Striving For Charity

[Lil Red]

yes.

[Jaime]

[quote name='Hassan' date='18 July 2010 - 01:44 AM' timestamp='1279431845' post='2144294']
Ok, fine.

I think this thread misses the point. I think that overt personal attacks are merely symptomatic of a deeper problem. Subtle, passive aggressive snarkiness. For example, my Quran quote. I wanted to say what I am about to say now, but expressed it through the Qur'an to avoid crossing any line.

hot stuff. A week ago you said I was not a man, that I was a liar, to insignificant to even merit your disdain, and that I had no integrity. For my part, I called you arrogant, described some of your activities cowardly, generally mocked you quite a bit, and called you passive aggressive (I'm sure I have left many things out). These overt personal attacks were preceded by a good deal of snarky and petty bickering. Often coated in ambiguity so that a barb was never clearly and undeniably a barb. Honestly, I think this exacerbates any problems tenfold because when people become snarky and subtle to evade crossing the line it makes it difficult or impossible to differentiate between an innocuous statement or a barb. For example, when you (hot stuff) stated that DominicanSoul had 'good timing' in bumping this thread they day that many of us were returning from our suspension. Was this an innocent comment about the need of us all the be reminded to be charitable or were you flaunting that you avoided any apparent repercussions for your personal attacks, while many of us who do not have long and friendly relations with the mods were sent on vacation? I don't know and there is no way to ever know. And please do not think I am singling you out. I engage is subtle barbs all the time. This ambiguity has a cancerous effect on forum charity.

If this thread is a serious attempt at improving charity then I will do my best. To start off with I will apologize to hot stuff. I mocked you quite a bit here on phatmass and, particularly on the night that the real flamewar was going, said quite a few things on tinychat which I would have been banned for had I said them here. At the moment, I don't like you. This isn't fated to always be the case. There was a time when I really did not care for HisChildForever, KnightofChrist, and Apo. That has since changed and I have gained a genuine respect, and fondness, for all of them. I'm sure my dislike for you can change as well. I am sorry for mocking and belittling you and every other uncharitable action I have engaged in. I will genuinely try to be more charitable towards you (and everyone), if you are willing to also make an effort. You may have already been trying for that (For example, I noticed you haven't done the Hass thing today) but it is honestly hard to tell at times. I'm sorry this is public, I do not have access to private messaging. If you wish, I will edit it away.
[/quote]

Well first off I do appreciate the candor. You're probably right about the subtle barbs leading to things becoming more personal. There was a time (and some of the old timers can correct me if they disagree) where the subtle snarky comments were more generally accepted. In the earlier days, people didn't seem to take things as personally as they do today. Doing something stupid with someone's screen name was just that, doing something stupid. But its a different crowd now and its a different time. I can accept that.

My rule around here from the start was "Don't be the first to get snarky ." There were probably times when I failed in that rule. And it can be certainly said that I've gotten more than my share of quips and snarky comments in. If I thought someone was being rude to me or bullying one of the female posters,(we used to have some fairly sexist posters round these parts) I was more than happy to trade barbs. Now its may be likely that you have the similar criteria and you thought I was being a bully to rex. You and I would disagree about that but I certainly haven't taken the high road.

I completely understand that you don't like me. Jason says that you're a good guy and as much grief as i give him, I'm not dismissive of his opinions. There are some folks that I have never seen eye to eye with here and there are some that I've disliked and things changed. I've said much worse things about Lounge Daddy back in the day (he probably doesn't remember, he was drunk a lot back then) than I've ever said about you. Today I think the world of the guy. And there's a few where we started out as friends IRL and things changed. If things were to change between us I'd be fine with that.

Currently I've become more focused on the large amount of visitors that we have around. People who don't have accounts but come and lurk. I'd sincerely like to help make things around here be more welcoming to those folks. That's always been dUSt's goal and there have been times when I've lost sight of that.

So I apologize to you Hassan for the shots that I've taken that were uncharitable.

[Laudate_Dominum]

I do solemnly pledge to ever strive for authentic mexican food.

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='18 July 2010 - 02:53 PM' timestamp='1279486413' post='2144469']
I do solemnly pledge to ever strive for authentic mexican food.
[/quote]
I agree, and I shall strive to do the same thing.

[IcePrincessKRS]

Not funny.

[jeffpugh]

Yay, Hassan!

[Ash Wednesday]

Well done. There is a reason why I don't really post or participate here nearly as often as I used to.

[Jaime]

[quote name='Hassan' date='18 July 2010 - 03:15 PM' timestamp='1279480523' post='2144445']
That's why I said 'apparent'. I was speaking from the general perspective of those people who were sent on vacation for a week. Many people were put off when they heard that hot stuff posted in this thread a mere few days after the fact when so many of us were still suspended. To some of those people it seemed smug. I did not say that that perspective is accurate. I am not saying that hot stuff was being anything other than sincere. I was simply using that as an example of how all the snarking (which I have certainly contributed to) creates a toxic atmosphere where it is difficult or impossible to differentiate between a genuine or innocuous statement and an attempted barb.
[/quote]

I was chatting with Icey when she decided to post the thread. She asked me to look at it. Since I agreed with it, I said so.

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='IcePrincessKRS' date='18 July 2010 - 05:06 PM' timestamp='1279487173' post='2144472']
Not funny.
[/quote]
iawtc

[Lil Red]

great post, hot stuff.

[Azriel]

Wow. I've missed a lot. Maybe its a good thing I was away so long.

[IcePrincessKRS]

[fides quarens intellectum]

i voted yes, but still reserve the right to think pledges are for the

[Jaime]

I find it interesting that there are some regular phatmassers who have not signed this. Either they missed it or chose not to. If its the former, here it is, if its the latter, I'm curious as to why anyone would not want to strive for charity?

[Vincent Vega]

I am reluctant to sign because I am aware that charity is not my strong-suit.
In deciding whether to be hypocritical by signing and then not living up to it or not signing and therefore not being as good of a Catholic as I should, I have for the meantime chosen the passive option.
I may at any point change my mind and resolve to become better at being charitable.