Fannie_mac

[Justin86]

[quote name='lilCook009' post='1675402' date='Oct 12 2008, 01:00 PM']Have you ever applied for a loan on a house there are hundreds of pages of leagal jargon, at some point you have to trust you loan officer.[/quote]
At the end of the day, no matter how pages of "legal jaragon" lenders try to put in their contracts there is always a monthly installment that they cannot cover up. Either you have the money for it or you don't.

And are there really hundreds of pages? Somehow I doubt that.

Edited October 12, 2008 by Justin86

[Hassan]

[quote name='T-Bone _' post='1675410' date='Oct 11 2008, 11:05 PM']Praytell, how on earth does making someone rent instead of me buying them a house keep me employed?[/quote]

If it helps prevent a credit freeze it will help your employer have the access to credit he/she needs to pay you for whatever it is that you do.

It looks like the bail out is being switched to the British model which injects the capital more directly into the banks, which will be much better.


[quote]He's not paying his debts, ergo, he's a deadbeat.[/quote]

the term generally implies something beyond an inability to pay one's debts.

So no, he is not a deadbeat.



[quote]So you admit we need to spend more money than average on our milita[/quote]

No.

[quote]Thank you. (I guess that invalidates your point there though.)[/quote]

And no.

[philothea]

[quote name='Justin86' post='1675356' date='Oct 11 2008, 11:19 PM']As do I. However, there is nothing more socialistic then the idea that the government should own big business, and and constantly throw money at them every time they are about to fail. It's not going to work. We're going to just keep giving them tax dollars until we, the middle class, work just to support their corrupt practices. It's an absurd idea, and that is why the vast majority are adamantly against it.


Two things I fail to understand about your logic: You agree that you want responsibility in our laws, however you favor the bailout? How is rewarding corrupt corporations for their behavior at all being responsible? As for attaching my faith to this I fail to see how that is immature. I plainly explained how this is the direct result of our greed, and that's definitely not a Christian principal.[/quote]

*siiiiigh*

It's not a bailout (at least, not yet) and no one is getting paid off or getting away with anything. At least, not any more than they were without government intervention. (The rich execs were never personally at risk, of course.)

Wikipedia has a nice article about the [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_Economic_Stabilization_Act_of_2008"]Emergency Economic Stabilization Act[/url] if you actually want to know what it's about.

[quote name='Hassan' post='1675371' date='Oct 11 2008, 11:35 PM']You're husband does not foot the bill. We all do. I do as well.

How about this, help people keep their homes and stop paying the military so much or the State Department etc. [url="http://www.worldpolicy.org/projects/arms/reports/israel050602.html"]How about we spend a little less on Israeli military[/url] and use that money to help keep banks open and people in their homes?

I don't understand this fettish with funding the military. The military gets enough money, our military get's the highest percentage of the GDP of any military on earth. Let's fund the military enough to secure our defense. Anything else is to much.[/quote]

100% agreement, dude. 100%...

Well, except maybe the part about people keeping their homes. Can we at least cut it off at $300k?

[Hassan]

[quote name='philothea' post='1675422' date='Oct 12 2008, 12:13 AM']*siiiiigh*

It's not a bailout (at least, not yet) and no one is getting paid off or getting away with anything. At least, not any more than they were without government intervention. (The rich execs were never personally at risk, of course.)

Wikipedia has a nice article about the [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_Economic_Stabilization_Act_of_2008"]Emergency Economic Stabilization Act[/url] if you actually want to know what it's about.



100% agreement, dude. 100%...

Well, except maybe the part about people keeping their homes. Can we at least cut it off at $300k?[/quote]


You mean like houses valued at 300k?

I have no problem letting people who really were just totally irrsponsible sink.

It's tough but it's a tough world and they should have known better than to take such a risk.

[Hassan]

[quote name='T-Bone _' post='1675393' date='Oct 11 2008, 11:54 PM']Should the government restructure my car loan? It's worth less than I owe. How about my student loan? I dropped out, I have no degree, I am getting no benefit from the amount I borrowed--restructure that as well. I also bought some food on my credit card--that's all gone, completely worthless--restructure that too!

The list goes on...[/quote]

yeah. Well, you can be bitter, I'm interested in discussing what can be done to avert a economic collapse.

[T-Bone _]

[quote][quote]So you admit we need to spend more money than average on our military?[/quote]
No.


[quote]Thank you. (I guess that invalidates your point there though.)[/quote]

And no.[/quote]

Nice logic there.

You admit that we need to have bases in Europe, yet you deny that we need to fund them. I guess our boys in green should just work for free, then?

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1675428' date='Oct 11 2008, 10:16 PM']yeah. Well, you can be bitter, I'm interested in discussing what can be done to avert a economic collapse.[/quote]

Please, please, please, explain (use simple terms please, because obviously I'm must be pretty daft) what's so special about home loans (as opposed to all the other loans that are being defaulted on) that makes them so central to our economy.

