Help! Advice?

[Shana]

So I feel called to religious life. I'm a junior in college, majoring in art and minoring in education. I'm not really feeling the whole education thing, I feel compelled to do it to please my parents and to be able to get a secure job if I need to. My mom reminded me that if I wanted permanent teaching certification in NYS I'd have to start working on my masters in two years after getting my bachelor's. I don't want to wait three more years before applying for postulancy, especially if it's doing something...getting my masters...for the purpose of being able to be permanently certified in something that seems like drudgery and enslavement in doing something I don't really love. I can't imagine any secular jobs that would fulfill me for that matter and that worries me because I'm not sure if that's what they would call and inadequate motivation for desiring religious life or if it's just another indication towards it? I mean I feel I wouldn't feel fulfilled in what I was doing if I couldn't spend myself completely and explicitly to spreading the gospel full time though prayer and action. This isn't the only reason religious life appeals to me...I desire to give all my love to Jesus alone and feel I would wither up and die if I couldn't recieve Him in the Eucharist everyday and spend time in Eucharistic adoration everyday. What should I dooo?

Edited March 12, 2010 by Shana

[Indwelling Trinity]

[quote name='Shana' date='12 March 2010 - 11:06 AM' timestamp='1268406395' post='2071718']
So I feel called to religious life. I'm a junior in college, majoring in art and minoring in education. I'm not really feeling the whole education thing, I feel compelled to do it to please my parents and to be able to get a secure job if I need to. My mom reminded me that if I wanted permanent teaching certification in NYS I'd have to start working on my masters in two years after getting my bachelor's. I don't want to wait three more years before applying for postulancy, especially if it's doing something...getting my masters...for the purpose of being able to be permanently certified in something that seems like drudgery and enslavement in doing something I don't really love. I can't imagine any secular jobs that would fulfill me for that matter and that worries me because I'm not sure if that's what they would call and inadequate motivation for desiring religious life or if it's just another indication towards it? I mean I feel I wouldn't feel fulfilled in what I was doing if I couldn't spend myself completely and explicitly to spreading the gospel full time though prayer and action. This isn't the only reason religious life appeals to me...I desire to give all my love to Jesus alone and feel I would wither up and die if I couldn't recieve Him in the Eucharist everyday and spend time in Eucharistic adoration everyday. What should I dooo?
[/quote]

It is good to love and respect one's parents.. at the same time you are an adult now. Discerning religous life does not require immediate commitment but is a time process.... I see no reason why you cannot begin discerning then on school break possibly visit those communities that attract you. You lose nothing... but may have verything to gain. If love of God is truly your intention and if you truly feel called to religious life, then i think it would be important to respond to what God has put in your heart. Who knows... you might even find a community that fits you that will continue your training in a profession suited to you.

Pray ardently for His light and I will pray with you.

Tenderly,

Indwelling Trinity

[Cherie]

If you are attracted to religious life, seek out a few communities that you feel drawn to (Here might be a good place to start: http://www.cmswr.org/member_communities/membercommunities.html -- I've listed active communities because you mentioned "spreading the gospel full time though prayer and action" -- but I would also suggest at least looking at the cloistered life to see if God might be calling you to that way of life.

I must say that now is a good time to start looking, especially before you go on to your Master's. College debt is the #1 impediment to young people entering religious life; according to canon law, you can't enter religious life until you are free of debt, and unfortunately for many young people, that takes too much time and they don't have the resources to pay it off quickly. There are many "vocation funds" set up for people who need help paying off their loans, but they are very competitive and not everyone will be accepted.

That isn't said to discourage you, but you encourage you to start seriously discerning. Contact the communities you feel drawn to, ask about their life, aposolate, etc, and if you still feel drawn to them, schedule a visit. Talk to the vocation directress about your concerns, desires, etc. -- that is her role in the community, to help you with that, so she would be more than happy to answer your questions.

I know many religious communities who refer to people as "perpetual discerners" - they are attracted to the life, they want to be religious, but they never take the final "JUMP" to enter and try it. Don't become like that. Pray for God's guidance, talk to a spiritual director, stay close to the sacraments, and don't ever be afraid to make the jump. God will guide you, and even if you find out later you don't have a religious vocation, (as I did after 5 years!) than He will guide you in that, too. The key is to trust in Him. If He's calling you, if you feel drawn to religious life, there is no better time than NOW to get started following His Will. Be open to His Will, and with just a little bit of effort from our part, He will let everything fall into place. "Be not afraid" !!!

