Americans Not Losing Their Religion,

[tinytherese]

In the words of G.K. Chesterton: “People have fallen into a foolish habit of speaking of orthodoxy as something heavy, humdrum and safe. There never was anything so perilous or so exciting as orthodoxy” (Orthodoxy 107). The Church is a reslient one that has fought against heresies and other ideas that have contradicted it, always rising up to the challenge. This “has been one whirling adventure” avoiding all of these popular fads (Orthodoxy 107). How easy it would be for the Church to conform, but it always stands firm. It has struggled against great difficulties and risen above them. As Christ said, “You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it” (Mt 16:18).


In our age people claim that the Church is closed minded, but actually the Church is at first open minded. The pope and cardinals look into issues. They look up scripture, study Church history and tradition, do research on the subject, and advise one another on the matter. After a long period of study and discussion, the Church finally makes a decision. Picture yourself trying to walk on your way to righteousness. The problem is that you cannot move because of all of the garbage that is in your way. The Church seeks to remove what is worthless and even harmful to the soul so that we are able to walk on the path of truth.


[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0nSjxDKJEo"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0nSjxDKJEo[/url]


[url="http://www.catholic.com/library/Papal_Infallibility.asp"]http://www.catholic.com/library/Papal_Infallibility.asp[/url]

[SaintOlaf]

[quote name='Kurall_Creator' post='1853778' date='Apr 30 2009, 10:03 PM']So, you're saying I shouldn't seek out God to understand if someone is trying to deceive me with the teachings of men instead of God?

Sheesh, the people who say you should just accept someone's authority without thinking and reasoning things out are really advocating for mindless people.[/quote]

Neither of these things is what I am saying. What I meant by my comments was that holding an individualistic attitude that you are the ultimate authority on doctrine will get you into a lot of trouble.

By all means you should seek out God to understand if someone is trying to deceive you. We have a lot of tools available for just that reason. Yes, I believe that the Holy Spirit will confirm doctrines and beliefs in your heart and in your mind, but that isn't the only tool that we've been given to know what we ought to believe. Christ gave us a Church, that He promised would be protected, and promised to send the Spirit to, to "guide us into all truth".

I can look at scripture and decide all kinds of doctrines that make sense to me, and develop my own version of Christianity, or I can look at what Christ's One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church teaches, and has taught to help me.

We do not blindly follow the Church, nor does she want us to, doctrine is explained and defined in a way to show that it is sensible. Certain things may be hard to grasp at first, but that is where we need to trust in the Church's authority, not our own understanding.

[LouisvilleFan]

Another statistic I read the other day: 50% of those who enter the Catholic Church at Easter Vigil will be at Easter Mass a year later.

A few notable quotes from the article:

"I've been struck by the very large number across all the different groups who say they just gradually drifted away..."

"Upwards of one-third of newly unaffiliated people say they just haven't found the right religion yet."

"That said, the fact that most people who switch religions do so before they are 24..."

I'd be curious to know how seminarians, priests, bishops, and anyone working in parish or diocese evangelization uses information like this. I also wonder if you were to poll those who have become Catholic at some point in their lives, how the numbers might be different (i.e. RCIA seems to largely consist of people above age 24). There is a huge need in our culture.

[tinytherese]

It seems as if those entering the church need more than just one year of catechesis in R.C.I.A. Formation needs to keep going on and the parish needs to respond to their questions and pastoral needs. After they become catholic, they shouldn't be just left on their own after that.

[SaintOlaf]

[quote name='tinytherese' post='1854225' date='May 1 2009, 12:06 PM']It seems as if those entering the church need more than just one year of catechesis in R.C.I.A. Formation needs to keep going on and the parish needs to respond to their questions and pastoral needs. After they become catholic, they shouldn't be just left on their own after that.[/quote]



We had a neophyte program, but it only lasted 2 sessions since no one showed up (both times it met I was out of town). The parish that I attend has very good retention after RCIA, I see every person that I was confirmed with at mass frequently. However, some others that I have had contact with that also joined the Church the same time I did have more or less abandoned it (their words) since they didn't really feel a part of the family as a whole.

It's a tough solution because to cater to the needs of that small group takes resources that each individual parish may not have readily available, but what I found extremely helpful is to maintain contact with those from my own class. I've also encouraged my friend that I sponsored this year to do the same, and to really root himself into a parish where he can feel he is really a part of it. So much of the Catholic walk is in the familial setting of a local parish, and really being a part of that.

[LouisvilleFan]

[quote name='tinytherese' post='1854225' date='May 1 2009, 12:06 PM']It seems as if those entering the church need more than just one year of catechesis in R.C.I.A. Formation needs to keep going on and the parish needs to respond to their questions and pastoral needs. After they become catholic, they shouldn't be just left on their own after that.[/quote]

Definitely... people need to find their "niche" or role in the Church, even if it's just participating in a small group for prayer and Scripture study or taking on a larger responsibility that they are passionate about. But it takes longer than the year of RCIA to develop the friendships and discern with God what the next step is. Here, I've been Catholic for three years and I'm just gaining a good sense that I belong here and finding a place where my gifts are useful and needed.

