Stuff To Do With A Theology Degree...

[uppercut55]

be a pirate.

argg.

no, actually, i think being in a ministry of some sort would be good for someone with a theology degree.

[Jaime]

[quote]Personally I think studying theology only at the bachelor's or even master's degree level is a waste of time, money, resources, etc. Someone with only a bachelor's degree in theology is never going to be more than an armchair theologian. If your primary goal is to learn more about your faith, you can study it as a hobby and become just as well-informed as someone with a B.S. in Theology smile.gif[/quote]

Yeah there's a bunch of us who have "wasted our time" on this board Maggie.

[CatherineM]

Wasting my time working on a Masters beats sitting at home ironing shirts.

[StColette]

[quote name='Maggie' post='1815022' date='Mar 23 2009, 06:52 PM']Personally I think studying theology only at the bachelor's or even master's degree level is a waste of time, money, resources, etc. Someone with only a bachelor's degree in theology is never going to be more than an armchair theologian.[/quote]

I disagree. One must first study at these levels before going toward a PhD. So it can not be considered a waste of time only studying to a bachelor's or master's level if that's all someone can afford at the moment. Also, that's God call not ours. If God is calling someone to only study to a bachelor or master degree level then that's up to Him not up to you. And who are you to decide that someone with only a bachelor's is a armchair anything. I know many people who only have bachelor's and some without degrees at all that could rival the minds of many PhDs. I can think of a few Saints that could out do almost any PhD in Theology. Saints who did not have any education whatsoever. And yes, you may argue that "Well, they were given that knowledge by God, etc." Frankly, who are we to say that others today are not given that same privilege from the Father. And furthermore, one does not have to be an insider with other well known scholars or be a well known scholar in order to be a good Theologian or a good anything for that matter. Studying Theology whether at the level of Bachelors, Masters, or PhD is not done so because of love of self and the need for recognition but because for love of God.

[quote]However if Norway is really all that much cheaper than the US maybe you should go for it! The main problem in the U.S. is that there is hugely hard to support a family with a theology degree (unless you're already rich). Personally I think in the US there are WAY more people studying theology than are actually called to it.[/quote]

If a person can support a family by working at Wal-mart or a fast food place then a person can support a family with a Theology degree.

[quote]That is my major beef with schools like Franciscan, they do NOT really help their students discern their theology degree, they are happy to take the students' loan money and then down the road the alumni have to pay the price.[/quote]

Actually, the University goes over this with it's Theology students on a regular basis. You are even required to sign a form understanding that it's not a big money making degree. Which is why most people at Franciscan double major, one is normally Theology and the other is something like English, Nursing, Math, etc.

[CatherineM]

I also like spending my days with seminarians. I'm enjoying the idea that I am going to warp them in some way. If one of them becomes Pope, and I'm still alive, I hope to get the opportunity to over-starch his cassock.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='Maggie' post='1815022' date='Mar 23 2009, 06:52 PM']If you are going to study theology, go "all the way" and get your PhD! Then you could be a university professor... let's just say tenure is a super nice thing to have. Do they have the tenure concept in Norway?

Personally I think studying theology only at the bachelor's or even master's degree level is a waste of time, money, resources, etc. Someone with only a bachelor's degree in theology is never going to be more than an armchair theologian. If your primary goal is to learn more about your faith, you can study it as a hobby and become just as well-informed as someone with a B.S. in Theology

However if Norway is really all that much cheaper than the US maybe you should go for it! The main problem in the U.S. is that there is hugely hard to support a family with a theology degree (unless you're already rich). Personally I think in the US there are WAY more people studying theology than are actually called to it. That is my major beef with schools like Franciscan, they do NOT really help their students discern their theology degree, they are happy to take the students' loan money and then down the road the alumni have to pay the price.[/quote]

While I agree that there are probably people studying theology who will not find a job in the field, I disagree with the implicit claim that those studying a certain field in school have to find a job in that field. Theology is an art (you get a B.A. in theology, not a B.S. as you said) and is related to the liberal arts (although the traditional liberal arts don't include theology per se). As such, while a person can indeed seek work in the field, that is not the point of the course of studies. Liberal arts are meant to help make man more free (thus "liberal") by giving him a greater knowledge of the world and its Creator. They are different from occupational topics, which seek to help man work more effectively.

