The People Don't Want The Latin Mass

[Farsight one]

I must say that I prefer to be able to understand and to respond with understanding when I am at mass. So, I'd like mass in Latin every now and then, but I think it might ultimately be harmful on the whole if all masses went back to Latin.

[SJP]

Detroit has been blessed! The TLM is now being offered in some form (High or Low) in 17 Parishes! As opposed to only two prior to the Motu Proprio.

I had the opportunity to attend Mid-night Mass at St. Joseph's and I was amazed at how many young people were there, not to mention the placed was packed.

[Pio Nono]

JMJ
12/26 - St. Stephen the Protomartyr
[quote name='Veritas' post='1438429' date='Dec 25 2007, 08:31 PM']Was this back home or at the sem?[/quote]
At my home parish in SW Indiana. There is a priest from Chicago, a close friend of my pastor, who visits two or three times a year on vacation. When he comes down, he always offers at least one Low Mass. At Midnight Mass (with a packed house), he leaned over to me and said, "I guarantee that, if we advertized this as a Tridentine Midnight Mass, the Church would have been just as full." I think I agree.

[Deb]

[quote name='Nathan' post='1438401' date='Dec 25 2007, 05:43 PM']All I see from Catholic youth at my university is enthusiasm for the Tridentine Mass. They really, really want it.

Almost to a person, it is the old liberal fuddy-duddies (those who lived through Vatican II) who do not want the Tridentine Mass. Of course, if they had their way we would all be ordained priests, marrying transvestites on weekends, and watching partial-birth abortions live on TV for light entertainment, all funded by the tax-payer and blessed by a fallible, female pope.[/quote]

If this is how the Catholic youth talk about older Catholics, you really do need some more mass, of any kind. I remember the Tridentine mass as a child and I loved it and would still love it but, I go to church to worship God and the mass is still the mass whether in Latin or English. Get a grip.

[Deo Iuvente]

I know it's false.I love latin masses (Either tridentine or novus ordo). The majority of the people in my parish's two latin masses are young families with kids, and I'm 17.

[Totus Tuus]

A parish on a college campus close to where I live started doing a Tridentine Mass once a week recently, in the evening. There was an average of ONE student from the university at the daily morning Mass last semester. But the TLM boasted a good number of them. There's just something attractive about that form of the liturgy. I don't have a bias towards either one (I have really been attending both regularly for years), so this isn't coming from a Traddy. I really am just amazed at the difference in young-people-attendance at the TLM as opposed to the NO. And our Sunday TLM (which was the indult up till the Motu Proprio) has a lot more single young people who attend by themselves than the other Masses as far as I've observed.

[Nathan]

[quote name='Deb' post='1438575' date='Dec 26 2007, 02:15 PM']If this is how the Catholic youth talk about older Catholics, you really do need some more mass, of any kind. I remember the Tridentine mass as a child and I loved it and would still love it but, I go to church to worship God and the mass is still the mass whether in Latin or English. Get a grip.[/quote]

First of all, sorry about the language. I have a warped sense of humor at times, especially when writing on these issues, and I can get vitriolic when hammering home a point. This is just me.

Second, I have no ill-feelings toward the Novus Ordo Mass -- I love it, love it, love it. I also love the Tridentine Mass. My sentiments here seem to be the general consensus among young Catholics, at least in North America. But that's not the issue. The issue is with Catholics who don't like/don't want the Tridentine Mass, almost all of them fogies (youthfully speaking).

But [i]why[/i] don't they like it/want it? The reasons could be aesthetic, but the Tridentine Mass is a beautiful thing in this regard, at least as beautiful as the N.O. It could also be a concern with "modern" Catholics not enjoying the Tridentine Mass and a possible subsequent drop-off in Mass attendance, but the overwhelmingly positive response from Catholic youth is telling us another story -- they're going to Mass [i]more[/i], in greater numbers, and there's a lot more of us than there are of you. The future is sending a clear message to the past.

Frankly, it seems to ultimately come down to the theology of old liberal Catholics, those who still view the Second Vatican Council as some kind of revolutionary Protestantization/secularization of the Roman Catholic Church. They want "womenpriests," gay marriage, abortion, euthanasia, and a watering-down of all kind of dogma and doctrine on faith and morals, and they actually believe that Vatican II was the big green light for this. When they say "the spirit of Vatican II," this is what they mean. These Catholics view the Novus Ordo Mass as a great victory toward their idealistic "New Order" of the Church and thus they are very defensive about it and antagonistic toward the idea of going back to the pre-Vatican II days of darkness. In their eyes, the return of the Tridentine Mass is a symbol of defeat.

