A Dirty Rotten Scoundrel

[Mrs. Bro. Adam]

[quote name='KevinSymonds' date='05 July 2010 - 02:53 PM' timestamp='1278359580' post='2138015']

With all due respect, Adam, you already have your mind made up and have surrounded yourself with people who will not challenge you. You asked the questions, "Should I write this book? Should I tell this story?"

Why did you [i]really[/i] start this thread?

There is no need to answer me here or elsewhere as my question is for self-reflection only.

-KJS
[/quote]


Kevin,

I really do not understand, nor have I seen any concrete reason from you that Adam should [b]not[/b] write this book. I have given concrete reasons as to why he should, and even though there are relatively few members who have posted in this thread, several have pm'd Adam (as he's mentioned)giving their own input, and as he said, all of which have said that he should.

So, [b]why[/b] did he start this thread? To get some honest feedback from people just like you and me.

And since you posed questions, please allow me to pose you a question:

Why is it that you seem very insistent that if he writes this book that it should be very limited? If I read a book that said, "I looked at p0rn and I M'd but I stopped", to me it's a "So what, it's not like it was a very deep addiction, no wonder you were able to beat it". Sometimes humbling telling our WHOLE stories, tastefully however, is the ONLY way to make a difference and help to cause a change.

Our society is fatally ill with sexual addictions and there are yet to be any books that I've seen that deals with that problem in a very real way instead of "Pray and it will leave you". If so many young men and leaders are struggling with this addiction, then isn't that telling us that the "pray and get over it" method isn't working? There needs to be an example to give hope to those stuck in this deadly addiction, that not only kills men's souls, but their marriage,and affects not only their wives but also their children?

All I've seen from you is basically, "Tread carefully". What effective method uses this "tread carefully" method? None to my knowledge. My life was basically destroyed as a young child and teen because of these "pray and get over it" and "tread carefully" methods.

Life happens, and sometimes what happens in one life needs to be shared unashamedly in the hopes that it may help others. Will a book like this destroy marriages? I don't think so. If a wife truly loves her husband, and the husband is able to use this book to be able to approach his wife and confess, then perhaps a dying marriage can be saved (chances are that the longer a husband has this addiction and is left untreated and keeps it from his wife, the more the marriage will be affected by it, for the worse).

Yes, I've rambled quite a bit, but after a life of seeing how p0rn affects families (have brothers addicted), marriages, and the victim of the addiction themselves, I firmly BELIEVE that a book full of honesty and openness is one of the ONLY ways that ANY type of fight can be fought to defeat Satan and his demons which have such a firm grasp on those stuck in the cycle.

God's grace and peace be with you.

[Guest KevinSymonds]

[quote name='Mrs. Bro. Adam' date='05 July 2010 - 05:31 PM' timestamp='1278365477' post='2138075']
Kevin,

I really do not understand, nor have I seen any concrete reason from you that Adam should [b]not[/b] write this book.[/quote]

Has your husband answered my question as of the time of this post?

[quote]I have given concrete reasons as to why he should, and even though there are relatively few members who have posted in this thread, several have pm'd Adam (as he's mentioned)giving their own input, and as he said, all of which have said that he should.[/quote]

Why did they send PM's and not post their responses here on the thread?

[quote]So, [b]why[/b] did he start this thread? To get some honest feedback from people just like you and me.[/quote]

With all due respect, ma'am, I asked your husband a [i]self-reflective[/i] question.

[quote]And since you posed questions, please allow me to pose you a question:

Why is it that you seem very insistent that if he writes this book that it should be very limited? If I read a book that said, "I looked at p0rn and I M'd but I stopped", to me it's a "So what, it's not like it was a very deep addiction, no wonder you were able to beat it". Sometimes humbling telling our WHOLE stories, tastefully however, is the ONLY way to make a difference and help to cause a change.

Our society is fatally ill with sexual addictions and there are yet to be any books that I've seen that deals with that problem in a very real way instead of "Pray and it will leave you". If so many young men and leaders are struggling with this addiction, then isn't that telling us that the "pray and get over it" method isn't working? There needs to be an example to give hope to those stuck in this deadly addiction, that not only kills men's souls, but their marriage,and affects not only their wives but also their children?