And I'll be praying for you!

[Shana]

I have been in contact with some communities and feel drawn at this point to one in particular. I've been in contact with this community for a year, have visisted them, and I will be speaking with the vocation directress this coming week about the best way for me to continue discerning. I'll bring this up to her, I just don't want to appear to be freaking out or anything!

[laetitia crucis]

[quote name='Shana' date='12 March 2010 - 11:37 AM' timestamp='1268408276' post='2071744']
I have been in contact with some communities and feel drawn at this point to one in particular. I've been in contact with this community for a year, have visisted them, and I will be speaking with the vocation directress this coming week about the best way for me to continue discerning. I'll bring this up to her, I just don't want to appear to be freaking out or anything!
[/quote]


Praying for you, Shana. I think both Indwelling Trinity and CherieMadame make great points! And surely, the vocation directress will give you good counsel for your situation as well.

As the above posters have said, I also reiterate -- pray for the graces needed in this discernment process, and if you believe God is leading you to this specific community, be not afraid! Take His hand, and JUMP IN!!!

[melporcristo]

[quote name='Indwelling Trinity' date='12 March 2010 - 08:15 AM' timestamp='1268406907' post='2071723']
It is good to love and respect one's parents.. at the same time you are an adult now. Discerning religous life does not require immediate commitment but is a time process.... I see no reason why you cannot begin discerning then on school break possibly visit those communities that attract you. You lose nothing... but may have verything to gain. If love of God is truly your intention and if you truly feel called to religious life, then i think it would be important to respond to what God has put in your heart. Who knows... you might even find a community that fits you that will continue your training in a profession suited to you.

Pray ardently for His light and I will pray with you.

Tenderly,

Indwelling Trinity
[/quote]

Said so well! Remember: Our Lord is a gentleman, He waits on you with total love & mercy!

I recommend visiting for a Come & See or even just a retreat of quiet to spend time with Christ and to give Our Lord the chance to meet you where you're at. I was there in your position when I felt the nudge to Religious life, but I knew I needed to finish school. It was a good time for me to gain patience in waiting ... and here I am, 3 years later, waiting some more Each vocational call is different, but be assured you're not alone! I will be praying for you!

Edited March 12, 2010 by melporcristo

[brightsadness]

Lots of good advice here. Talk to the vocation directors, talk to your SD, and if God is calling, GO FOR IT!!!

with love and prayers,
Anya

[Cherie]

[quote name='Shana' date='12 March 2010 - 11:37 AM' timestamp='1268408276' post='2071744']
I just don't want to appear to be freaking out or anything!
[/quote]

No worries there. Just be yourself!! I'm positive you won't appear to be "freaking out" -- this is a big decision, a life decision -- so it's something that requires a lot of prayer and discernment, and most Vocation Directresses have had their fair share of people who really DO "freak out" about it! (And guess what? Even many of them enter religious life and do very well at it!) It can be scary at times, but I promise you the rewards are ETERNAL!!! (Literally! Ha!) And God's guiding the whole thing!

[Shana]

I'm trying to figure out what secular career would be good to fall back on if I don't have a religious vocation, which I really think I may. I feel called to evangelize Theology of the Body using art as part of my life. I don't really see myself supporting myself with art alone so thus the minor in education. But the further and further I get into education I'm really NOT feeling it. The only secular avenue I can even vaguely seeing myself satisfied is being an art professor. That way I'd have security but I'd also be able to pursue my own art and use the universities facilities. Maybe I should find out more about that. That way I wouldn't need to worry about being certified K-12 in NYS to be a professor. I don't really know if I would like it but I really don't feel called to teach in a K-12 setting. Any thoughts?

[Luigi]

University profs usually have to have a master's degree - in the case of teaching art, probably an MFA. Even then, finding a job can be pretty tough; you may have to start out working as and "adjunct," i.e., a part-timer with no benefits. If you get a full-time job teaching at the college level, you could still be what called a "lecturer" reather than a professor. It's full-time work, and it's steady, but the pay is somewhat reduced.

