Bishop Suspends Ef Mass

[jeffpugh]

If all this is the case medically about the flu, then I guess we have either really ignorant people advising the bishop or it's purely a political matter for the sake of show.

[Veridicus]

[quote name='Sacred Music Man' date='02 December 2009 - 11:23 PM' timestamp='1259814191' post='2013598']
If all this is the case medically about the flu, then I guess we have either really ignorant people advising the bishop or it's purely a political matter for the sake of show.
[/quote]

Yeah, neither of those are pleasant realities to be flipping a coin between.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[JimR-OCDS]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='02 December 2009 - 05:59 PM' timestamp='1259791178' post='2013343']
It might be gross if people slobbered all over it but at the Eastern Liturgies I've participated in the priest just kind of tosses the Eucharist into their mouths without touching the spoon to anything. lulz. I have seen vids where people wrapped their lips around the spoon but I think that was in other countries where people maybe don't care as much. haha
[/quote]


So Jesus said, "take this and toss it into your mouth. Don't chew, but smell of elderberries on it until it dissolves."
[img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/ohno.gif[/img]

It amazes me how the Church has taken up all sorts of gymnastics in receiving Holy Communion, when Jesus words "take and eat," is so natural and simple.

Jim

[aalpha1989]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='03 December 2009 - 09:49 AM' timestamp='1259851784' post='2013804']
So Jesus said, "take this and toss it into your mouth. Don't chew, but smell of elderberries on it until it dissolves."
[img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/ohno.gif[/img]

It amazes me how the Church has taken up all sorts of gymnastics in receiving Holy Communion, when Jesus words "take and eat," is so natural and simple.

Jim
[/quote]

I'm just gonna say it.

[mod]personal attack-MIKolbe[/mod]You have no respect for varying traditions (or even your own, for that matter).

[Veridicus]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='03 December 2009 - 09:49 AM' timestamp='1259851784' post='2013804']
It amazes me how the Church has taken up all sorts of gymnastics in receiving Holy Communion, when Jesus words "take and eat," is so natural and simple.
[/quote]

These [i]gymnastics [/i]represent the Church's tradition in appreciating the fact that Holy Communion is more than simply a protestant-esque re-enactment of the Last Supper; the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass and Holy Communion of the faithful is a participation in the Passion of Christ and the Church has decided, in Her Wisdom, that some rubrics are worth implementing. The rubrics exist to communicate doctrine and it is our job to be obedient to the traditions we have received; even when we do not fully appreciate or understand them.

Edited December 3, 2009 by Veridicus

[JimR-OCDS]

[quote name='Veridicus' date='03 December 2009 - 01:20 PM' timestamp='1259860803' post='2013825']
These [i]gymnastics [/i]represent the Church's tradition in appreciating the fact that Holy Communion is more than simply a protestant-esque re-enactment of the Last Supper; the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass and Holy Communion of the faithful is a participation in the Passion of Christ and the Church has decided, in Her Wisdom, that some rubrics are worth implementing. The rubrics exist to communicate doctrine and it is our job to be obedient to the traditions we have received; even when we do not fully appreciate or understand them.
[/quote]


The rubrics exist also to prevent abuse, such as, placing the consecrated host in your pocket and walking home with it.

However, we don't live in a time of an illiterate peasantry, where people can not be educated to the sacredness of Holy Communion, without forcing them to do the unnatural when it comes to eating.

Again, Jesus said, "take and eat." He didn't need to add anything else to it.

Jim

[Veridicus]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='03 December 2009 - 01:15 PM' timestamp='1259864117' post='2013836']
The rubrics exist also to prevent abuse, such as, placing the consecrated host in your pocket and walking home with it.

However, we don't live in a time of an illiterate peasantry, where people can not be educated to the sacredness of Holy Communion, without forcing them to do the unnatural when it comes to eating.

Again, Jesus said, "take and eat." He didn't need to add anything else to it.

Jim
[/quote]

I do not find it unnatural to be fed by the priest. I call him "Father" and through his specific Ministerial Priesthood he makes present the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ. I find it humbling and appropriate to receive the Bread of Life with the meekness of a infant receiving food from his father. The Eucharist is not about eating as if expressing the normal means of eating was an end in itself; the Eucharist is about Communion with the Divine.

And I just don't accept the 'we're literate now so everyone gets it and there is no abuse" argument. That hasn't panned out. Since beyond High-school Diploma level education has become standard in the last 30 years and reception on the hand has become standard...we have in fact witnessed a precipitous decline in Catholics admitting to believing the Real Presence as well as attendance and tithing and the transgenerational inculcation of the Faith. I am without a doubt that a loss of doctrine-instilling rubrics has played a role in this.


EDIT: Jim, let me add as an addendum to this post that I do not think there is anything intrinsically wrong with receiving the Eucharist in the hand; I simply do not think it is the clearest expression (and historically neither has the Church) of the sacramental reality of what is going on. I do not want you or anyone else on here to think I 'look down' as if from some radical-traditional cloud upon 'less worthy practices.' I believe that reception on the tongue is a more clear expression of the realities being made present; individually educated laymen who are properly catechized could receive in the hand with no adverse effects. However, the practice of receiving on the tongue exists more than as a means of protecting sacrilege to the Body of Christ; it is also to ensure proper inculcation of the doctrine of the Real Presence...and it is especially in this latter way that the Church has suffered so grievously in the last few decades. The average human needs the external rubrics to keep instilling the ethereal realities that are so easy to forget.

