The Unstoppable Cardinal Of Vienna

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='VeniteAdoremus' post='1895106' date='Jun 18 2009, 07:28 AM']*which, by the way, have existed in the Church before, to which stole-wearing Carthusian nuns are still testament, but that is completely besides the point - the role they had is obsolete now that culture doesn't frown upon a man entering a woman's sickchamber anymore. It's just one of my favourite historical titbits and this was a lovely excuse.[/quote]

The so-called "female diaconate," though it did exist in centuries past, was not a degree of the Sacrament of Order.

[VeniteAdoremus]

[quote name='Resurrexi' post='1895110' date='Jun 18 2009, 02:46 PM']The so-called "female diaconate," though it did exist in centuries past, was not a degree of the Sacrament of Order.[/quote]

Which the wymynprysts should know, as apparently they've done their research so excessively well.

NOT feeding that pet peeve. Argh. Sorry for hijacking.

[OraProMe]

When I become pope I'm going to have massive red stamps created that say"EXCOMMUNICATED" on them. Then I'll have the stamps ready in my hands for the Ad Lima visits if the bishops disappoint me.

[scardella]

[quote name='OraProMe' post='1895127' date='Jun 18 2009, 08:25 AM']When I become pope I'm going to have massive red stamps created that say"EXCOMMUNICATED" on them. Then I'll have the stamps ready in my hands for the Ad Lima visits if the bishops disappoint me.[/quote]

This is why you'll never become Pope.

[VeniteAdoremus]

[quote name='OraProMe' post='1895127' date='Jun 18 2009, 03:25 PM']When I become pope I'm going to have massive red stamps created that say"EXCOMMUNICATED" on them. Then I'll have the stamps ready in my hands for the Ad Lima visits if the bishops disappoint me.[/quote]

But that doesn't work on Cardinals. Red on red won't show.

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='OraProMe' post='1895127' date='Jun 18 2009, 08:25 AM']When I become pope I'm going to have massive red stamps created that say"EXCOMMUNICATED" on them. Then I'll have the stamps ready in my hands for the Ad Lima visits if the bishops disappoint me.[/quote]



From a practical perspective, this probably wouldn't work, though. Doing such things would be a great way to get the Cardinals who don't like you to set up an anti-pope.

[Didacus]

[quote name='Apotheoun' post='1895104' date='Jun 18 2009, 06:22 AM']How does one become a "relevant Austrian Catholic"?[/quote]

That's actually the same passage that struct my attention.

It automatically underscores the fact the some catholics are 'irrelevant' - which I cannot accept.

Its language like this that makes me very skeptical of the news sources. This tells me the possibility of two things; 1. they didn't take much care putting the article together, 2. The research behind the article may be faulty.

[StColette]

[quote name='Apotheoun' post='1895107' date='Jun 18 2009, 07:32 AM']I agree, people are quick to judge the Cardinal of Vienna, and mainly because of the weird disco / balloon liturgy that he presided at a few months ago, but no one knows for sure that he was advised about what was going to happen during that strange liturgy before he arrived at the church.[/quote]



I'd be interested to read this "Initiative of the lay faithful" to see what it actually says.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='VeniteAdoremus' post='1895076' date='Jun 18 2009, 03:42 AM']I would be [i]very[/i] careful. "Presented" can have several meanings in a biased news source. Even if he did give the pope the petition, he could have done as a document of evidence of the problems in his country, not because he agreed with it!

The wrongs in Austria run very deep. They can't be solved by one Archbishop.

This Cardinal is a member of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, among many other things. Don't ruin his reputation based on rumours.[/quote]

Ditto. Let's not jump to conclusions. Just because he presented the petition doesn't mean he agrees with it. He may have told the pope, "see what they're doing? What are we going to do about this mess?" In fact, the very fact that it is called, "the initiative of the lay faithful" seems to suggest that it was orchestrated/initiated by lay people, not the cardinal, and it certainly doesn't implicate the cardinal as supporting it.

As for the art that the Cardinal sponsored, it's quite possible that the news was exaggerated. Maybe the only involvement he had was to tell someone in his diocese, "let's commission a work of art to honor so-and-so" and that person went and did something foolish. Perhaps he even only found out about the bad art when he walked in to bless it...in that setting, I can see why he might not have wanted to make a big scene over it at the blessing ceremony (although I think I would have).

Last but not least...we're trusting blogs now as important sources of factual information? We're trusting them enough to judge someone's actions and intentions?