World Council of Churches

[Snowcatpa]

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There was an article in the paper today talking about how the World Council of Churches wants to move beyond the rift they have with the Roman Catholic Church over mutual recognition in order to improve ties. While the Pope was all for unity and everything, stressing healing the rift with the Orthodox Church, we aren't a member of the World Council of Churches, which has Christian dominations from Protestant to Orthodox.

I was just wondering the reason why? Is it because the Catholic view is that the "unity" they're searching for in Christian denominations is in the "one, holy, Catholic and apolostalic Church"? Do we recognize them as "ecclesiastical communities" not "full chuches" because there is only one "full church" or one "church" for that matter, that's Christ Church, the Catholic Church? What's the reason?[/color]

[Cam42]

One of the reasons that we are not members is that we believe that we are the only true Church.

While we recognize the various denominations, Christianity is ultimately Catholic. It is ultimately Roman. All of the original churches were under the auspice of Rome and Peter.

To acknowledge and join an organiazation like the World Council of Churches, we would be conceding that we are merely part of a greater Christianity. Something that is greater than the Church. There is nothing.

The Catechism teaches:
[quote]The word "catholic" means "universal," in the sense of "according to the totality" or "in keeping with the whole." The Church is catholic in a double sense:

First, the Church is catholic because Christ is present in her. "Where there is Christ Jesus, there is the Catholic Church." In her subsists the fullness of Christ's body united with its head; this implies that she receives from him "the fullness of the means of salvation" which he has willed: correct and complete confession of faith, full sacramental life, and ordained ministry in apostolic succession. The Church was, in this fundamental sense, catholic on the day of Pentecost and will always be so until the day of the Parousia. (CCC 830)[/quote]

[quote]Secondly, the Church is catholic because she has been sent out by Christ on a mission to the whole of the human race:

All men are called to belong to the new People of God. This People, therefore, while remaining one and only one, is to be spread throughout the whole world and to all ages in order that the design of God's will may be fulfilled: he made human nature one in the beginning and has decreed that all his children who were scattered should be finally gathered together as one. . . . The character of universality which adorns the People of God is a gift from the Lord himself whereby the Catholic Church ceaselessly and efficaciously seeks for the return of all humanity and all its goods, under Christ the Head in the unity of his Spirit. (CCC 831)[/quote]

[quote]"All men are called to this catholic unity of the People of God. . . . And to it, in different ways, belong or are ordered: the Catholic faithful, others who believe in Christ, and finally all mankind, called by God's grace to salvation." (CCC 836)[/quote]

And finally:

[quote]"Let us be very careful not to conceive of the universal Church as the simple sum, or . . . the more or less anomalous federation of essentially different particular churches. In the mind of the Lord the Church is universal by vocation and mission, but when she put down her roots in a variety of cultural, social, and human terrains, she takes on different external expressions and appearances in each part of the world." The rich variety of ecclesiastical disciplines, liturgical rites, and theological and spiritual heritages proper to the local churches "unified in a common effort, shows all the more resplendently the catholicity of the undivided Church." (CCC 835)[/quote]

This is why.

[Jaime]

Plus the entry fee was like $375!! I mean C'mon!!!

[IXpenguin21]

I have never heared of this council, but i can make some educated guesses...

1) The council was established primarilly to give identity to the thousands of Christian denominations. The Catholic Church has it's identity.

2) Vatican II's writings on eccumenism advise that Catholics do not have an openness to other faiths while ignoring the differences between the two. This false irenicism leads to omission of pieces of the Catholic faith for the sake of opennes and unity between very different faiths.

Other faiths NEED to be united with each other in order to survive the test of time. The facade that it is a "World Council of Churches" in the sense that they are working to make many churches in line with one common goal is not what the Catholic church would want to be a part of. Rome doesn't need the concent or aid of any other Christian church to last on this Earth.

Other faiths tend to come together because none of them posess the full understanding of God, salvation, or the individual mission of humanity. Together they can pick up more pieces of the picture. Only the Catholic church has the full understanding of God. It doesn't need to be a part of any council made up of other faiths.


Whether or not the Church is in the council, it doesn't change Her desire for one faith. I feel that She doesn't believe that being a part of this council would be of much importance.

[dUSt]

The Catholic Church joining the World Council of Churches would be like the NFL joining the Arena Football League.