All I've seen from you is basically, "Tread carefully". What effective method uses this "tread carefully" method? None to my knowledge. My life was basically destroyed as a young child and teen because of these "pray and get over it" and "tread carefully" methods.

Life happens, and sometimes what happens in one life needs to be shared unashamedly in the hopes that it may help others. Will a book like this destroy marriages? I don't think so. If a wife truly loves her husband, and the husband is able to use this book to be able to approach his wife and confess, then perhaps a dying marriage can be saved (chances are that the longer a husband has this addiction and is left untreated and keeps it from his wife, the more the marriage will be affected by it, for the worse).

Yes, I've rambled quite a bit, but after a life of seeing how p0rn affects families (have brothers addicted), marriages, and the victim of the addiction themselves, I firmly BELIEVE that a book full of honesty and openness is one of the ONLY ways that ANY type of fight can be fought to defeat Satan and his demons which have such a firm grasp on those stuck in the cycle.

God's grace and peace be with you.[/quote]

If your husband engaged me in discussion beginning with answering my question on Newman and Evangelical[i]ism[/i]....

Is he researching for his answer? If so, I think that's great but I would appreciate being informed of the fact.

With all respect, I remain:
-KJS

[desertwoman]

Write it. There isn't enough people talking about our porn culture and how it affects how men and women view themselves, sex, and love. It is about redemption and honesty with oneself and with loved ones.

I understand the fear of airing out your life because we have learned to become so private and closed, and yet it has stifled us tremendously.

You probably don't remember the christian rapper who died last year called Enoch. He had an addiction to sex, yet rapped to people about coming to Christ and so forth. When he finally came clean about his addiction on his solo album, it gave him a kind of accountability. People knew what he dealt with, came to him for advice and supported him in his trials.

When you continue to hide things and your struggles, the body can not be edified. When you hide things and someone finds out, then it can be used against you. But if you are open about it and someone tries to tell you that you are being a hypocrite you can show them that's it the exact opposite.

Now that you have reconciled and if you ever feel like you're going back in the wrong direction, it won't be hard for people to come to your aid. The body knows what you've been thru, and don't want to see you return to that point in your life.

Write your book, be a light for others, and may others help you along the way too. It is a pilgrims progress my friend. Much love to ya!

[Guest KevinSymonds]

[quote name='desertwoman' date='06 July 2010 - 11:15 AM' timestamp='1278429326' post='2138428']
Write it. There isn't enough people talking about our porn culture and how it affects how men and women view themselves, sex, and love. It is about redemption and honesty with oneself and with loved ones.[/quote]

Have you been lately to the Christian Family Bookstore on Rivers Ave at the Northwoods Mall?

[quote]I understand the fear of airing out your life because we have learned to become so private and closed, and yet it has stifled us tremendously.[/quote]

Goodbye Seal of the Confessional. Hello [i]Days of Our Lives[/i].

[Jaime]

[quote name='KevinSymonds' date='06 July 2010 - 11:22 AM' timestamp='1278429752' post='2138436']
Have you been lately to the Christian Family Bookstore on Rivers Ave at the Northwoods Mall?



Goodbye Seal of the Confessional. Hello [i]Days of Our Lives[/i].
[/quote]

I think that's a poor example since Days of our Lives tries to glorify scandal and I truly doubt that's Adam's intention.

Porn addiction and masturbation are activities that are embarrassing and leave people full of shame. Society would like to tell you that its fine. More should be done to tell the truth. Alcohol and drug addiction were treated the same until people started dialoguing about them

I would offer this suggestion. Write your book Adam but do not self publish. If God is telling you to write it, then God will tell a publisher to publish it.

[Guest KevinSymonds]

[quote name='hot stuff' date='06 July 2010 - 11:32 AM' timestamp='1278430374' post='2138443']
I think that's a poor example since Days of our Lives tries to glorify scandal and I truly doubt that's Adam's intention.[/quote]

Was the example ascribed to Brother Adam's remarks or remarks made by Miss desertwoman?