[Hassan]

[quote name='T-Bone _' post='1675429' date='Oct 12 2008, 12:17 AM']Nice logic there.[/quote]

I see no syllogisms there

[quote]You admit that we need to have bases in Europe[/quote]

I admited no such thing

[quote]yet you deny that we need to fund them. I guess our boys in green should just work for free, then?[/quote]

No, you may wish to go back and reread what I said

[philothea]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1675425' date='Oct 12 2008, 12:15 AM']You mean like houses valued at 300k?

I have no problem letting people who really were just totally irrsponsible sink.

It's tough but it's a tough world and they should have known better than to take such a risk.[/quote]
Yeah, that's what I meant. Sorry to be unclear.

I've just seen so many very well-off people buy houses costing double or triple what they sensibly could afford... and then brag about it.

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1675432' date='Oct 11 2008, 10:20 PM']I see no syllogisms there



I admited no such thing



No, you may wish to go back and reread what I said[/quote]

[quote]QUOTE
WE have bases all over Europe, which cuts the strain of these countries defending themselves.




Yes, and we just do it out of the goodness of our hearts right?[/quote]

There you go...

[Hassan]

[quote name='T-Bone _' post='1675431' date='Oct 11 2008, 11:20 PM']Please, please, please, explain (use simple terms please, because obviously I'm must be pretty daft) what's so special about home loans (as opposed to all the other loans that are being defaulted on) that makes them so central to our economy.[/quote]

yeah, I never called you "daft" nor did I imply it.

I am no economist however I believe because of the undue use of derivitives in the housing market.

[Hassan]

[quote name='T-Bone _' post='1675434' date='Oct 11 2008, 11:22 PM']There you go...[/quote]


um yeah, that absolutly did not say or imply that I supported US bases in Europe or supplimenting the military budgets of forein governments, that was an implication of the motives we have in maintaining such bases.

[kamiller42]

The credit crisis was not a case of the free market failing. A market engineered by the government though quasi-government businesses (Fannie & Freddie) is not free. The government shares a major share of responsibility in this debacle because they forced institutions to give loans to risky borrowers, be it low income borrowers or house flippers. The government has a duty to clean up the mess it created. (Note: [url="http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=28973"]McCain and a number of republicans warned about this [/url]over and over. Bush warned Congress 17 times. Even )

Why does the government want to refinance these loans? Two reasons.
1) It inflated housing values artificially by putting more buyers on the market with dollars they should not have had. Demand goes up. Supply is limited. Prices go up.
2) The government does want to see your home value go in the toilet. Your home is an asset. Holding assets with value is required to keep an economy from tanking.

It is true the financial institutions dealing in the securities backing these loans participated fully to make some quick cash. Some of them need to fall.

The crisis is frustrating on so many levels. What is more frustrating is the fact [url="http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/easescredit.asp"]the politicians who got in this mess are the ones who will control Congress and maybe the White House[/url]. Their hands are dirty through and through, but America seems interested in giving these losers more power. These politicians should fired, maybe even handcuffed and thrown in prison.

[Hassan]

[quote name='kamiller42' post='1675444' date='Oct 11 2008, 11:32 PM']The credit crisis was not a case of the free market failing. A market engineered by the government though quasi-government businesses (Fannie & Freddie) is not free. The government shares a major share of responsibility in this debacle because they forced institutions to give loans to risky borrowers, be it low income borrowers or house flippers. The government has a duty to clean up the mess it created. (Note: [url="http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=28973"]McCain and a number of republicans warned about this [/url]over and over. Bush warned Congress 17 times. Even )

Why does the government want to refinance these loans? Two reasons.
1) It inflated housing values artificially by putting more buyers on the market with dollars they should not have had. Demand goes up. Supply is limited. Prices go up.
2) The government does want to see your home value go in the toilet. Your home is an asset. Holding assets with value is required to keep an economy from tanking.

It is true the financial institutions dealing in the securities backing these loans participated fully to make some quick cash. Some of them need to fall.

The crisis is frustrating on so many levels. What is more frustrating is the fact [url="http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/easescredit.asp"]the politicians who got in this mess are the ones who will control Congress and maybe the White House[/url]. Their hands are dirty through and through, but America seems interested in giving these losers more power. These politicians should fired, maybe even handcuffed and thrown in prison.[/quote]
I find it odd that nowhere in your partisan analysis do you include the role of derivitives.

[kamiller42]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1675447' date='Oct 12 2008, 12:33 AM']I find it odd that nowhere in your partisan analysis do you include the role of derivitives.[/quote]
Try reading more closely.

What does partisan have to do with derivatives? Only republicans deal in them?