kamiller42 Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 [quote name='fidei defensor' post='1947291' date='Aug 12 2009, 05:56 PM']Precisely. However, I disapprove of the tendency to wildly speculate and extrapolate. The fact of the matter is, no one can predict the future, and being overly pessimistic and downright morbid about it isn't helping anyone.[/quote] Is the concept of being a "student of history" passe? No need to speculate. They are already in the health insurance business, and the government is terrible. By the way, my auto insurance premiums are little high. Can the government provide that too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted August 12, 2009 Author Share Posted August 12, 2009 (edited) [quote name='kamiller42' post='1947327' date='Aug 12 2009, 05:00 PM']Is the concept of being a "student of history" passe? No need to speculate. They are already in the health insurance business, and the government is terrible. By the way, my auto insurance premiums are little high. Can the government provide that too?[/quote] You keep saying that. It's one thing to claim to have an idea of what COULD happen, based on history. It's another to claim it WILL happen. You are doing the latter. You should be doing the former. You can't predict the future and it's complete croutons to make it sound like you can. Edited August 12, 2009 by fidei defensor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamiller42 Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 [quote name='fidei defensor' post='1947329' date='Aug 12 2009, 07:02 PM']You keep saying that. It's one thing to claim to have an idea of what COULD happen, based on history. It's another to claim it WILL happen. You are doing the latter. You should be doing the former. You can't predict the future and it's complete croutons to make it sound like you can.[/quote] Do I have to experience cancer to know it's bad? Do I have to have one more government program perform poorly at you and I's expense to know it's bad? In both cases, I can make pretty safe assumptions without experiencing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 [quote name='kamiller42' post='1947694' date='Aug 12 2009, 10:48 PM']Do I have to experience cancer to know it's bad? Do I have to have one more government program perform poorly at you and I's expense to know it's bad? In both cases, I can make pretty safe assumptions without experiencing it.[/quote] We can compare our system to outher countries. Countries where the people are happier with their health care, medical expenses are cheeper, and fewer people go bankrupt over medical bills. We are 37th in the world in terms of health care. Perhapse we should take a hint at this fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamiller42 Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 [quote name='Hassan' post='1947705' date='Aug 12 2009, 11:58 PM']We can compare our system to outher countries. Countries where the people are happier with their health care, medical expenses are cheeper, and fewer people go bankrupt over medical bills. We are 37th in the world in terms of health care. Perhapse we should take a hint at this fact.[/quote] Yes, America is a horrible place to live. The health care is horrible. The lower taxes because we are not paying for federal health care is terrible. People just don't want to come to America unless they have a death wish. [quote]Recent media reports tout a forthcoming study in the American Journal of Medicine claiming that medical bills are responsible for 60% of U.S. personal bankruptcies. Putting aside the overly-generous criteria for counting a bankruptcy as “medical,” the figures reported in the study actually show that even by their criteria, medical bankruptcy is actually dropping. As Megan McArdle points out, the report’s figures indicate that the number of medical bankruptcies dropped from almost 671,000 in 2001, to only 502,000 in 2007. That’s a drop of over 25% in six years. [url="http://blog.heritage.org/2009/07/24/medical-bankruptcies-are-falling/"]Source[/url][/quote] Everyone wants reform. One side, the president and his soldiers, believe they have the only answer, and America better accept or else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted August 13, 2009 Author Share Posted August 13, 2009 [quote name='kamiller42' post='1947694' date='Aug 12 2009, 09:48 PM']Do I have to experience cancer to know it's bad? Do I have to have one more government program perform poorly at you and I's expense to know it's bad? In both cases, I can make pretty safe assumptions without experiencing it.[/quote] Nice try but that's not even close to the same thing, and I think cancer survivors would take offense to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamiller42 Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 [quote name='fidei defensor' post='1947724' date='Aug 13 2009, 12:18 AM']Nice try but that's not even close to the same thing, and I think cancer survivors would take offense to that.[/quote] Being able to sympathize without being able to empathize is offense? I think the comparison is spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted August 13, 2009 Author Share Posted August 13, 2009 [quote name='kamiller42' post='1947768' date='Aug 12 2009, 11:16 PM']Being able to sympathize without being able to empathize is offense? I think the comparison is spot on.[/quote] Comparing a proposed congressional bill for healthcare reform to the consequences of cancer is spot on? You'd be closer to spot on if you had pulled Hitler and the Nazis back into the debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angel*Star Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 (edited) **** Edited August 13, 2009 by Angel*Star Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted August 13, 2009 Author Share Posted August 13, 2009 [quote name='Angel*Star' post='1947776' date='Aug 12 2009, 11:31 PM']Why should I trust Obama?[/quote] Why shouldn't you? You should realize that while this reform is being spearheaded by Obama, it requires the support of the majority of the House and Senate. That means that the elected representatives have to craft and vote on the reform. This isn't about Obama, it's about the people we've elected to represent us making decisions on our behalf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angel*Star Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 (edited) [quote name='Hassan' post='1946855' date='Aug 12 2009, 02:04 AM']Where doe the bill say abortions wll be paid for?