[quote]Porn addiction and masturbation are activities that are embarrassing and leave people full of shame. Society would like to tell you that its fine. More should be done to tell the truth.[/quote]

Can it be done without revealing matters of the internal forum?

[Jaime]

[quote name='KevinSymonds' date='06 July 2010 - 11:45 AM' timestamp='1278431153' post='2138451']
Was the example ascribed to Brother Adam's remarks or remarks made by Miss desertwoman?



Can it be done without revealing matters of the internal forum?
[/quote]

Well since desertwoman's remarks were intended to strengthen Brother Adam's point, then it would be related.

Matters can be talked about without it being salacious.

[Guest KevinSymonds]

[quote name='hot stuff' date='06 July 2010 - 11:50 AM' timestamp='1278431436' post='2138454']
Well since desertwoman's remarks were intended to strengthen Brother Adam's point, then it would be related.[/quote]

As my comment was oriented at Miss desertwoman's remarks, it cannot be argued that I was speaking to Brother Adam's previous discussion.

[quote]Matters can be talked about without it being salacious.[/quote]

[i]Persons[/i]?

-KJS

[Jaime]

[quote name='KevinSymonds' date='06 July 2010 - 12:03 PM' timestamp='1278432203' post='2138459']
As my comment was oriented at Miss desertwoman's remarks, it cannot be argued that I was speaking to Brother Adam's previous discussion.



[i]Persons[/i]?

-KJS
[/quote]

Sure it can Kevin. Brother Adam is the topic of the thread. If you didn't mean to infer Adam into your comments with Desertwoman, than you could have elaborated more. Otherwise, I as the reader, will infer that you are still talking about the topic of the thread.

See? I can argue it.

[Guest KevinSymonds]

[quote name='hot stuff' date='06 July 2010 - 12:09 PM' timestamp='1278432573' post='2138461']
Sure it can Kevin. Brother Adam is the topic of the thread. If you didn't mean to infer Adam into your comments with Desertwoman, than you could have elaborated more....[/quote]

No need. As I was addressing Miss desertwoman, you ought to have read me as such. It is not my fault if you didn't.

[quote]See? I can argue it.[/quote]

Petulant.

[Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam]

[quote name='Mrs. Bro. Adam' date='05 July 2010 - 06:31 PM' timestamp='1278365477' post='2138075']
I have given concrete reasons as to why he should, and even though there are relatively few members who have posted in this thread, several have pm'd Adam (as he's mentioned) giving their own input, and as he said, all of which have said that he should.
[/quote]


[quote name='KevinSymonds' date='06 July 2010 - 08:44 AM' timestamp='1278416695' post='2138374']
Why did they send PM's and not post their responses here on the thread?
[/quote]

Personally, I think it wouldn't be hard to infer why people would PM Adam. I can imagine people wanting to be discrete and share information without being too explicit that could help a book but at the same time not want to post such information on the wall, since sin does cause shame. To even post that one struggles takes a fair amount of courage and well some people would like to keep their sins as private as they can be given that in Confession the priest acts [i]in persona Christi[/i] as well as in the stead of the Church and in some way makes present the humanity which we all transgress when we sin. All parties are represented/made present there, but that doesn't mean people want their actions put on the internet, especially if people occasionally sign their names to posts, which I have seen people do. It isn't hard to imagine that someone would express a personal story in a personal message of what has helped them, what hasn't helped them, what may have hurt or hindered them further, how individual relationships may have played into that, or some combination of these that should be considered or taken into account in such a book as has been discussed. You make statements like "good bye Seal of Confession, hello 'Days of Our Lives' "(and implicate some in your statements even though you address them to others) and yet when people are discrete and send these personal messages and personal stories in you seem to not understand their motives for such a message nor their motives for tasteful examples of how such addictions can be and have been beaten. Perhaps people struggle, perhaps they have insights they could contribute to the book and would rather everyone not know how they got such insights, but the fact that they have and can share such insights, even if it is only in writing that personal message to adam, so that these insights may be put in a book to help others does involves some courage.

