Obama, The Anti-christ?

[kujo]

[quote name='lilac_angel' post='1630333' date='Aug 18 2008, 02:55 AM']Yeah... but apparently not as serious of a sin as wondering if Obama might be the Antichrist on a Catholic forum... [/quote]

The reason I, and others, find these accusations so inflammatory is because they undermine any efforts we undertake to appeal to non-Catholics and show them the beauty and intellectual richness of the Church's teachings. They could see this sort of stuff and rightfully question our sanity. It makes our battle even more arduous than it already is.

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='kujo' post='1630343' date='Aug 18 2008, 04:10 AM']The reason I, and others, find these accusations so inflammatory is because they undermine any efforts we undertake to appeal to non-Catholics and show them the beauty and intellectual richness of the Church's teachings. They could see this sort of stuff and rightfully question our sanity. It makes our battle even more arduous than it already is.[/quote]

There will be an Antichrist he will come one day, so this discussion will seriously have to take place some time by faithful Catholics. Again I have doubts that Obama is the Antichrist, but we can not be 100% sure that he is not. He is powerful man, who support the Abortion Holocaust which makes him an Antichrist, and therefor has at least the potential of being the Antichrist.

Akalyte hasn't even posted for two pages, we may not agree with his views, but he has not said anything 'stupid', 'insane', or 'unintellectual.' Those that disagree with him should stick with good counter arguments such as the snopes link earlier in the thread, instead of making comments that falsely make it seem Akalyte has lost his sanity.

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote name='MakeYouThink' post='1630318' date='Aug 18 2008, 12:18 AM']Yeah, anybody who denies Jesus Christ came in the flesh is Anti-Christ.

Obama, imho, is not the Anti-Christ, because the people in the highest circles of the occult are looking for someone born 50 years after Alister Crowley, who was considered the wickedest man alive at the turn of the century, who looks exactly like him. Obama, was born way before 1988, not to mention that Alister was Caucasion.[/quote]

i wonder why you say they are "the people in the highest circles" as if you have the essential source on this.
i know people just as credentialed, if not more, probably more in my opinion, who says the antichrist is not going to come for hundreds of years.
for one example:
[url="http://www.catholicplanet.com/future/antichrist-timeline.htm"]http://www.catholicplanet.com/future/antichrist-timeline.htm[/url]

[dairygirl4u2c]

it should also be noted,,, that catholic bibles in the commentary, likke those official commentaries etc... say that the antichrist was probably nero from the first or so century.

[kujo]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1630365' date='Aug 18 2008, 07:19 AM']There will be an Antichrist he will come one day, so this discussion will seriously have to take place some time by faithful Catholics. Again I have doubts that Obama is the Antichrist, but we can not be 100% sure that he is not. He is powerful man, who support the Abortion Holocaust which makes him an Antichrist, and therefor has at least the potential of being the Antichrist.

Akalyte hasn't even posted for two pages, we may not agree with his views, but he has not said anything 'stupid', 'insane', or 'unintellectual.' Those that disagree with him should stick with good counter arguments such as the snopes link earlier in the thread, instead of making comments that falsely make it seem Akalyte has lost his sanity.[/quote]

First off, no one has attacked Akalyte personally. Being the person who has expressed the most disgust with this subject, I know that I have just commented that his opinion is silly.

Secondly, I have the right to post anything I want. I don't have to post articles or sources or present "counter arguments" to something like this. If someone came on here and started a thread that said "It appears that dogs and cats are the same thing," would we have to cite scholars to dispute that claim?

Thirdly, I am aware that "the anti-Christ" will appear. But, as others have taken the time to post reasons why Obama is NOT that person, I tend to agree and have placed it in the "Not concerned about this right now" file in my brain. Sure, [i]anything[/i] is possible, but that is not a valid argument. He [i]could[/i] be "the anti-Christ."Chances are, though, that he's not.

Finally, I think the term "anti-Christ" is a loaded term, especially in the manner it is being used here. I feel like it's nothing more than a label used to dismiss people. Of course, anyone who supports abortion in any way is in a state of serious mortal sin, but where is the line drawn? Can we be "anti-Christs" when we turn away from him and choose the things of this world over His amazing love for us? I dunno.

Edited August 18, 2008 by kujo

[dominicansoul]

I think things get much more serious when you are in a position where your turning away from God will affect the lives of millions...

...as Obama with Abortion...it's not just his sin that's affecting his life...it'll affect the lives of millions of babies in the U.S.A., hence, those who believe he could very well be the anti-Christ.

