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Modesty: Does It Include Bare Shoulders In Church?

Bare shoulders in Church?  

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Sojourner
[quote name='kateri05' post='1378440' date='Sep 5 2007, 12:01 AM']John Paul II seemed to disagree :rolleyes:[/quote]
Too true ...

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kateri05
it saddens me that modesty can be taken to the prudish extreme. and i'm not calling photo a prude, but the sentiment that sex can't be talked about, etc etc. is a dangerous one, in my opinion.

i have taught plenty of teenage girls who had parents and other teachers who felt the same way and so what happened? they got their information from ALL the wrong places, rather than a healthy, theologically correct view of the sacredness and RIGHTNESS of sex and sexuality. sex is a natural thing, a good and holy thing when it exists in the correct context and so its only natural and good that people are interested in learning about it, not in a technical way, but how it fits into God's plan for our salvation.

its not about NOT talking about sex, but about talking about it in the right way, in the right context, and certainly at the right ages (ugh, 3rd graders in sex ed. gross!)

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homeschoolmom
[img]http://www.sophiasstyle.com/images/customimgr/communion.jpg[/img]

[img]http://www.catholicsupply.com/christmas/_borders/ua314.jpg[/img]

What about sleeveless Communion dresses?

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Domine ut Videam
I voted yes, if you wear a sweater with the dress. Or say you are going to adoration and it is going to be just you and you know this and you are aware that you can keep a respectful attitude with your dress and clothes, than i think the person could handle it, if it is really hot.

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photosynthesis
[quote name='kateri05' post='1378440' date='Sep 5 2007, 02:01 AM']John Paul II seemed to disagree :rolleyes:[/quote]

[quote name='Terra Firma' post='1378445' date='Sep 5 2007, 02:06 AM']Too true ...[/quote]

[quote name='Nadezhda' post='1378449' date='Sep 5 2007, 02:12 AM']I just finished ToTB for Beginners. I would have to third.[/quote]
Theology of the Body was God's way of overcoming evil with good. Before the Sexual Revolution, it wasn't necessary for Catholics to engage in much discussion about sex. I'm not saying that pre-Vatican II American Catholics had a perfect attitude towards sex, but in a more redeemed society, sex has a certain mystique that causes people to speak about it in hushed tones. Most Catholics at that time were not properly catechized about sexuality. Maybe they learned in Catholic school that sex is reserved for marriage only, and contraception is wrong, but they weren't taught that sex is the consummation of a beautiful Sacrament. This caused a lot of American Catholics to fall into the errors of the Sexual Revolution, and Pope Paul VI and Pope John Paul II were both very wise in defining the Church's teaching on sexuality in the manner in which they did. College professors started teaching Freudian psychology and women's liberation rhetoric in the academic milieu, and so it was necessary for the Catholic Church to refute modern heresies using modern terms.

[quote name='kateri05' post='1378451' date='Sep 5 2007, 02:16 AM']it saddens me that modesty can be taken to the prudish extreme. and i'm not calling photo a prude, but the sentiment that sex can't be talked about, etc etc. is a dangerous one, in my opinion.

i have taught plenty of teenage girls who had parents and other teachers who felt the same way and so what happened? they got their information from ALL the wrong places, rather than a healthy, theologically correct view of the sacredness and RIGHTNESS of sex and sexuality. sex is a natural thing, a good and holy thing when it exists in the correct context and so its only natural and good that people are interested in learning about it, not in a technical way, but how it fits into God's plan for our salvation.

its not about NOT talking about sex, but about talking about it in the right way, in the right context, and certainly at the right ages (ugh, 3rd graders in sex ed. gross!)[/quote]

I agree that a frank discussion of human sexuality is a necessary part of catechesis in the modern age. This can be fruitful and edifying. However, the type of discussion I referred to in my post had to do with people talking about their own sex lives, Sex in the City style. Talking about God's plan for sexuality is good, a person should keep his or her sexual experiences private. I'm part of a really active Catholic community here in New Jersey, and a lot of us are getting married around the same time. Three couples got married this year, one couple is getting married on Divine Mercy Sunday next year and my fiance and I are getting married two weeks later. One time I made the mistake of asking, "how was your honeymoon?" Not a good idea.

After having a secular upbringing, going to a secular college and watching enough TV, I became desensitized to hearing stories about peoples' sexual experiences. It didn't occur to me that such discussion is inappropriate until I read Archbishop Fulton Sheen's "Three to get Married" as part of my marriage preparation. Sheen argues that married couples should not be so eager to give out the details of their sex lives.

Now, I get a little annoyed when my friends give me TMI about their sexual escapades. I don't want to be included in the discussion of something that's inherently exclusive and private, and I don't want to know if so-and-so's using NFP or how often Mr. and Mrs. Whosoever engage in the marital embrace. That kind of talk isn't fruitful or edifying.

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Carolyn
[quote name='photosynthesis' post='1378541' date='Sep 5 2007, 10:08 AM']Now, I get a little annoyed when my friends give me TMI about their sexual escapades. I don't want to be included in the discussion of something that's inherently exclusive and private, and I don't want to know if so-and-so's using NFP or how often Mr. and Mrs. Whosoever engage in the marital embrace. That kind of talk isn't fruitful or edifying.[/quote]


Warning! :offtopic:


I can see, your point there, photo. I've definitely gotten earfuls of TMI... Awkward! Edited by Carolyn

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cmotherofpirl
[quote name='abercius24' post='1378209' date='Sep 4 2007, 10:23 PM']If it makes a guy take a second look, then its distracting enough to not be considered modest dress for Church.[/quote]

Nothing can "make" a guy take a second look, it is purely a choice on his part. Its not a woman's fault if a man isn't capable of some self-control.

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Sojourner
[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1378610' date='Sep 5 2007, 12:12 PM']Nothing can "make" a guy take a second look, it is purely a choice on his part. Its not a woman's fault if a man isn't capable of some self-control.[/quote]
:yes:

good catch, cmom

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