A Little Story...

[Blanket Maker]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1765637' date='Jan 29 2009, 11:32 AM']O I know that, I am trying to get a feel on what blanketmaker believes. Its hard to dialogue with a blank slate.[/quote]

For the sake of this topic, I beleive in neither, it is I who am asking for you to teach.

And what is love then?

[Arpy]

To love a person in the highest sense of the word is to wish that person the eternal possession of God and lead him to it.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Blanket Maker' post='1766874' date='Jan 30 2009, 05:30 PM']For the sake of this topic, I beleive in neither, it is I who am asking for you to teach.

And what is love then?[/quote]
Nope, lets not do the "for the sake of the topic" stuff, lets just find out what your beliefs and understanding and we will go from there.

Conversation is a two-way street.

[Blanket Maker]

[quote name='Arpy' post='1766882' date='Jan 30 2009, 05:44 PM']To love a person in the highest sense of the word is to wish that person the eternal possession of God and lead him to it.[/quote]

I adore your picture,

but your explination confuses me, could you explain it in more lamen terms?

[Blanket Maker]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1766890' date='Jan 30 2009, 06:00 PM']Nope, lets not do the "for the sake of the topic" stuff, lets just find out what your beliefs and understanding and we will go from there.

Conversation is a two-way street.[/quote]

I choose to keep it to the topic, my questions are not what I belevie, I want to know what it is that YOU believe, then I will give my input when I'm good and ready. Every time I have tried before, the people here tend to shut me out saying, "It's faith" when I do no understand.

So thank you for your time, I'm sorry I can not entertain you in the way you wish. I'm not being scared away by you this time.

So please, stop going after me, and lets stick to the topic at hand.

How do you define love?

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Blanket Maker' post='1767400' date='Jan 31 2009, 02:04 AM']I choose to keep it to the topic, my questions are not what I belevie, I want to know what it is that YOU believe, then I will give my input when I'm good and ready. Every time I have tried before, the people here tend to shut me out saying, "It's faith" when I do no understand.

So thank you for your time, I'm sorry I can not entertain you in the way you wish. I'm not being scared away by you this time.

So please, stop going after me, and lets stick to the topic at hand.

How do you define love?[/quote]
LOL. So you want no actual conversation, just definitions?
1 Cor: 13
4 Love is patient and kind; love is not jealous or boastful; 5 it is not arrogant or rude. Love does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; 6 it does not rejoice at wrong, but rejoices in the right. 7 Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
8 Love never ends; as for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away. 9 For our knowledge is imperfect and our prophecy is imperfect; 10 but when the perfect comes, the imperfect will pass away. 11 When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child; when I became a man, I gave up childish ways. 12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall understand fully, even as I have been fully understood. 13 So faith, hope, love abide, these three; but the greatest of these is love. (1Corinthians (RSV) 13)

[Blanket Maker]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1767407' date='Jan 31 2009, 02:15 AM']LOL. So you want no actual conversation, just definitions?[/quote]

I never stated that, I asked for your opinion, I believe I stated that quite clearly.

So personal opinion, think fo it as an interview and not a conversation (though I'll add my little tidbits of personal opinion from time to time...I'm not that strict)

[journeyman]

question 5 follow up

original question:

[quote name='Blanket Maker' post='1760012' date='Jan 24 2009, 02:12 AM']If God made all things, how did non-natural objects come to be?[/quote]


[quote name='Blanket Maker' post='1760994' date='Jan 25 2009, 02:37 AM']Could you please rephrase your answer, "All things appears to include objects as well as things - in asking the question, you answered it." perhaps use a more descriptive word than 'things' for those get rather mixed in object, quickly.[/quote]


please tell me how you define "non-natural objects" I view those as a subset of "all things" and could not be created in another way if God made all things.

Not being an eyewitness, my belief that God made all things is an element of faith.

Edited February 1, 2009 by journeyman

[journeyman]

Question 11

[quote name='Blanket Maker' post='1760012' date='Jan 24 2009, 02:12 AM']Why do I say the apostles creed, stating "I believe..." when I can not believe before I do understand?[/quote]


There are many things believed by modern man which are not understood. Some are generalized conclusions drawn from observation . . . airplanes fly . . . wood floats . . . but can I explain why an airplane flies or wood floats (or why some airplanes don't fly and some wood doesn't float) . . . I cannot because my scientific language is inadequate, but my observations support the science I do not understand, so I believe.

I believe (again, without first hand knowledge, but documentation appears to support the belief) that St. Anselm's motto was "faith seeking understanding." In order to avoid some potential ambiguity, let's restate that motto as "an active love of God (faith) seeking a deeper knowledge of God (understanding)."