A theology degree is worth its weight in gold whether or not a student of theology ever makes any gold (or silver, copper, bronze, or nickel). The degree is for the betterment of the individual and society on a spiritual and moral level and that is a more lofty goal than any occupational field.

So yes, there may be more theologians than are called to work in the field, but there are far too few people going to college to study theology. I have a degree in theology and I'm going to be teaching math this fall. I still plan on getting my masters. Why? Because theology is my passion. When I come home from a day of teaching math, I will have the skill and training to sit down and consider God. When all is done, animals sleep, but man contemplates.

In fact, I am leaving a job in ministry so that I may have more time to consider theology and be re-created daily by greater understanding of God.

Addendum: you don't need a PhD to teach theology. Most universities will let you teach it with an MA. Also, any level of theology helps people to minister on the parish and diocesan level. It'd be great if every catechist had a PhD in theology, but imagine the salary cost! People with BAs in theology do a lot of good all over the world.

[Lil Red]

+J.M.J.+
what's really sad is some colleges that give out theology degrees. i know someone who has a theology degree from a Catholic university that was never taught much of anything about Mary and her role in the Catholic Church. that made me incredibly sad.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='Lil Red' post='1815636' date='Mar 24 2009, 04:38 PM']+J.M.J.+
what's really sad is some colleges that give out theology degrees. i know someone who has a theology degree from a Catholic university that was never taught much of anything about Mary and her role in the Catholic Church. that made me incredibly sad.[/quote]
While I can see why that's sad, you've got to keep in mind that there are SO many courses a theology major can take. Mariology is probably rarely required, but in all honesty (and without any disrespect to our Blessed Mother) is a secondary topic. FUS required Old Testament, New Testament, Christology, Sacramentology, Ecclesiology, and a few others, all of which are very central. Much about Mary would be covered in Christology, but in relation to Christ, so it someone probably wouldn't say, "yeah, I learned about Mary today in Christology."

However, I do think Mariology courses should be highly encouraged at Catholic universities.

[jksoren]

[quote name='Raphael' post='1815634' date='Mar 24 2009, 03:36 PM']Addendum: you don't need a PhD to teach theology. Most universities will let you teach it with an MA. Also, any level of theology helps people to minister on the parish and diocesan level. It'd be great if every catechist had a PhD in theology, but imagine the salary cost! People with BAs in theology do a lot of good all over the world.[/quote]

Actually almost NO university will let you teach with just an MA, not even if it's from a top school. This means that even fewer universities are likely to let you teach if you have a degree from an academically unrecognized school such as Franciscan. We have Franciscan grads teaching in the theology department, right, but that's actually not a good thing! It shows, or it ought to show, that our school has poor placement for such individuals elsewhere (either in PhD programs or other work). Having an MA, and I pretty much have one (just have to pass a few more classes), does NOT make you qualified to teach college. However, you can teach community college, often, with just an MA....but again, even Jefferson Community College in Steubenville (the worst community college that I have ever seen) wouldn't touch me with a 10 foot pole. They did hire my wife though, because she has an MA in English from Duquesne. And they did hire a friend of mine (graduate of the MA program at Franciscan) to teach math because he has a math degree from one of the nations top universities and no one at JCC knows math.

It is true that theology does help people minister at their local parish, but I don't think one ought to pay $40, 000 for the qualifications. It's really much better to just read on your own. I also have a hard time getting behind this notion of a "professional catechist"...I just don't know why the Church ought to pay anyone for such a service. The truth is, if you're faithful, you are probably going to seek (on your own) all of the necessary theological truth needed to catechize you and your children. It's really to proselytize to weaker parishioners who don't care all that much that we bother having DRE's etc. I've never learned anything from a DRE or CCD teacher, personally, and my children will never attend the classes at our parish. Likely, we will simply teach them ourselves. The people getting paid to teach kids who come from homes that don't go to mass or pray are wasting their time (same goes for RCIA classes for people who just want to get baptized/confirmed so that they can get married in the Church) because their pupils do not care. They might later, like I did, though. When they DO care then, ironically enough, they probably won't need the services! They'll read, go to conferences, talk to faithful Catholics that they know etc, and thus learn everything a DRE or catechist was supposed to be trained to teach them. In short, CCD/catechists are just a waste of Church resources...its really a job for relgious and clergy and the laity involved are honestly, inadvertently mooching off the Church.