But as I stated above, I don't think he is...but I do believe he's diabolical, and all those who are for abortion and do all they can to promote this practice are as well.

[kujo]

[quote name='dominicansoul' post='1630555' date='Aug 18 2008, 02:19 PM']I think things get much more serious when you are in a position where your turning away from God will affect the lives of millions...

...as Obama with Abortion...it's not just his sin that's affecting his life...it'll affect the lives of millions of babies in the U.S.A., hence, those who believe he could very well be the anti-Christ.

But as I stated above, I don't think he is...but I do believe he's diabolical, and all those who are for abortion and do all they can to promote this practice are as well.[/quote]

My question is where is the line? Where does one's personal sins become a danger to the public? When he's a "leader?" If so, how many people does he have to have influence over before he is considered "an anti-Christ?" Millions? Thousands? Hundreds?

[dominicansoul]

Well..actually, I have always understood no sin is personal...it affect everyone.

As for being nominated as the anti-Christ...I just think Obama gets this because he is on the cusp of becoming the most powerful leader in the world. So, it's sin and power together...that's where you can start drawing the line...

But personally, I'm kinda like you, where I don't think much about it. Who? when? where? is the Anti-Christ. I'm not really looking for him. I just know I gotta stay in God's good graces because if things start going down and the end times begin...I'll be able to recognize the good from the bad and be part of that crowd that does the right things for God and with God.

[Fidei Defensor]

What I don't understand is why can't other world leaders be the anti-christ? There are a lot worse things going on in the world than Obama.

[lilac_angel]

[quote name='kujo' post='1630343' date='Aug 18 2008, 04:10 AM']The reason I, and others, find these accusations so inflammatory is because they undermine any efforts we undertake to appeal to non-Catholics and show them the beauty and intellectual richness of the Church's teachings. They could see this sort of stuff and rightfully question our sanity. It makes our battle even more arduous than it already is.[/quote]

I heard a lot of the claims from Bible-only Christians, originally, actually...I don't think they were Catholics.

I myself don't know and never made a solid accusation, but since I previously did have questions in my mind, I thought I'd entertain them in this thread. I won't do that anymore, though. I haven't been worrying about it for a while. Obama does get me worried a little bit that the end is nigh, but that only strengthens my spiritual life and I simply increase my spiritual vigilance.

Edited August 18, 2008 by lilac_angel

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote name='fidei defensor' post='1630580' date='Aug 18 2008, 12:49 PM']What I don't understand is why can't other world leaders be the anti-christ? There are a lot worse things going on in the world than Obama.[/quote]

good call.
it's kinda like those people who think when aliens come and say take us to your leader.... that it'd be the USA president.
they'd probably not even say it to USA people, and obvioulsy teh president of the USA is not the leader of the world, by far.

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='kujo' post='1630557' date='Aug 18 2008, 01:25 PM']My question is where is the line? Where does one's personal sins become a danger to the public? When he's a "leader?" If so, how many people does he have to have influence over before he is considered "an anti-Christ?" Millions? Thousands? Hundreds?[/quote]

To be an antichrist one must first reject some moral or foundational part of Christian Truth. As others have said all sins effect everyone. But the more public sin is the more it effects the people and the popular the sinner is effects more people.

[MakeYouThink]

[quote name='lilac_angel' post='1630319' date='Aug 18 2008, 01:21 AM']Why would those in the occult actually await the Anti-Christ when it's been prophesied (by the people who put forth the whole anti-Christ thing in the first place) that they're all going to be squashed in defeat? I thought they were occultists because they thought Christianity was bunk anyway. And the devil is a complete liar, so why do they trust him or his minions for valid prophecy in the first place? Just wondering. [/quote]

As scripture has foretold, all occultists have taken their refuge in lies. They actually believe they can fight God and win. Unfortunately, they are foolish, proud, and will be squashed in defeat.

[MakeYouThink]

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' post='1630453' date='Aug 18 2008, 11:29 AM']i wonder why you say they are "the people in the highest circles" as if you have the essential source on this.
i know people just as credentialed, if not more, probably more in my opinion, who says the antichrist is not going to come for hundreds of years.
for one example:
[url="http://www.catholicplanet.com/future/antichrist-timeline.htm"]http://www.catholicplanet.com/future/antichrist-timeline.htm[/url][/quote]

Yeah, I have it on good authority, from someone who use to help Occultists come out of their world of Darkness to giving their lives over to God. They taught him a lot of things, which in turn, he has shared with others, like myself.

[Winchester]

There is no "the" antichrist. That makes this thread kind of ridiculous. There are many antichrists--revelations has happened is happening and will happen.