[Jaime]

[quote name='KevinSymonds' date='06 July 2010 - 01:21 PM' timestamp='1278436884' post='2138482']
No need. As I was addressing Miss desertwoman, you ought to have read me as such. It is not my fault if you didn't.



Petulant.
[/quote]

Its a sign of weak writing to expect the reader to know what's in your head.

[MissScripture]

[quote name='KevinSymonds' date='06 July 2010 - 11:22 AM' timestamp='1278429752' post='2138436']
Have you been lately to the Christian Family Bookstore on Rivers Ave at the Northwoods Mall?



Goodbye Seal of the Confessional. Hello [i]Days of Our Lives[/i].
[/quote]
That doesn't really make sense, since the seal of the confessional applies to the priest, and not to what we do and say about our sins afterwards. No one is advocating for priests to start telling everyone what they've heard. However, it can definitely be beneficial at times for those who have been addicted to something to talk about it, both for themselves and others benefits.

[Brother Adam]

Just wanted to send an update, thanks again for all of the encouragement in this task I am setting out on. I am sorry that this thread has been a source of argument and confusion instead of hope, especially for one person who doesn't seem to at all understand what this thread is about and is obviously oblivious to my intentions. I can only hope they will find peace instead of trying to be argumentative for the sake of being argumentative because I have always thought better of them than this.

There are thousands of good Christian examples of people sharing their testimony of finding grace. Think of Van and Davy's story in A Severe Mercy. They shared intimate details of their life together and that Shining Barrier that God had to break through, and how He broke through it. It's offered inspiration to thousands of people. I've cited other examples as well. Of course it matters how it is presented, no one has ever argued differently.

Sexual sin is a plague of our time and statistics show Catholics suffer deeply from it. I hope to add my testimony of finding freedom to the testimony of other Catholics who are already out there. Not enough is being done to help Catholics suffering from such addictions - as is evident of my experience here.

I have been offering advice to many of the people who have been PM'ing me, asking how to break their own addictions, both men and women. Of course, I am not offering counseling or spiritual direction as I am not qualified to do so, but that is one of my biggest pieces of advice - regular confession combined with spiritual direction or counseling depending on how serious the problem is. I am only sharing how I broke the addiction when I became Catholic. The big thing about addictions, as I went through in high school, is with sexual sin we are 1)taught that it is normal by society (I was taught it was normal by my Protestant church) 2)When people with the addiction realize that they have a problem they think they are alone and they are the only ones that 'can't stop'. This loneliness can lead to despair. Knowing that you are not alone, others have gone through that dark valley and emerged clean and free offers hope. And that is a message we need right now because few people are talking about it - but the problem keeps getting worse.

God bless all of you.

[Guest KevinSymonds]

[quote name='Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam' date='06 July 2010 - 05:04 PM' timestamp='1278450289' post='2138611']
Personally, I think it wouldn't be hard to infer why people would PM Adam. I can imagine people wanting to be discrete and share information without being too explicit that could help a book but at the same time not want to post such information on the wall, since sin does cause shame....You make statements like "good bye Seal of Confession, hello 'Days of Our Lives' "(and implicate some in your statements even though you address them to others) and yet when people are discrete and send these personal messages and personal stories in you seem to not understand their motives for such a message nor their motives for tasteful examples of how such addictions can be and have been beaten.[/quote]

Discretion? You don't say....I'll have to re-evaluate my first post on this thread.

[quote name='Brother Adam' date='06 July 2010 - 07:37 PM' timestamp='1278459450' post='2138727']
....I am sorry that this thread has been a source of argument and confusion instead of hope, especially for one person who doesn't seem to at all understand what this thread is about and is obviously oblivious to my intentions. I can only hope they will find peace instead of trying to be argumentative for the sake of being argumentative because I have always thought better of them than this.[/quote]

I know very well what the thread is all about, Adam, and I don't appreciate the tongue-in-cheek insult in speaking to/about me in the third person. I have been very respectful of you and tried to get you into an honest and sincere--no ill-will--intellectual discussion because [i]you[/i] reached out for answers. I have answered your outreach and shall no more speak as you have closed yourself off to any further discussion with me.

-KJS