goldenchild17 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 reason and faith don't contradict each other, but that doesn't mean that evolution is reasonable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 [quote name='goldenchild17' post='1659423' date='Sep 19 2008, 05:05 PM']reason and faith don't contradict each other, but that doesn't mean that evolution is reasonable[/quote] It doesn't mean evolution [b]has to be[/b] reasonable. Personally, I don't see any reason why it cannot be though. Like I said, by the way, I know that there are still some aspects that the scientific community readily admits are not explained yet, and I know some theories get into some grey areas with faith, so I won't say a word about them for the time being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terra Pax Posted September 19, 2008 Author Share Posted September 19, 2008 [quote name='goldenchild17' post='1659423' date='Sep 19 2008, 06:05 PM']reason and faith don't contradict each other, but that doesn't mean that evolution is reasonable[/quote] the problem with that is that this isnt just some idea that was thrown from the sky. you cant just look at an overview and say "oh, this doesnt look reasonable. isnt true." it's a scientific theory with all the evidence and backing of any other scientific theory. you have to have a certain understanding of it to make those kinds of judgments. I have no idea what kind of scientific background you have, so i wont assume, but in many cases, simple lay people are making judgments about things where they have no place to make judgments. i for one find no contradiction in what the church says is compatible between evolution and the faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenchild17 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 I don't make any statements based on my own knowledge of science, just as I don't make any judgments on doctrine based on my own authority. I believe what I believe about faith because I place my trust in those who are more than competent to speak on such issues. In the same way I believe what I believe about science because I place my trust in those who are fully capable of speaking on scientific matters. I don't have to understand it all. But I can speak on what I do know, just as I don't fully understand the Trinity, but I can tell people what I know about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 [quote name='goldenchild17' post='1659444' date='Sep 19 2008, 05:30 PM']I don't make any statements based on my own knowledge of science, just as I don't make any judgments on doctrine based on my own authority. I believe what I believe about faith because I place my trust in those who are more than competent to speak on such issues. In the same way I believe what I believe about science because I place my trust in those who are fully capable of speaking on scientific matters. I don't have to understand it all. But I can speak on what I do know, just as I don't fully understand the Trinity, but I can tell people what I know about it.[/quote] That's funny, because it appears like someone who truly is an authority said something rather (dare I include this particular word usage?) radically different from you? ...but of course, you "don't rep pope." Pax. I'm just teasing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenchild17 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 . yeah fortunately for me, I don't consider that too be much of an authority Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 [quote name='goldenchild17' post='1659486' date='Sep 19 2008, 06:27 PM']. yeah fortunately for me, I don't consider that too be much of an authority [/quote] Too bad. It's such a nice way to solve arguments. For future clarification, what do you believe is authority? Are you the sort of guy that believes that apostolic succession was illegitimate after 'x' point, or along those lines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenchild17 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 (edited) Apostolic succession is still perfectly valid and will be until the end of time. God promised as much. I just believe that certain men have hijacked (for lack of a better word) the seat of Peter. Certain men have taken control of a position that is not theirs to take. Order will be restored at some point, we just have to patiently wait it out until that time comes, and just rely on what has been authoritatively taught by the Church. My authority is the Catholic Church as it has been up until the 1950's. Edited September 19, 2008 by goldenchild17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 [quote name='goldenchild17' post='1659526' date='Sep 19 2008, 06:47 PM']Apostolic succession is still perfectly valid and will be until the end of time. God promised as much. I just believe that certain men have hijacked (for lack of a better word) the seat of Peter. Certain men have taken control of a position that is not theirs to take. Order will be restored at some point, we just have to patiently wait it out until that time comes, and just rely on what has been authoritatively taught by the Church. My authority is the Catholic Church as it has been up until the 1950's.[/quote] So... maybe you can help me out? What is it that causes you to reject the authority of the current pope? I'm really not up to date on any of those arguments; I just never hear them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenchild17 Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 (edited) dUST doesn't want people to have those discussions on phatmass. Plus, we probably shouldn't let this topic get off topic any further. If you do want to talk a little more then I'd definitely be up for it. If you want you can email me: fryc86ATyahooDOTcom Edited September 20, 2008 by goldenchild17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 [quote name='goldenchild17' post='1659567' date='Sep 19 2008, 07:24 PM']dUST doesn't want people to have those discussions on phatmass. Plus, we probably shouldn't let this topic get off topic any further. If you do want to talk a little more then I'd definitely be up for it. If you want you can email me: fryc86ATyahooDOTcom[/quote] Sorry, I should have realized that. I might send off a little email. Don't expect me to try to debate though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenchild17 Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 eh no problem, I'm not really into formal debate lately anyways. but anybody that just wants to talk is always welcome. I got your message. I'll get back to you today sometime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 [quote name='goldenchild17' post='1659576' date='Sep 19 2008, 07:34 PM']eh no problem, I'm not really into formal debate lately anyways. but anybody that just wants to talk is always welcome. I got your message. I'll get back to you today sometime.[/quote] Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princessgianna Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 [quote name='Majella' post='1658737' date='Sep 18 2008, 09:58 PM']I don't believe Creationism and evolution are compatible! The "Big Bang"; Humans evolving from apes; etc? The modernists in the Church are still active!!!![/quote] but we do need to see what science as to offer with an open mind! to better understand how we got here AS LONG AS IT BEGINS WITH GOD of course!! pax~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightofChrist Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 [quote name='princessgianna' post='1660091' date='Sep 20 2008, 12:09 PM']but we do need to see what science as to offer with an open mind! to better understand how we got here AS LONG AS IT BEGINS WITH GOD of course!! pax~[/quote] Speaking of beginnings Charles Darwin's theory of Evolution was built on atheistic ideals, which is why the Church gave him such a cold shoulder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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