Happy_Catholic Posted January 4, 2010 Share Posted January 4, 2010 [quote name='KeenanParkerII' date='03 January 2010 - 02:19 PM' timestamp='1262546353' post='2029051'] So far I've seen 61 people read it, in a very anti-Catholic debate forum, and none have responded. I take that as a good thing. [/quote] I'm surprised someone hasn't bought up the whole "then killing animals is wrong!!!" side bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeenanParkerII Posted January 4, 2010 Share Posted January 4, 2010 Believe it or not, the original work goes on to argue for animal rights, which I would consider legitimate from a purely ethical standpoint if it were not for the fact that human dominion, as ascribed by God, trumps my understanding of ethics. But regardless, it provides a simple, ethical and valid attack on abortion. =) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaeology cat Posted January 4, 2010 Share Posted January 4, 2010 Arguing personhood with someone is the most infuriating thing I've done lately. There are some good arguments here that I'll have to remember for the next time I'm debating with someone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominicansoul Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 (edited) a good friend is in her last month of pregnancy... ...she wobbles around, is tired most of the time, finds it hard to sleep, as the baby is getting heavier in her belly...and moves around a whole lot more... she told me the other night. "once i got pregnant, my whole body was not my own anymore...and all this pain and suffering proves it! My body is doing things it would never do if I was not pregnant.." the fact is...the child in her womb is a whole other person...and not "her own body..." and she realizes that more than ever... ...as soon as she gives birth...her body will become "hers" again...and get back into the shape it was before the child was conceived, and a new life began inside of her... in other words... the argument "its my body, my choice" is totally wrong... in fact, my friend told me..."my body has become more the baby's than anything else!" Edited January 31, 2010 by dominicansoul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veridicus Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Happy_Catholic' date='04 January 2010 - 12:01 AM' timestamp='1262584899' post='2029401'] I see the "my skin cell is a human being" argument all the time. The problem with it is the person claiming their skin cells are human beings are unable too or do not understand, or refuse to acknowledge, the stages of development of a human being. The zygote, as small as it is, containing human DNA, is a human being in a stage of development. The embryo is a small cluster of cells that begin to formulate into something that resembles a human being or other organism. It is a human being in a stage of development. The foetus, with human DNA, which holds a "human appearnace" is a human being in a stage of development. The skin cell is a single cell, containing human DNA of course, but not a human being because it is a cell, as opposed to an organism. The skin cell is part of a human being. The zygote is the human being. Just in a different stage of development. The skin cell will never be anything other than a skin cell. The zgyote, contains the full compliement and programming to become a human being (barring any defect or in ability to implant or interuption). Zygote, embryo, foetus, baby, toddler, child, teenager, et cetera. Stages of human development. All those things above are human beings. [/quote] This pretty much sums it up. The skin cell is not a human being. It is a terminally differentiated human cell incapable of developing on its own into a human being. Whereas the embryo is a human being precisely because of such development and has such development as its natural end. The skin cell contributes the individual; the embryo is the individual. Edited January 31, 2010 by Veridicus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaeology cat Posted February 8, 2010 Share Posted February 8, 2010 [quote name='dominicansoul' date='31 January 2010 - 07:20 PM' timestamp='1264965640' post='2048349'] a good friend is in her last month of pregnancy... ...she wobbles around, is tired most of the time, finds it hard to sleep, as the baby is getting heavier in her belly...and moves around a whole lot more... she told me the other night. "once i got pregnant, my whole body was not my own anymore...and all this pain and suffering proves it! My body is doing things it would never do if I was not pregnant.." the fact is...the child in her womb is a whole other person...and not "her own body..." and she realizes that more than ever... ...as soon as she gives birth...her body will become "hers" again...and get back into the shape it was before the child was conceived, and a new life began inside of her... in other words... the argument "its my body, my choice" is totally wrong... in fact, my friend told me..."my body has become more the baby's than anything else!" [/quote] I understand that completely. I'm certainly not the one kicking my ribs or digging a heel into my side or having the hiccups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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