Edited December 3, 2009 by Veridicus

[Nihil Obstat]

Veridicus is correct. Reverence for the Eucharist is at an appalling low in the average Mass that I've attended lately... with the notable exception of the Extraordinary form, where everyone receives on the tongue kneeling. The difference was overwhelming. Literally overwhelming. I was shaking. We absolutely must find a way to make that kind of reverence be present in [u]all[/u] Masses.

[Veridicus]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='03 December 2009 - 01:32 PM' timestamp='1259865166' post='2013844']
Veridicus is correct. Reverence for the Eucharist is at an appalling low in the average Mass that I've attended lately... with the notable exception of the Extraordinary form, where everyone receives on the tongue kneeling. The difference was overwhelming. Literally overwhelming. I was shaking. We absolutely must find a way to make that kind of reverence be present in [u]all[/u] Masses.
[/quote]

Lex orandi, Lex crendendi.

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='Veridicus' date='03 December 2009 - 06:28 PM' timestamp='1259864937' post='2013843']
I do not find it unnatural to be fed by the priest. I call him "Father" and through his specific Ministerial Priesthood he makes present the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ. I find it humbling and appropriate to receive the Bread of Life with the meekness of a infant receiving food from his father. The Eucharist is not about eating as if expressing the normal means of eating was an end in itself; the Eucharist is about Communion with the Divine.

And I just don't accept the 'we're literate now so everyone gets it and there is no abuse" argument. That hasn't panned out. Since beyond High-school Diploma level education has become standard in the last 30 years and reception on the hand has become standard...we have in fact witnessed a precipitous decline in Catholics admitting to believing the Real Presence as well as attendance and tithing and the transgenerational inculcation of the Faith. I am without a doubt that a loss of doctrine-instilling rubrics has played a role in this.
[/quote]

[Donna]

Off topic: Zunshynn I love your sig!



[i]"Mother of God tell me your mystery;
of how your earthly life was spent;
the way, right from the time of your fiat,
how you’d be buried in adoration.
Mary say how in a peace, a silence
you could enter into deeps
where none but you could go,
bearing the gift of God within."[/i]

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='03 December 2009 - 09:49 AM' timestamp='1259851784' post='2013804']
So Jesus said, "take this and toss it into your mouth. Don't chew, but smell of elderberries on it until it dissolves."
[img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/ohno.gif[/img]

It amazes me how the Church has taken up all sorts of gymnastics in receiving Holy Communion, when Jesus words "take and eat," is so natural and simple.

Jim
[/quote]
Ur phunny.

[zunshynn]

[quote name='Donna' date='04 December 2009 - 11:35 PM' timestamp='1259994924' post='2014880']
Off topic: Zunshynn I love your sig!



[i]"Mother of God tell me your mystery;
of how your earthly life was spent;
the way, right from the time of your fiat,
how you’d be buried in adoration.
Mary say how in a peace, a silence
you could enter into deeps
where none but you could go,
bearing the gift of God within."[/i]
[/quote]

Thank you! I excerpted it from a longer poem by Bl. Elizabeth of the Trintity called Amo Christum:

[quote]
The Incarnation

There is this One, who knows all mysteries
And who embraced them from Eternity
And this same One..., the Father's Word is He...
Splendor, that Word, of His Divinity.
See that One come with Love's excess
With Charity so urgent! Say:
"Son of The Father's tenderness
God gives us Him on this great day!"
O Word may-lifelong now-
I listen to You! so
Possessed by You, that how
To love be all I know

"Amo Christum"

In me, a house that God is living at,
This Jesus Christ, Divine Adorer there,
Takes me to the souls, as to The Father: that
Being the double movement of his prayer
My Saviour My Master, here
Whose call to me still drives me on
For this I ought to disappear
I, lost in Him, with Him as One
One Word of Life with You
For always and above
Your virgin host anew
All shining forth with love

Amo Christum

His Sanctuary, I! He rests in me!
There is this peace one looks for and attains:
In silence and in deepest mystery
He's captured me: for ever I'm in chains
Ah, to Your ev'ry word to cling
Calm in the faith I'm anchored to:
Adoring You, through everything
As one who only lives by You!
Beneath Your splendent Light
O Word, by night and Day
May I be now, outright
To Your great love, a prey

Amo Christum

Mother of God, tell me your mystery
Of how your earthly life was spent: the way
Right from the time of 'Fiat'- how you'd be
Buried in adoration, Mary! say
How--in a peace, a silence, you
could enter into Deeps
where none but you could go
Bearing the gift of God within
Secure in God's embrace
Keep me, I ask. In me
His imprint may he place
For wholly Love is he.

'Amo Christum'

By Blessed Elizabeth of the Trinity, OCD[/quote]

[Maximilianus]

nevermind...Rexi beat me to it.

Edited December 10, 2009 by Maximilianus