Gemma Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 [url="http://cloisters.bravejournal.com/"]http://cloisters.bravejournal.com/[/url] Blessings, Gemma Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiscerningSoul Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 You will be in my prayers. Keep up the good work. Blessings always, Jessica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EWIE Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 [b]Dear Gemma, Please know that this question is asked with sincerity and a desire to understand. I don't understand who you are or how you are founding all these new Orders and with so many varied charisms, not to mention the green and yellow and all variety of habits? With the ancient and traditional communities at a low in membership, is it right to be draining the resovoir, so to speak? Do people who sign up with you know of the instability of the foundations. My apology in advance if I have offended anyone, especially Gemma.[/b] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roseoftherese Posted May 24, 2008 Share Posted May 24, 2008 [quote name='Gemma' post='1538974' date='May 23 2008, 02:00 PM'][url="http://cloisters.bravejournal.com/"]http://cloisters.bravejournal.com/[/url] Blessings, Gemma[/quote] That's awesome, Gemma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EWIE Posted May 24, 2008 Share Posted May 24, 2008 [quote name='nunsense' date='May 23 2008, 07:49 PM' post='1539357'] Whatever the final outcome of Gemma's foundations, the Lord still receives glory and honor and praise through her efforts. For this reason alone, she deserves our love and support and prayers. With this, I certainly agree, however not everyone who comes here for help with discernment, has the maturity, experience or background that you have. Just read some of the ages in the profiles. They obviously can be influenced by a green and yellow habit more so than the truth and the spirit of the words "I must decrease, He must increase." As I pointed out. I am not pointing a finger at Gemma, I would like to understand where she is coming from. I know Gemma has a family and there [u]are[/u][b][/b] only 24 hours in a day. I pray SHE responds to my question. I don't need any more defensive answers on her behalf. I would like to undersand HER, better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemma Posted May 24, 2008 Author Share Posted May 24, 2008 [quote name='EWIE' post='1539195' date='May 23 2008, 07:08 PM'][b]Dear Gemma, Please know that this question is asked with sincerity and a desire to understand. I don't understand who you are or how you are founding all these new Orders and with so many varied charisms, not to mention the green and yellow and all variety of habits? With the ancient and traditional communities at a low in membership, is it right to be draining the resovoir, so to speak? Do people who sign up with you know of the instability of the foundations. My apology in advance if I have offended anyone, especially Gemma.[/b][/quote] In the 20 or so years that I've been working with vocations, I know from experience that God calls vocations to those communities who are living their rule. In the monastic life, the vocation is called to not just one charism, but to a particular monastery within that charism. The Cloisterite charism has been with me for many years. The foundation cannot and will not interfere with my family life. Both boys are in public school, and hubby is a graduate student. I have a lot of time on my hands, and I spend it with God. The variety of charisms are to meet the needs of today's world. The habit colors are in response to people complaining about black. The colors are significant in the church's color scheme. I just last week had a pic of a peach habit on the "religious habit" yahoo group I have. [url="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/thereligioushabit/"]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/thereligioushabit/[/url] It belonged to the Little Souls Sisters in the Philippines. I also downloaded to "founders and friends" (another yahoo group I own) some green and orange habit pix, respectively. Yellow and white are papal colors, and are considered Heaven's own colors. Green is the color of hope and is included in the church's color scheme. There are a couple of other orders I know of who wear green. The Pink Sisters wear pink. The Religious of the Assumption wear purple, as do the new community, the Children of Mary. Someone in Rome saw a sister in an all yellow habit. Hope this answers your questions. I am on vacation until sometime Monday. I will be able to read emails at my foundress2003@yahoo.com address, but will not be able to respond. Blessings, Gemma Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemma Posted May 24, 2008 Author Share Posted May 24, 2008 [quote name='nunsense' post='1539357' date='May 23 2008, 09:49 PM']I have to admit that when I first came on phatmass and heard about Gemma's foundations, I was surprised at what she was doing, and perhaps even a little critical. But only God knows what He is asking of her and why, and only she knows if she is truly responding to His call for her. So I think that the best thing any of us can do for each other is to be loving and supportive. I recently met with a priest who is a figure of some authority. He was very negative, not only about my own vocation, but also about the the idea of new communities in general, telling me that they usually didn't last very long. At the time I felt very depressed, and wrote to Rosalind Moss about it. This was her response... [i] "Concerning the longevity of new religious communities, my understanding is that the average community lasts fifty years. That results in thousands of new communities that are no longer in existence. Our Lord is able to keep those He wishes. And I would guess that all others—the majority—though no longer in existence, did a wonderful work within their culture and time. Mother Teresa loved to say that our Lord is not concerned with numbers (perhaps we could safely add, longevity), but with our faithfulness. The rest is up to God." [/i] And as for "draining the reservoir" of applicants - I don't think this really applies. The Lord calls who He wills, to whichever community He wills. Witness my own call to Rosalind Moss' community, when I was convinced that I had a vocation to be more of a hermit! The Lord works in mysterious ways. Whatever the final outcome of Gemma's foundations, the Lord still receives glory and honor and praise through her efforts. For this reason alone, she deserves our love and support and prayers. "Gemma, you go girl!" [/quote] Thanks for the defense. Know that you and your future sisters--and foundress, of course--are in my prayers. Blessings, Gemma Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cathoholic_anonymous Posted May 24, 2008 Share Posted May 24, 2008 I agree with Annie, but I understand Ewie's concern. It would be easy for some of the younger members of Phatmass (myself included) to hear all this talk of founders and foundations and start dreaming of creating a new community, as if it is like assembling a doll's house and kitting the dolls out in special clothes. Making a foundation - even one foundation - is not a part of most people's calling, and yet sometimes