Still, if you're into theology of the body, you could focus on figure drawing - there aren't that many people who can teach it at all, and even fewer who can teach it well.

[Shana]

My problem isn't earning a masters degree per se. I'm just under the impression that after earning my bachelors I'd have to start working on my masters within two years or my courses in education would expire or something. After I earn my bachelors I want to enter postulancy and if that doesn't work out THEN get my masters and pursue a secular career. I just feel if I pursued my masters right after this my heart wouldn't be in it and the whole time I'd want to be elsewhere (giving religious life a shot).

[Indwelling Trinity]

[quote name='Shana' date='13 March 2010 - 07:59 AM' timestamp='1268481549' post='2072281']
My problem isn't earning a masters degree per se. I'm just under the impression that after earning my bachelors I'd have to start working on my masters within two years or my courses in education would expire or something. After I earn my bachelors I want to enter postulancy and if that doesn't work out THEN get my masters and pursue a secular career. I just feel if I pursued my masters right after this my heart wouldn't be in it and the whole time I'd want to be elsewhere (giving religious life a shot).
[/quote]

Sounds like you have had the answers to your problems from the get go.

Edited March 13, 2010 by Indwelling Trinity

[organwerke]

[quote name='Shana' date='12 March 2010 - 11:56 PM' timestamp='1268431011' post='2072008']
I'm trying to figure out what secular career would be good to fall back on if I don't have a religious vocation, which I really think I may. I feel called to evangelize Theology of the Body using art as part of my life. I don't really see myself supporting myself with art alone so thus the minor in education. But the further and further I get into education I'm really NOT feeling it. The only secular avenue I can even vaguely seeing myself satisfied is being an art professor. That way I'd have security but I'd also be able to pursue my own art and use the universities facilities. Maybe I should find out more about that. That way I wouldn't need to worry about being certified K-12 in NYS to be a professor. I don't really know if I would like it but I really don't feel called to teach in a K-12 setting. Any thoughts?
[/quote]

Dear Shana, I don't know if I can help you someway.
I can understand you because I too, like you, have always seen myself as an artist.
I too, as yourself, love to spread the Gospel through my art.
The art in my case is music, the passion of my life.
I got a teaching qualification and I've been teaching music in a public school in my country for four years.
I too chose this road because I couldn't live only with my art.
It is a quite demanding job because I work in classes with about 25 children (boys and girls) aged 11-13, and many of them are really lively!
I too prefer to play, to do art than teaching, especially because often work environments aren't so lovely and nice as religious communities could be, but I get many satisfactions too.
In particular, in my case, I can say that I'm really helped by my spiritual formation that I got from Opus Dei, a church instituion for lay people whose charism is to sanctify the job and the ordinary things of our lives (I'm a coworker).
This helps me very much because I always remember that when I work I'm not simply earning money but I'm sanctifying myself through my job, I'm spreading the Gospel with my love, and I also remember that I do it mostly for God and for the souls.
Of course the hard work remains...but I see it with a divine vision, and this is really great.
Now...what can I say?
Well, that of course when you have a job qualification, even if you are not too intentioned to use it, you have a bigger sense of security because you know that even if another road won't go well, you have a sort of "parachude".
But, on the other hand, coherently with my formation...I would say to you that the founder of Opus Dei, saint Josemaria Escrivà, when knew people like you, attracted by God but a little scared (and this is really normal and human) used to encourage them reminding the epysode of Cortes in Mexico, in which the conquerer burned the ships so that he couldn't return back...
Of course this is only an anecdote that has to be interpreted with common sense, but I hope you can get what it means...
You could think that this fire is the fire of your love for God, and, returning to the reality, I think that a person with a good formation can always easily get a job, so I don't think that in a future you couldn't have a secular career, even if course I understand your feelings very well.
Well...sorry for this little tale!
Finally, I simply pray for you!!!