If the Tridentine Mass is the stake through their chest, I say pound it deeper and break it off. They have done nothing but ABUSE, HURT, and DAMAGE the Church over the past forty years and deserve to be put DOWN. Good riddance.

[Ash Wednesday]

The other misconception is that "only freakish back woods conservatives with bomb shelters and think the commies, Jews and masons run the church" want the Latin Mass.

My family and I got into a casual conversation about the latin mass and they share a lot of misconceptions -- one was: "omg aren't they switching back to latin mass?" I explained that, no, it was just going to be more available for people if they requested it. And I also said it's really beautiful and nothing to be afraid of...especially if it's sung.

Edited December 27, 2007 by Ash Wednesday

[Socrates]

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1438489' date='Dec 26 2007, 02:50 AM']I must say that I prefer to be able to understand and to respond with understanding when I am at mass. So, I'd like mass in Latin every now and then, but I think it might ultimately be harmful on the whole if all masses went back to Latin.[/quote]
Just a few quick points - First (While I'm not saying you make this claim), it is a common misconception that Latin is confined to the Tridentine Liturgy. Latin can and is used in in the "Novus Ordo" liturgy, and in fact was originally intented to have the pride of place in the liturgy. At my parish (which also has a Tridentine Mass) some of the priests say much of the the NO mass in Latin, and in the college I went to, many of the NO masses were said entirely in Latin.

Secondly, I've heard the claim often made aginst the Latin Mass because it "keeps the people from understanding the Mass."
However, at most parishes that have TLM, guides with an English translation are available, where one can read and follow along.
And plenty of people who attend Masses in English, have no real knowledge of what goes on at the Mass either, thanks to attrocious catechesis, as well as banal trasnslations.
I don't really object to Mass in English per se, though the current commonly-used translation is attrocious.

I think too often people are unwilling to put any effort into religion (by doing things such as learning the Latin Mass), and too often there has been a modern emphasis on dumbing things down, and making sure the liturgy is directed "for the people," with often disasterous results.

[Socrates]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' post='1438755' date='Dec 27 2007, 12:14 AM']The other misconception is that "only freakish back woods conservatives with bomb shelters and think the commies, Jews and masons run the church" want the Latin Mass. [/quote]
The "traditionalist" community certainly has its disproportionate share of those types, though they hardly represent everyone who attends the Latin Mass.

I'm afraid oftentimes the "rad trads" give traditionalism a bad name.

[Veritas]

[quote name='Pio Nono' post='1438513' date='Dec 26 2007, 10:15 AM']JMJ
12/26 - St. Stephen the Protomartyr

At my home parish in SW Indiana. There is a priest from Chicago, a close friend of my pastor, who visits two or three times a year on vacation. When he comes down, he always offers at least one Low Mass. At Midnight Mass (with a packed house), he leaned over to me and said, "I guarantee that, if we advertized this as a Tridentine Midnight Mass, the Church would have been just as full." I think I agree.[/quote]

+

I was talking to one of our SPS sems and he was telling me how they have the Latin Mass at the Sem once a month on Saturday morning (their big Mass). I freaked-out assuming he was talking about the TLM. But, in fact, he was talking about the NO in Lingua Latina, which is still pretty amazing considering where SPS was 10 years ago.

Say, heading to Chicago this weekend... any recommendations for a special dinner? Any old school churches that we should really see?

Buon Natale.

[Pio Nono]

JMJ
12/27 - St. John the Divine

Three "must see" churches in Chicago are St. John Cantius, St. Mary of the Angels, and the Basilica of St. Hyacinth. All of the really beautiful stuff has gone into those churches within the past twenty years.

As for eating, you've got to eat pizza when you go to Chicago. In the city, I personally like Giordano's. On the north side (but more out in the suburbs), the best pizza I've ever had is from a place called Lou Malnati's.

[brendan1104]

I heard Chicago pizza was the worst?

[Didacus]

I've never been to a latin mass and I would not let the opportunity pass. I want to experience a latin mass for sure.

Although, at 34 years old, do I count as a young person or as an old fluffy air extraction.



[color="#FFFFFF"][size=1]I still want to conquer the world.[/size][/color]

[Didacus]

[quote name='Socrates' post='1438760' date='Dec 27 2007, 12:35 AM'][SNIP]


I think too often people are unwilling to put any effort into religion (by doing things such as learning the Latin Mass), and too often there has been a modern emphasis on dumbing things down, and making sure the liturgy is directed "for the people," with often disasterous results.[/quote]


I think that last paragraphs is well worth noting. And you can count not only religion in this but many other things as well. I agree with you 100% Soc!









[color="#FFFFFF"]

[size=1]and I still want to conquer the world.[/size][/color]