anyone. You're not going to get lung cancer because 20 years from now because you sat next to a someone smoking a cigarette for five minutes. [/quote] [quote name='PizzaSandwhich' date='04 December 2009 - 10:10 PM' timestamp='1259982620' post='2014657'] Oh, and alcholol destroys a lot of lives, and not just the ones of those who consume it. Yet no one seems to want to outlaw [i]that[/i] anymore. [/quote] I think I like you. Let's say you smoke and you get lung cancer. It 100% is attributed to smoking. Let's say you don't smoke and you get lung cancer. If you have ever been around a smoker, then it's second hand smoke that caused it. Let's say you don't smoke or never have been around anyone who smoked and you still get lung cancer. It's the radon levels in the ground due to the nuclear power plant that caused it. I do not buy all of it. You can't tell me that lung cancer never happened before smoking. What a load of poo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alleros Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 Interesting thread.... Here in Ireland, you cannot smoke in a restaurant or other public place. By law.. the pub owners obejcted strongly claiming it would reduce takings.... but they quietened down when the health of their employees, freed from passive smoking, improved dramatically. As someone badly allergic to cigarette smoke, life became much easier for me. Now in an attempt to cut down on underage smoking, cigarettes cannot be displayed in shops; they are in a lock up box way behind the tills. Invisible behind metal doors and only the checkout folk can dispense them. Cannot be bought unless identity/age proved. Incidentally, do not the Amish rely for their income largely on growing tobacco? But then the Carthusians earn a fortune from making and selling booze... NB also; there are more diseases than lung cancer cause or exacerbated by smoking; all circulatory problems come under this category. The Irish are great smokers and suffer for it as they do from alcoholism. Both have a huge potential for addiction and that is the problem. And both cause massive damage to many. Just thoughts from Ireland.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lounge Daddy Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 [quote name='philothea' date='05 December 2009 - 12:52 AM' timestamp='1259992374' post='2014834'] What about women who smoke when pregnant, or parents who smoke in the home? [/quote] And I didn't realize there was a "right" to fresh air. Better make strong cologne and body odor illegal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ardillacid Posted December 6, 2009 Share Posted December 6, 2009 [quote name='zunshynn' date='04 December 2009 - 09:58 PM' timestamp='1259981938' post='2014644'] Someone eating fast food does not harm anyone else, smoking does. [/quote] Actually they are harming any of their descendants. Therefore fast food needs to be banned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laudate_Dominum Posted December 6, 2009 Share Posted December 6, 2009 [IMG]http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h119/NoonienSoong_2006/smoking-ban.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h119/NoonienSoong_2006/smoggy.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h119/NoonienSoong_2006/Smokingbansmokingcartoon.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h119/NoonienSoong_2006/restaurant-smoking-ban.jpg[/IMG] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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