[Indwelling Trinity]

[quote name='organwerke' date='13 March 2010 - 11:29 AM' timestamp='1268494162' post='2072314']
Dear Shana, I don't know if I can help you someway.
I can understand you because I too, like you, have always seen myself as an artist.
I too, as yourself, love to spread the Gospel through my art.
The art in my case is music, the passion of my life.
I got a teaching qualification and I've been teaching music in a public school in my country for four years.
I too chose this road because I couldn't live only with my art.
It is a quite demanding job because I work in classes with about 25 children (boys and girls) aged 11-13, and many of them are really lively!
I too prefer to play, to do art than teaching, especially because often work environments aren't so lovely and nice as religious communities could be, but I get many satisfactions too.
In particular, in my case, I can say that I'm really helped by my spiritual formation that I got from Opus Dei, a church instituion for lay people whose charism is to sanctify the job and the ordinary things of our lives (I'm a coworker).
This helps me very much because I always remember that when I work I'm not simply earning money but I'm sanctifying myself through my job, I'm spreading the Gospel with my love, and I also remember that I do it mostly for God and for the souls.
Of course the hard work remains...but I see it with a divine vision, and this is really great.
Now...what can I say?
Well, that of course when you have a job qualification, even if you are not too intentioned to use it, you have a bigger sense of security because you know that even if another road won't go well, you have a sort of "parachude".
But, on the other hand, coherently with my formation...I would say to you that the founder of Opus Dei, saint Josemaria Escrivà, when knew people like you, attracted by God but a little scared (and this is really normal and human) used to encourage them reminding the epysode of Cortes in Mexico, in which the conquerer burned the ships so that he couldn't return back...
Of course this is only an anecdote that has to be interpreted with common sense, but I hope you can get what it means...
You could think that this fire is the fire of your love for God, and, returning to the reality, I think that a person with a good formation can always easily get a job, so I don't think that in a future you couldn't have a secular career, even if course I understand your feelings very well.
Well...sorry for this little tale!
Finally, I simply pray for you!!!
[/quote]

Organwerke this is simply beautiful and so empathetic yu really understand better than i do ... I love you my friend.

[Cherie]

[quote name='organwerke' date='13 March 2010 - 11:29 AM' timestamp='1268494162' post='2072314']

In particular, in my case, I can say that I'm really helped by my spiritual formation that I got from Opus Dei
[/quote]


Love, love, love, love, [b]LOVE[/b] Opus Dei!!!

[brightsadness]

[quote name='Shana' date='13 2010 - 04:59 AM' timestamp='1268481549' post='2072281']
My problem isn't earning a masters degree per se. I'm just under the impression that after earning my bachelors I'd have to start working on my masters within two years or my courses in education would expire or something. After I earn my bachelors I want to enter postulancy and if that doesn't work out THEN get my masters and pursue a secular career. I just feel if I pursued my masters right after this my heart wouldn't be in it and the whole time I'd want to be elsewhere (giving religious life a shot).
[/quote]


Hi Shana,

As a fellow artistic type and discerner, I really get your dilemma. And yet we are each so uniqely guided by our God that I hesitate to share. So take it for what it's worth, one person's experience of God using the twists and turns of life to bring her to a turning point that has become an arrow of light and clarity (at least for now.)
Please understand that I'm not a word person [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/ohno.gif[/img] and have mercy[img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/upsidedown.gif[/img]. As an artist, and harpist, and most recently, an architect, beauty and creativity have been what my life is about. I am blessed by a family and a church tradition that uses beauty to bring one to the Creator and Savior of us all . And so it was the research into Icons and eastern Church architecture (for my BIA) that our Lord used to call my beauty addicted heart and soul to Him. That and a very clever Priest/Artist that I believe we share acquaintance with.

I did go on for my MA and to work professionally because it was a part of my discernment (I came to a vocational call later than you.) and I have grown and come to see the good things that are not enough for me. This is how I've been guided by my Spiritual Father and others I trust. But that is the past. NOW is God's time for me and nothing would stop me from [u]answering the call. because my heart and soul "know" that voice[/u]. And those who previously counseled waiting and prudence, who love me so much, also see that Now. But as my SF says. I had to be the one to tell them. (Very clever priest.)

You are in my prayers. God bless your discerning heart.

Anya

[organwerke]

[quote name='CherieMadame' date='13 March 2010 - 07:11 PM' timestamp='1268500312' post='2072361']
Love, love, love, love, [b]LOVE[/b] Opus Dei!!!
[/quote]

I'm really happy you say so, I too love it with all my heart!!