on Phatmass it is made to seem very common. That could be dangerous to those of us who are not so far along on our way. I have had to struggle, really struggle, to accept my call to Carmel - even though I rejoice over it at the same time. The reason why I struggle is because of the other gifts that God has given me. It is enough to turn your head, as the saying goes - especially when your priest is telling you that you have too many talents to be a cloistered nun and you are needed in the world. Yes, I have so much in the world that I am very good at and that I love. The fantasy of founding a religious community to do work that interests me, that I consider necessary, that would allow me to do a host of other fascinating things - that has played around in my brain a few times. I have had to resolutely push it away. Luckily I had the guidance and support of a very gentle and wise spiritual director in doing this. But I know how easy it is to get intoxicated by the desire to be a founder or a foundress, and I also know how few are called to it. It's easy to be deceived, and sometimes I fear that there are younger people on PM who may get caught up in the fantasy - which, because it's holy and about God, can't possibly be wrong. Or can it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EWIE Posted May 24, 2008 Share Posted May 24, 2008 [quote name='nunsense' post='1539983' date='May 24 2008, 10:40 AM']I just wonder what would have happened if the Apostles had stopped to consider every possible obstacle and disadvantage to spreading the gospel - they might never have left home! [/quote] No one can 'shorten Gods arm", not even the apostles. I think you have either missed the point of the "topic" are on a differant page than the original post, or you simply had something of your own to say. Not very much of your "reply related to the question". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cathoholic_anonymous Posted May 24, 2008 Share Posted May 24, 2008 [quote name='nunsense' post='1539983' date='May 24 2008, 05:40 PM']Well, I will probably get shot down for saying this, but I don't think we suffer from an excess of intoxication for God in this day and age. In fact, I think we could do with a lot more people who are "geniuses for God". Becoming a foundress, as I am sure Gemma can attest, is not something that will happen overnight. So even if some young person (or older person for that matter), gets "carried away" by the "fantasy" of doing something big for God, the harsh reality is that there are enough authorities and discouragements along the way to deter all but the very faint hearted from persevering to the very end in their venture. But does that make their efforts any less meaningful or bring any less glory to God? Personally, I don't think so.[/quote] I didn't say that it was a bad idea to get 'intoxicated for God'. I wrote that it was a bad idea to get intoxicated by a fantasy. I also believe that we are all called to do something 'big' for God, and that founding a new community is no bigger (or smaller) than living out your days as a humdrum housewife in a humdrum suburb where hardly anybody knows who you are. It is just that most of us have a tendency to assume that the more romantic and exotic an idea, the more genuine and pleasing to God it must be. It's a natural mistake to make, and a ditch that everybody ought to fall into at least once. There's good experience in it. But if you stay there for too long it gets easy to neglect your very real calling for the sake of the exotic calling that you wish you had. While it is true that the discouragements and trials of making a foundation might put off those who don't really have that vocation, it is also true that they might just inculcate greater stubbornness in people who are mulish enough to begin with, distracting them from the truth of their vocations. I know a lady who fits this last category. She's lovely and funny and kind - but she's also convinced that she is called to found a religious community, and that anybody who objects to the idea is 'persecuting' her. She gets quite aggressive over the issue. She has had a habit made for herself and goes out in the streets in it, introducing herself as a member of a community that doesn't actually exist. The bishop has very gently requested her to stop doing this, and our local priest (who is kindness itself) has also tried his best to temper her excitement a little. I like and respect her a great deal, but I am perturbed by her obsession with making foundation. Of course, it's possible that she is a genuine 'fool for God' and what I call fantasies are really divine inspirations that are beyond my comprehension. I try to remain open to that possibility. But I refuse to 'take the community into my thinking', as she keeps urging me to do, because I won't allow emotional responses to an interesting idea to be my compass-needle. Being an impulsive person by nature, I have to be very careful not to let impulses and emotions govern me - which is why I am quite suspicious of them in other people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EWIE Posted May 24, 2008 Share Posted May 24, 2008 [quote name='Gemma' date='May 23 2008, 10:29 PM' post='1539536'] Hope this answers your questions. Dear Gemma, Thank you for taking the time to answer my questions and sending the addy of your 'journal". I understand so much better. I would not hesitate now to send either applicants or benefactors your way. Thank you for hearing the invitation of the Holy Spirit, responding to His Call with such enthusiasm, and continually attempting to maintain your work within the parameters of the Magesterium. Not a pleasant walk in the park, no matter how you look at it. Begging your prayers, Offering mine, Ewie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cathoholic_anonymous Posted May 24, 2008 Share Posted May 24, 2008 P.S. This doesn't mean that I am opposed to all new foundations. As I wrote in my first post, I know that some people are called to make them. I just believe that such people are rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlesister Posted May 24, 2008 Share Posted May 24, 2008 All this brings to mind the "Gamaliel Principle" that was drilled into us in school - quite a ways back the road now, by the way : "If it is of God, it will last. If it is not...it won't." Blest are those who have the courage to believe that it is and risk finding out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Therese Posted May 25, 2008 Share Posted May 25, 2008 [quote name='littlesister' post='1540722' date='May 24 2008, 07:19 PM']All this brings to mind the "Gamaliel Principle" that was drilled into us in school - quite a ways back the road now, by the way : "If it is of God, it will last. If it is not...it won't." Blest are those who have the courage to believe that it is and risk finding out.[/quote] Amen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Therese Posted May 25, 2008 Share Posted May 25, 2008 (edited) [img]http://photos-381.ll.facebook.com/photos-ll-sf2p/v253/198/77/1018492381/a1018492381_30074607_3197.jpg[/img] I think this is the peach habit that Gemma was speaking of... Edited May 25, 2008 by Saint Therese Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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