[princessgianna]

[quote name='scardella' post='1814932' date='Mar 23 2009, 03:14 PM']<tongue-in-cheek>You could get your MRS.</tongue-in-cheek>[/quote]


srisously you could

[Apotheoun]

I got my MA in theology because I enjoy the subject. End of message.

[TotusTuusMaria]

[quote name='jksoren' post='1823217' date='Apr 3 2009, 12:44 AM']In short, CCD/catechists are just a waste of Church resources...its really a job for relgious and clergy and the laity involved are honestly, inadvertently mooching off the Church.[/quote]

I very much disagree with this.

Not every child that comes out a catechism class is going to desire holiness and be in love with the truth taught there-in. You are right that many don't care. I disagree though that all don't care and that catechists/CCD teachers are a waste of Church resources.

When I came into the Church I was fourteen and was placed into one of these classes once a week. A lay woman taught the class and I will never be able to thank her for what she gave me and my family. I have learned so much from her and even now I go to her weekly to discuss spiritual books. She is an amazing woman and teacher. No religious or priest possibly could have done what she did for me. Her teaching style was unique and I know many girls that have come out of her class with a love for truth that they just simply did not have when they came in. God uses her to implant a love of truth in them. She is, inadvertently, not mooching of the Church. She has responded to God's call to teach and lead souls to Christ and a better understanding of him. The Church is not "wasting their resources on her."

And as for the DRE she is amazing as well. We are so blessed to have her in our parish. So many lives have been touched by her, and many of us keep her in our prayers due to her ill health because when she is gone the religious education in our parish will probably unfortunately take a major swing in a bad direction. She is a great force in our parish and many souls will thank her when they meet her in heaven for allowing God to use her to get them there.

I think you greatly underestimate the roles of these lay people and their impact on the parish.

[Thomist-in-Training]

University of Dallas <mutters under breath> is very Vatican II, I don't just mean in a vague way, I mean Moral Theology is centered around one of the documents, I forget which, probably Lumen Gentium, Gaudium et Spes or Dign. Hum. </end mutter> has a strong core curriculum in liberal arts and a theology program and I [i]believe [/i]is more academically respected. I don't have impartial certainty of this though.

Also interesting in relation to the topic of the thread: although UD has a fairly even balance AFAIK in history, languages, even science, I do note that it has only one female theology professor out of five or eight, and she is a "Mrs." not a "Dr," and the wife of a male theology Dr., and she teaches only entry-level classes. Just interesting to notice.

[StColette]

[quote name='Thomist-in-Training' post='1823526' date='Apr 3 2009, 01:53 PM']Also interesting in relation to the topic of the thread: although UD has a fairly even balance AFAIK in history, languages, even science, I do note that it has only one female theology professor out of five or eight, and she is a "Mrs." not a "Dr," and the wife of a male theology Dr., and she teaches only entry-level classes. Just interesting to notice.[/quote]

It's my observation that many women don't go into the academic setting of teaching at the University level. Most stay in the High School academic area, youth ministry, or DRE. At least that's my personal observation. My goal is to teach at college level, but currently I'm putting that on hold because of the little one, but some day if God wills. If not I'll use my degree to better catechize my children and the children I teach in PSR.

I have never regretted the time or money I spent at Franciscan, other than when crazy pregnancy hormones started talking lol

You could manage to learn a lot from reading on your own, but that could never replace the classroom setting, etc.

It was worth it for me, and I gave up a 4 yr free scholarship to any LA for FUS.

btw I find it interesting jksoren that your first posts on phatmass are on this thread complaining about Franciscan.

[Sojourner]

It is true that in order to teach in almost any respected colleges you have to have a doctorate. Smaller universities who have trouble attracting professors because of a poorer academic reputation or a poor location, are more willing to compromise on qualifications of those in teaching positions. For example, I once taught a introductory journalism class at a small university with only a bachelor's degree. But that's unusual. My school, the University of St. Thomas, employs nearly 30 professors and associate professors in the theology department, all of whom either have doctorates or are completing doctoral degrees. They come from a variety of institutions.

To the charge that many theology programs at more prestigious universities are heterodox: I have only looked briefly into doctoral programs, but I can tell you that typically if you are interested in a doctorate you don't look as much for a program you are wanting to work in as for a person you want to work under. You will, of course, take classes within the department, but the orthodoxy (or lack thereof) of the entire department is not as much a concern at the doctoral level as it might be at an undergraduate level. You really want one good person whose scholarship you admire and who you want to help you guide your own scholarship.