[organwerke]

[quote name='Indwelling Trinity' date='13 March 2010 - 05:41 PM' timestamp='1268494882' post='2072323']
Organwerke this is simply beautiful and so empathetic yu really understand better than i do ... I love you my friend.
[/quote]

Thank you very much dear Indwelling Trinity, you too know how much I love you!!!!!!
Only...maybe I understand better on the artistical/professional side, but certainly you understand much better for the vocational side, and this is certainly the most important one!
Thank you once more.
God bless you

[Shana]

[quote name='brightsadness' date='13 March 2010 - 01:15 PM' timestamp='1268504140' post='2072393']
Hi Shana,

As a fellow artistic type and discerner, I really get your dilemma. And yet we are each so uniqely guided by our God that I hesitate to share. So take it for what it's worth, one person's experience of God using the twists and turns of life to bring her to a turning point that has become an arrow of light and clarity (at least for now.)
Please understand that I'm not a word person [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/ohno.gif[/img] and have mercy[img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/upsidedown.gif[/img]. As an artist, and harpist, and most recently, an architect, beauty and creativity have been what my life is about. I am blessed by a family and a church tradition that uses beauty to bring one to the Creator and Savior of us all . And so it was the research into Icons and eastern Church architecture (for my BIA) that our Lord used to call my beauty addicted heart and soul to Him. That and a very clever Priest/Artist that I believe we share acquaintance with.

I did go on for my MA and to work professionally because it was a part of my discernment (I came to a vocational call later than you.) and I have grown and come to see the good things that are not enough for me. This is how I've been guided by my Spiritual Father and others I trust. But that is the past. NOW is God's time for me and nothing would stop me from [u]answering the call. because my heart and soul "know" that voice[/u]. And those who previously counseled waiting and prudence, who love me so much, also see that Now. But as my SF says. I had to be the one to tell them. (Very clever priest.)

You are in my prayers. God bless your discerning heart.

Anya
[/quote]

My problem is that education is my fall back plan but the more and more I get into it I feel stronger and stronger that this isn't for me. At least not K-12. Perhaps being a professor or something but I'm not really feeling it too strong but if that's what God wants he'll give me the desires. I need to discern this more but I'm feeling I want to drop my education minor and take up some Spanish classes. I feel that the reason I started taking education classes was to please and appease other's expectations of me. Just the thing is if I don't have a call to religious life, and I'm thinking it is quite possible that I do, it is not clear to me what secular careers would be satisfying for me. God has given me a lead...TOB, art and evangelization. So I've found a religious order that really has the same spirit as me about that and as far as secular possibilities the only thing I can concieve of is being a professor which you don't really need teacher certification for...you would need a masters in my field.

Please pray for me about what I should do with these education classes, get out while I still can or keep going. I feel I want to get out but I don't know if that's God's will.

[Indwelling Trinity]

[quote name='organwerke' date='13 March 2010 - 07:26 PM' timestamp='1268522766' post='2072532']
Thank you very much dear Indwelling Trinity, you too know how much I love you!!!!!!
Only...maybe I understand better on the artistical/professional side, but certainly you understand much better for the vocational side, and this is certainly the most important one!
Thank you once more.
God bless you
[/quote]

I know this is off topic... but let every spirit praise God with the gifts he has given us. No one gift is greater than the other for they all reflect the attributes of God. For the artist in both of you is very special and close to God's heart.

Like God the artist creates beauty that reflects and conveys to all the creative beauty of God. "God saw what he had done and said it was good"...

How much less richness our own faith would have without the music of the musician who creates beautiful music with which to praise God in union with the angels in heaven who constantly praise Himbefore his heavenly throne.

How much less richness we would have without the painter or sculptor who by their gifts reveal to us in art the beauty of the truths of our faith. The artist carries in a very special way that creative gift of God revealing to us hidden beauty that many of us would not be able to otherwise perceive... Art teaches the Gospel through the senses which then leads us to appeciation of the divine in contemplation through that beauty.

Let none of us underestimate our Gifts whatever they may be. Let us just humbly put them at the service of the Lord. In discernment of vocation we should take into account those God given gifts and weigh whether it is absolutely necessary for us to use them in order to fulfill our vocation or to sometimes to sacrifce them for a greater good. Only the Holy Spirit will make this clear to the soul.

Tenderly,

Indwelling Trinity