Political Hell

[Jaime]

[quote name='Apotheoun' post='1466172' date='Feb 20 2008, 11:45 AM']I agree, and that is why I will not vote for Clinton, Obama, or McCain in the upcoming general election.[/quote]

Had you mentioned that before Todd? I can't remember

[Lounge Daddy]

What is the argument supporting McCain over Clinton? The argument is effectively the "lesser of two evils" argument.
What is Dismas's reason for supporting Clinton over Obama? It's effectively supporting the lesser of two evils.

Clinton is preferred over Obama, so vote for Clinton.
I'm not saying that I would do that, but I don't see where Dismas did anything wrong at all.

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='hot stuff' post='1466177' date='Feb 20 2008, 09:53 AM']Had you mentioned that before Todd? I can't remember[/quote]
Mentioned what before? That I will not vote for a "pro-choice" candidate?

[quote name='hot stuff' post='1465930' date='Feb 19 2008, 09:08 PM']You do not vote for a pro death candidate if you're Catholic. Period end of statement.[/quote]
I simply agree with your above comment.

Edited February 20, 2008 by Apotheoun

[dairygirl4u2c]

more proof that mccain is only wishy washy because he probably tends to think it's a lost cause. (half hte peoplulation is in favor of abortion early in the pregnancy) which isn't unreasonable.

in 2001 he said....
[quote]"otherwise intelligent people who say that that's the only issue that will determine their vote."

In response to criticism he declares that his "17-year voting record" in Congress proves that he is "pro-life."[/quote]

i have a feeling that people will emtotionally rather than rationally latch on to him saying that comment about intelligence, and ignore jaimie and my last posts.

apo is not being a hypocrite, by hte way, because he's never said that you have to vote for bush back in the day because of that issue etc. can that be said for you?

Edited February 20, 2008 by dairygirl4u2c

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' post='1466173' date='Feb 20 2008, 09:46 AM']NARAL even has a bashing article about him on their website bc he's too prolife. he voted 113 out of 117 times on the prolife issue.
[url="http://www.prochoiceamerica.org/elections/statements/mccain.html"]http://www.prochoiceamerica.org/elections/...nts/mccain.html[/url]

the evidence is indisputable, effectively.[/quote]

NARAL says he voted pro-choice (read: pro-death) 4 of those times.

The evidence is indisputable, effectively.

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote]NARAL says he voted pro-choice (read: pro-death) 4 of those times.

The evidence is indisputable, effectively.[/quote]

wow, four times out of 117. even bush wasn't perfect.

would you rather allow four to eight years of a democrat electing liberal justices and laws? or go out on a limb so you can maybe get someone who voted perfectly, and vote against someone who's got almost perfect record (the math is that he's 97% prolife on voting)?

i won't judge you as i don't know if you put voting for bush under pain of mortal sin on others. but if you did,,, then you sir are an idiot.

Edited February 20, 2008 by dairygirl4u2c

[Jaime]

[quote name='Lounge Daddy' post='1466179' date='Feb 20 2008, 11:55 AM']What is the argument supporting McCain over Clinton? The argument is effectively the "lesser of two evils" argument.
What is Dismas's reason for supporting Clinton over Obama? It's effectively supporting the lesser of two evils.

Clinton is preferred over Obama, so vote for Clinton.
I'm not saying that I would do that, but I don't see where Dismas did anything wrong at all.[/quote]


Well he really did as far as Church doctrine. We do not support one who "publicly supports abortion". Say what you want about McCain, he has stated publicly that he is prolife. Whether you believe him or not is inconsequential.

This is NOT "lesser of two evils" this is promoting evil for the hopes of an eventual good. And that is completely against Church teachings


And before my head explodes explain to me how Hillary is less prochoice than Obama?

[dairygirl4u2c]

he's probably fed into hte lies and rhetoric that he's the most liberal one.
the facts say otherwise, but don't let facts get in the way of anything...

[Lounge Daddy]

[quote name='hot stuff' post='1466198' date='Feb 20 2008, 01:25 PM']Well he really did as far as Church doctrine. We do not support one who "publicly supports abortion". Say what you want about McCain, he has stated publicly that he is prolife. Whether you believe him or not is inconsequential.

This is NOT "lesser of two evils" this is promoting evil for the hopes of an eventual good. And that is completely against Church teachings
And before my head explodes explain to me how Hillary is less prochoice than Obama?[/quote]
ok. I see your point.

[BG45]

Not to be mean or destructive, but how can any of you justify voting? (With the possible exception of Apotheoun who has already said he isn't voting McCain, Obama, or Clinton.)

McCain supports embryonic stem cell research. Obama and Clinton support abortion. Without going into any more detail, there's some items.

Second question, doesn't being Pro-Life mean all human life, and not just the unborn? What of the death penalty?

Thanks ahead of time for any explanations.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='BG45' post='1466248' date='Feb 20 2008, 02:53 PM']Not to be mean or destructive, but how can any of you justify voting? (With the possible exception of Apotheoun who has already said he isn't voting McCain, Obama, or Clinton.)

McCain supports embryonic stem cell research. Obama and Clinton support abortion. Without going into any more detail, there's some items.

Second question, doesn't being Pro-Life mean all human life, and not just the unborn? What of the death penalty?

Thanks ahead of time for any explanations.[/quote]
Not voting is a sin. Abortion is the deal breaker for any candidate, and McCain evidently is not pro-abortion. The death penalty is not in the same category as abortion. Abortion is the murder for pay of an innocent human life, capital punishment is the execution of a convicted criminal = they are NOT equal.

[dairygirl4u2c]

theology says that if you are bound to make a decision, you must make the lesser of two evils.
you don't have to vote, but if you don't vote, you will be effectively voting for teh worse person.
you have no option, then, and are forced to vote for the lesser of all evils.

even those who say the ends do not justify the means are willing to say this is a necessary execption because of circumstance, the lesser of two or more evils argument.

[XIX]

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' post='1466191' date='Feb 20 2008, 01:05 PM']even bush wasn't perfect.[/quote]
If I got a dollar for every time I heard that...






















































I'd have a dollar.

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' post='1466191' date='Feb 20 2008, 10:05 AM']wow, four times out of 117. even bush wasn't perfect.

would you rather allow four to eight years of a democrat electing liberal justices and laws? or go out on a limb so you can maybe get someone who voted perfectly, and vote against someone who's got almost perfect record (the math is that he's 97% prolife on voting)?

i won't judge you as i don't know if you put voting for bush under pain of mortal sin on others. but if you did,,, then you sir are an idiot.[/quote]

Not once in my life have I ever been, nor did I think I would ever be, called an idiot by someone who is unable to find the Shift Key. I guess there's a first time for everything.

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote]Not once in my life have I ever been, nor did I think I would ever be, called an idiot by someone who is unable to find the Shift Key. I guess there's a first time for everything.[/quote]

nice ad hominem.
even if i called you an idiot, it wasn't an ad hominem, because i backed up my name calling with argumentation... i didn't rest on that alone.

i'm not saying you're an idiot. if you did all that stuff i described, then, yes, you are an idioit.

come back when you can either say you don't believe that stuff, or actually can form a coherent argument.