Lounge Daddy Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 (edited) [quote name='USAirwaysIHS' post='1832048' date='Apr 11 2009, 04:20 PM']I wouldn't consider them so. But, as I just said, Islam [i]is[/i] a Judeo-Christian religion. Why would he be trying to hide that from them?[/quote] Yes -- I agree. With both points. [quote name='USAirwaysIHS' post='1832033' date='Apr 11 2009, 04:00 PM']Our morals, and the morals of the West-at-large are based upon Judeo-Christian morals, yes. Still, we're no more a Christian nation than we are a Jewish nation. Do we have a national Church, or a national Religion? And to point out: Islam is a religion based upon the Judeo-Christian tradition, lest we forget.[/quote] I agree with that too. Sometimes I get the impression that by "Christian Nation" some people suggest we were once somehow a theocracy. Which is total nonsense. That's the kind of thing that our nation's Fathers were running from. Edited April 11, 2009 by Lounge Daddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 [quote name='Lounge Daddy' post='1832158' date='Apr 11 2009, 06:41 PM']Yes -- I agree. With both points. I agree with that too. Sometimes I get the impression that by "Christian Nation" some people suggest we were once somehow a theocracy. Which is total nonsense. That's the kind of thing that our nation's Fathers were running from.[/quote] But why won't Obama just say that we are a nation founded on Judeo-Christian principles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lounge Daddy Posted April 11, 2009 Share Posted April 11, 2009 [quote name='homeschoolmom' post='1832167' date='Apr 11 2009, 06:52 PM']But why won't Obama just say that we are a nation founded on Judeo-Christian principles?[/quote] * shrug* Because he's an secularist marxist ding-bat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 [quote name='Lounge Daddy' post='1832197' date='Apr 11 2009, 07:27 PM']* shrug* Because he's an secularist marxist ding-bat?[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 Being founded on Judeo-Christian values does not mean we are a "Christian nation." It is possible to follow a value system but not be a member of the particular belief system - i.e. I am a moral person but I am not a Christian. However, if I were to not mention that fact, I could still pass as a Christian because I hold most of my morals in common with Christianity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
friendofJPII Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 (edited) If we are not a Christian nation then why are Christmas and Easter federal holidays? We have no official state religion. We are tolerant and respectful of non-Christians. But overall, American principles are Christian. The majority of our citizens profess to a Christian faith. And who is Obama to declare we are "not a Christian nation." He has been president for less than 4 months. We, the people, had no referendum on the question. He has no authority to make such a declaration in light of of our 200 plus year history. Edited April 12, 2009 by friendofJPII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dominicansoul Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 this doesn't suprise me one bit... what obama should have said, instead was, "[b]I[/b] am not a Christian.." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Vega Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 [quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1832154' date='Apr 11 2009, 05:28 PM']WHAT????????[/quote] So is Seventh Day Adventism, Jehovah's Witness..ism, Mormonism, etc. Just because it's a distorted view doesn't mean they're not looking at the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lounge Daddy Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 [quote name='friendofJPII' post='1832273' date='Apr 11 2009, 10:14 PM']If we are not a Christian nation then why are Christmas and Easter federal holidays?[/quote] Because an overwhelming number of people that work for the Post Office are Christians. To call it a Federal Holiday is a (largely politically motivated) decision made by the people running Government Offices--the Political Class. The Stock Exchange was closed for Good Friday also; but that doesn't make the US markets somehow "a Christian system." That's a decision made by people running a business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
friendofJPII Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 (edited) [quote name='Lounge Daddy' post='1832314' date='Apr 11 2009, 10:11 PM']Because an overwhelming number of people that work for the Post Office are Christians. To call it a Federal Holiday is a (largely politically motivated) decision made by the people running Government Offices--the Political Class. The Stock Exchange was closed for Good Friday also; but that doesn't make the US markets somehow "a Christian system." That's a decision made by people running a business.