[Guest Eremite]

I'm not sure why the Holy See has not joined the WCC. From its website description of itself, it does not seem to be a relativistic confederation. It specifically fosters the necessity of "debate". I'm not sure if maybe there are other, unofficial factors at play.

Perhaps the Church will join in the future. For example, full diplomatic relations between the Holy See and the United States were not established until 1984. But the Holy See certainly interacted with and commended much of what America did long before that.

[Technicoid]

[quote name='IXpenguin21' date='Jun 17 2005, 08:34 AM']I have never heared of this council, but i can make some educated guesses...

1) The council was established primarilly to give identity to the thousands of Christian denominations.  The Catholic Church has it's identity.

2)  Vatican II's writings on eccumenism advise that Catholics do not have an openness to other faiths while ignoring the differences between the two.  This false irenicism leads to omission of pieces of the Catholic faith for the sake of opennes and unity between very different faiths.[/quote]

I'd say those are pretty good guesses. Pius XI also write an encyclical about the time when the Worls Council of Churches came about. I'm not certain, but I think it was a direct response to it.

[url="http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/pius_xi/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-xi_enc_19280106_mortalium-animos_en.html"]Mortalium Animos[/url]

[Apotheoun]

The one Church of Christ subsists in the Catholic Church, and so she is not one denomination among many. Thus, joining the World Council of Churches would be theologically problematic, because the unity of the Church remains intact in spite of the schismatical acts of some groups of Christians.

[Q the Ninja]

That phrase sounds oddly familiar...Vatican II?

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='Q the Ninja' date='Jun 17 2005, 08:28 AM']That phrase sounds oddly familiar...Vatican II? 
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Yes, it's the teaching of Vatican II (cf., the Dogmatic Constitution [u]Lumen Gentium[/u], ch. 1, no. 8; and the Decree [u]Unitatis Redintegratio[/u], ch. 1, no. 4).

[Guest Eremite]

[quote]joining the World Council of Churches would be theologically problematic, because the unity of the Church remains intact in spite of the schismatical acts of some groups of Christians.[/quote]

But, as far as I can tell, the WCC does not consider itself a "denomination". It is simply a fraternal alliance of Churches, to foster charity, unity, and discussion between one another. The Catholic Church already does this, of course, but without a formal alliance.

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='Eremite' date='Jun 17 2005, 08:47 AM']But, as far as I can tell, the WCC does not consider itself a "denomination". It is simply a fraternal alliance of Churches, to foster charity, unity, and discussion between one another. The Catholic Church already does this, of course, but without a formal alliance.
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I understand the nature of the WCC, but my point stands. The Catholic Church is not [b]a[/b] Church among Churches; rather, as the one subsistence of the Church, she is [b]the[/b] Church. The WCC is composed of "denominations," and so the ecclesiology underlying that organization is non-Catholic.

[Guest Eremite]

Apotheoun,

For what I can gleam from their website, there is no ecclesiology behind the WCC. It's just a group of Churches who committ themselves to fraternal action. If, for example, each participant were considered a "particular Church" in some new, universal WCC, that would be different. But it's just a useful organization of willing participants in dialogue. There is no imagined unity in the council itself; the members of the council simply pledge themselves to seeking unity with the other members.

The Church already does what the WCC does; she just hasn't joined their group. Why is unclear. It may be for political reasons (I don't think the Holy See is a member of the UN either, even though she is closely allied with it).

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='hot stuff' date='Jun 17 2005, 09:28 AM']Plus the entry fee was like $375!!  I mean C'mon!!!
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[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Eremite' date='Jun 17 2005, 05:34 PM']Apotheoun,

For what I can gleam from their website, there is no ecclesiology behind the WCC. It's just a group of Churches who committ themselves to fraternal action. If, for example, each participant were considered a "particular Church" in some new, universal WCC, that would be different. But it's just a useful organization of willing participants in dialogue. There is no imagined unity in the council itself; the members of the council simply pledge themselves to seeking unity with the other members.

The Church already does what the WCC does; she just hasn't joined their group. Why is unclear. It may be for political reasons (I don't think the Holy See is a member of the UN either, even though she is closely allied with it).
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First of all thre is only one Church -us. The only other groups that could be called churches are the orthodox or anglicans. The other groups are more properly called eclesial communities. So it is really not a world council of churches, simply various denominations working together. We do that thru our own agencies already.