[Anselm of Canterbury (1033-1109) - Benedictine monk, teacher, abbot, archbishop]

Was this question directed at the contents of the creed or merely at the facially apparent contradiction of a person saying "I believe" when they did not "understand" their belief?

[Blanket Maker]

[quote name='journeyman' post='1767965' date='Jan 31 2009, 09:04 PM']please tell me how you define "non-natural objects" I view those as a subset of "all things" and could not be created in another way if God made all things.[/quote]

Steel.
Non natural, did not exsist for quite some time, by anyones history.

[Blanket Maker]

[quote name='journeyman' post='1767984' date='Jan 31 2009, 09:36 PM']Question 11




There are many things believed by modern man which are not understood. Some are generalized conclusions drawn from observation . . . airplanes fly . . . wood floats . . . but can I explain why an airplane flies or wood floats (or why some airplanes don't fly and some wood doesn't float) . . . I cannot because my scientific language is inadequate, but my observations support the science I do not understand, so I believe.

I believe (again, without first hand knowledge, but documentation appears to support the belief) that St. Anselm's motto was "faith seeking understanding." In order to avoid some potential ambiguity, let's restate that motto as "an active love of God (faith) seeking a deeper knowledge of God (understanding)."

[Anselm of Canterbury (1033-1109) - Benedictine monk, teacher, abbot, archbishop]

Was this question directed at the contents of the creed or merely at the facially apparent contradiction of a person saying "I believe" when they did not "understand" their belief?[/quote]

a pleasant mind set to start off of "Faith, then understanding" but for those who were not taught faith before understanding the approach is the same to standing atop a building and being told "Take a step off the edge, you'll walk, not fall."

[journeyman]

[quote name='Blanket Maker' post='1768981' date='Feb 1 2009, 10:10 PM']QUOTE (journeyman @ Jan 31 2009, 09:04 PM) *
please tell me how you define "non-natural objects" I view those as a subset of "all things" and could not be created in another way if God made all things.

Steel.
Non natural, did not exsist for quite some time, by anyones history.[/quote]


Steel results from mixing iron ore and coke (coal) (natural minerals) - thus steel was made by men from things created by God and is not a "new" thing, just a mixture - the curiosity, intellect, ingenuity and creativity that allows men to mix natural objects (things) and make something different is a gift from a loving God

[journeyman]

[quote name='Blanket Maker' post='1768983' date='Feb 1 2009, 10:14 PM']QUOTE (journeyman @ Jan 31 2009, 09:36 PM) *
Question 11


There are many things believed by modern man which are not understood. Some are generalized conclusions drawn from observation . . . airplanes fly . . . wood floats . . . but can I explain why an airplane flies or wood floats (or why some airplanes don't fly and some wood doesn't float) . . . I cannot because my scientific language is inadequate, but my observations support the science I do not understand, so I believe.

I believe (again, without first hand knowledge, but documentation appears to support the belief) that St. Anselm's motto was "faith seeking understanding." In order to avoid some potential ambiguity, let's restate that motto as "an active love of God (faith) seeking a deeper knowledge of God (understanding)."

[Anselm of Canterbury (1033-1109) - Benedictine monk, teacher, abbot, archbishop]

Was this question directed at the contents of the creed or merely at the facially apparent contradiction of a person saying "I believe" when they did not "understand" their belief?



a pleasant mind set to start off of "Faith, then understanding" but for those who were not taught faith before understanding the approach is the same to standing atop a building and being told "Take a step off the edge, you'll walk, not fall."[/quote]

Respect for observed natural laws is a matter of learned belief and not faith

If a supernatural being, who you know loves you and wishes you no harm, and is apparently standing in the air a dozen feet from the edge of the building were to make such a statement, your desire to believe is premised on your faith in their good intentions
just as your belief that a ship will not sink and an airplane will fly is premised on your faith in the designers, builders and maintainers of the craft

there is such a moment in the 14th chapter of the Gospel according to Matthew
[size=1]14:27. And immediately Jesus spoke to them, saying: Be of good heart: it is I, fear ye not. 14:28. And Peter making answer, said: Lord, if it be thou, bid me come to thee upon the waters. 14:29. And he said: Come. And Peter going down out of the boat walked upon the water to come to Jesus. 14:30. But seeing the wind strong, he was afraid: and when he began to sink, he cried out, saying: Lord, save me. 14:31. And immediately Jesus stretching forth his hand took hold of him, and said to him: O thou of little faith, why didst thou doubt? 14:32. And when they were come up into the boat, the wind ceased. [/size]