[quote name='SaintOlaf' post='1854247' date='May 1 2009, 12:31 PM']It's a tough solution because to cater to the needs of that small group takes resources that each individual parish may not have readily available, but what I found extremely helpful is to maintain contact with those from my own class.[/quote]

The only resource needed is people who care enough to make new Catholics a priority.

[Kurall_Creator]

[quote name='SaintOlaf' post='1853978' date='Apr 30 2009, 11:44 PM']Neither of these things is what I am saying. What I meant by my comments was that holding an individualistic attitude that you are the ultimate authority on doctrine will get you into a lot of trouble.

By all means you should seek out God to understand if someone is trying to deceive you. We have a lot of tools available for just that reason. Yes, I believe that the Holy Spirit will confirm doctrines and beliefs in your heart and in your mind, but that isn't the only tool that we've been given to know what we ought to believe. Christ gave us a Church, that He promised would be protected, and promised to send the Spirit to, to "guide us into all truth".

I can look at scripture and decide all kinds of doctrines that make sense to me, and develop my own version of Christianity, or I can look at what Christ's One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church teaches, and has taught to help me.

We do not blindly follow the Church, nor does she want us to, doctrine is explained and defined in a way to show that it is sensible. Certain things may be hard to grasp at first, but that is where we need to trust in the Church's authority, not our own understanding.[/quote]

Actually, I wasn't saying anything about the Catholic church, but people in general do two things. One they will go to a church that says the things the itching ears want to hear, or two, people who do see that people are trying to deceive us need to stand out from amongst the deceivers and be separate, standing on the truth.

I'm not saying that the Catholic church is trying to deceive people, or its teachings are in error, or anything.

Just because I take an individualist approach doesn't mean I won't accept people who take a group approach, and seek to understand their position.

[SaintOlaf]

[quote name='Kurall_Creator' post='1854318' date='May 1 2009, 02:34 PM']Actually, I wasn't saying anything about the Catholic church, but people in general do two things. One they will go to a church that says the things the itching ears want to hear, or two, people who do see that people are trying to deceive us need to stand out from amongst the deceivers and be separate, standing on the truth.

I'm not saying that the Catholic church is trying to deceive people, or its teachings are in error, or anything.

Just because I take an individualist approach doesn't mean I won't accept people who take a group approach, and seek to understand their position.[/quote]

Yes, those who attempt to deceive us should be called out, and need to be put out from among the flock. I guess the biggest problem I have with the purely individualistic approach is that it didn't work for me. I grew up in a baptist home, I was raised to read and learn from scripture like any good baptist boy would, the disconnect came when I realized that what I thought scripture taught, and what my parent's church thought scripture taught were different.

I disagreed with some of their doctrine, so I did the natural thing to do, I started looking for a church that I felt I should be part of. I, I, I. I wasn't searching for God, I was searching for the easiest place that let me practice "Paulism" (Hi, my name is Paul, btw). I wasn't truly searching for where God wanted me, but what would fulfill my own desires of what I thought Christianity should be.

I went to 12 different churches and never found what I wanted. Eventually I just stopped going. Nobody had what I wanted, so why even bother, I can just worship God in my own way . I still read spiritual books, and kept an open mind to everyone, I still considered myself a Christian, and to anyone on the outside looking in they probably would have said the same.

Eventually I grew stagnant even in my own "Paulism" and started to search again. My sister had recently become Catholic so maybe I'd take a look at that. Initially I was extremely resistant to it, my prejudices against Catholic teachings from being raised baptist all began to come to the fore. The more I studied, the more I realized the inevitable, Christ started a Church, just for me, but it was not of me. He started a Church to guide ME into the truth of how He wanted to be worshiped.

My individualism never really died, though it was certainly beginning to relax. I could read what the Church taught on a certain doctrine, the thought process gone through to reconcile that doctrine to scripture and many of my objections were answered in a clear concise way. The Catholic Church encouraged me to study and to work out my salvation, but when difficult passages came up, or when differences in interpretation were unsolvable, the Church was there to exercise her authority. I am stronger for it, I have my own personal convictions, backed by the authority of the Church.

Let me leave you with a parting question. If Christ established a Church (Matt 16:18) on earth, guided into all truth and protected from even the gates of hell, why would you not want to be a part of that?

[LouisvilleFan]

Opportunity...

"I've been struck by the very large number across all the different groups who say they just gradually drifted away..."

"Upwards of one-third of newly unaffiliated people say they just haven't found the right religion yet."

"That said, the fact that most people who switch religions do so [i]before they are 24[/i]..." (emphasis mine)

...meet Solution:
[url="http://www.catholic.org/prwire/headline.php?ID=6644"]FOCUS invited to 14 more College Campuses[/url]

Edited May 2, 2009 by LouisvilleFan