[/quote] ...well, if most postal workers and most stock brokers are Christian, and therefore celebrate Christmas and Easter, that is representative of our overall population, which is Christian. We are a "Christian nation." Edited April 12, 2009 by friendofJPII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Vega Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 (edited) [quote name='friendofJPII' post='1832327' date='Apr 11 2009, 11:36 PM']...well, if most postal workers and most stock brokers are Christian, and therefore celebrate Christmas and Easter, that is representative of our overall population, which is Christian. We are a "Christian nation."[/quote] False. And I'm going to go one further than I did before: We're almost the opposite of a "Christian" or any other sort of religious nation. Our forefathers specifically intended us to be a people free to choose what religion we would be, Christian or otherwise. As has been pointed out, many of our Forefathers were not even Christian, but Deist. They didn't want any specific religion or religious system to be in place. In fact, that's why they left that nasty place called "England" (maybe do some reading on how the US was formed - it was due in large part due to the Puritans, followed by other groups (Society of Friends, Catholics, etc) seeking refuge from forced Anglicanism). There's a non-sequitor in your logic. Because something is made up largely of a certain type of thing, does not translate into the bigger whole being the same as that smaller thing. Nitrogen makes up 78% of the Earth's atmosphere. Christians make up 77% of the USA. (http://www.gallup.com/poll/117409/Easter-Smaller-Percentage-Americans-Christian.aspx) This does not make the Earth's atmosphere a "nitrogen atmosphere". In fact, if it were, we'd all be dead (or at least a lot different than we are). This does not make the US a "Christian nation". Edited April 12, 2009 by USAirwaysIHS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 I should also add that the U.S. was founded on certain principles that are held in common with Christianity, but it was not founded as a "Christian nation," specifically. That's why it's inappropriate to call it such. It is understandable to say that we share common values, but not that we are a Christian nation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
friendofJPII Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 [quote name='USAirwaysIHS' post='1832339' date='Apr 11 2009, 10:53 PM']False. And I'm going to go one further than I did before: We're almost the opposite of a "Christian" or any other sort of religious nation. Our forefathers specifically intended us to be a people free to choose what religion we would be, Christian or otherwise. As has been pointed out, many of our Forefathers were not even Christian, but Deist. They didn't want any specific religion or religious system to be in place. In fact, that's why they left that nasty place called "England" (maybe do some reading on how the US was formed - it was due in large part due to the Puritans, followed by other groups (Society of Friends, Catholics, etc) seeking refuge from forced Anglicanism). There's a non-sequitor in your logic. Because something is made up largely of a certain type of thing, does not translate into the bigger whole being the same as that smaller thing. Nitrogen makes up 78% of the Earth's atmosphere. Christians make up 77% of the USA. (http://www.gallup.com/poll/117409/Easter-Smaller-Percentage-Americans-Christian.aspx) This does not make the Earth's atmosphere a "nitrogen atmosphere". In fact, if it were, we'd all be dead (or at least a lot different than we are). This does not make the US a "Christian nation".[/quote] Even if our founders weren't all Christians, our democracy was certainly divinely inspired. You can see that in the way they forsaw and planned ahead for so much. A nation's people influences the culture and the culture influences the government. If the people are Chirstian, celebrate Christian holidays, etc. ...it's safe to say it is a "Christian nation"...although not in a theocratic sense. True, it depends on intent and context, but Obama was clearly trying to appease the Turkish government, and undermine conservatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 [quote name='friendofJPII' post='1832400' date='Apr 11 2009, 11:36 PM']Even if our founders weren't all Christians, our democracy was certainly divinely inspired. You can see that in the way they forsaw and planned ahead for so much. A nation's people influences the culture and the culture influences the government. If the people are Chirstian, celebrate Christian holidays, etc. ...it's safe to say it is a "Christian nation"...although not in a theocratic sense. True, it depends on intent and context, but Obama was clearly trying to appease the Turkish government, and undermine conservatives.[/quote] Divine inspiration in the founding of America? Seems to have not worked out particularly well. I suppose I'll leave this to the people who are already talking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princessgianna Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' post='1832402' date='Apr 11 2009, 11:39 PM']Divine inspiration in the founding of America? Seems to have not worked out particularly well. I suppose I'll leave this to the people who are already talking.[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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