[/quote] While abortion advocacy groups like Planned Parenthood and NARAL, with help from their friends in the mainstream media, have attempted to explain away how the government-run health care plans would pay for abortions, one of their own finally admitted that to be the case. During a Monday town hall event, pro-abortion Rep. Zoe Lofgren, a California Democrat, acknowledged that the Congressional bills include abortion funding. "Abortion will be covered as a benefit by one or more of the healthcare plans available to Americans, and I think it should be," she said. In a video provided to LifeNews.com by pro-life advocate David Schmidt, local pro-life advocate Ignacio Reyes asks Lofgren about the health care plan. He says he wants to know if the plan would be "covering abortion, which we know that 90 percent of abortions are purely elective, not medically necessary. Why is this being covered when abortion is clearly not health care." Full story at LifeNews.com [quote name='fidei defensor' post='1947291' date='Aug 12 2009, 05:56 PM']For the love of your God, trust Him! If you believe what you profess, you should be praying, not stirring up fear with lies.[/quote] Why should I trust Obama? We are praying and we are not stirring up fear with lies. You and others are angry because we are not the sheep being led to the slaughter. Edited August 13, 2009 by Angel*Star Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted August 13, 2009 Author Share Posted August 13, 2009 [quote name='Angel*Star' post='1947779' date='Aug 12 2009, 11:36 PM']While abortion advocacy groups like Planned Parenthood and NARAL, with help from their friends in the mainstream media, have attempted to explain away how the government-run health care plans would pay for abortions, one of their own finally admitted that to be the case. During a Monday town hall event, pro-abortion Rep. Zoe Lofgren, a California Democrat, acknowledged that the Congressional bills include abortion funding. "Abortion will be covered as a benefit by one or more of the healthcare plans available to Americans, and I think it should be," she said. In a video provided to LifeNews.com by pro-life advocate David Schmidt, local pro-life advocate Ignacio Reyes asks Lofgren about the health care plan. He says he wants to know if the plan would be "covering abortion, which we know that 90 percent of abortions are purely elective, not medically necessary. Why is this being covered when abortion is clearly not health care." Full story at LifeNews.com Why should I trust Obama? We are praying and we are not stirring up fear with lies. You and others are angry because we are not the sheep being led to the slaughter.[/quote] I was talking about God. You need to trust in God and pray for the best rather than turning this whole attempt at reform into a national debauchery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princessgianna Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 (edited) [quote name='fidei defensor' post='1947778' date='Aug 13 2009, 12:34 AM']Why shouldn't you? You should realize that while this reform is being spearheaded by Obama, it requires the support of the majority of the House and Senate. That means that the elected representatives have to craft and vote on the reform. This isn't about Obama, it's about the people we've elected to represent us making decisions on our behalf.[/quote] Obama won't allow his own daughters on the plan-- what? so it isn't good enough for them they can do whatever,have children when they want if they want. But what about me? What is so bad about the plan that Obama has in mind that he won't allow his own daughters in??? That is my question. The Liberal left politicians want the control. They don't want to help people-if they did they would have no problem having thier own children on the plan with me! They just want everyone else under it so they have the potential to do whatever kill whomever. ---------------- Now playing: [url="http://www.foxytunes.com/artist/john+powell/track/at+the+farmhouse"]John Powell - At The Farmhouse[/url] via [url="http://www.foxytunes.com/signatunes/"]FoxyTunes[/url] Edited August 13, 2009 by princessgianna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted August 13, 2009 Author Share Posted August 13, 2009 [quote name='princessgianna' post='1947782' date='Aug 12 2009, 11:39 PM']he won't allow his own daughters on the plan-- what so it isn't good enough for them they can do whatever,have children when they want if they want. But what about me? What is so bad about the plan that Obama has in mind that he won't allow his own daughters in??? that is my question. they want the control. they don't want to be part of the plan- they just want everyone else under it so they have the potential to do whatever. ---------------- Now playing: [url="http://www.foxytunes.com/artist/john+powell/track/at+the+farmhouse"]John Powell - At The Farmhouse[/url] via [url="http://www.foxytunes.com/signatunes/"]FoxyTunes[/url][/quote] That would be the part of the reform that says you can keep your private insurance... no one is making you do anything. However, I'm sure the disadvantaged people who can't afford to have insurance will be ecstatic to be able to finally see a doctor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamiller42 Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 [quote name='fidei defensor' post='1947784' date='Aug 13 2009, 01:41 AM']That would be the part of the reform that says you can keep your private insurance... no one is making you do anything. However, I'm sure the disadvantaged people who can't afford to have insurance will be ecstatic to be able to finally see a doctor.[/quote] There is a phrase in engineering that goes "eating one's own dog food." It means a company uses the products it creates in order to prove the quality of its products. Will congress and the president drop their current health care coverage and eat their own dog food by enrolling in their own plan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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