Human Sexuallity

[SaintOfVirtue]

[quote name='God Conquers' date='20 April 2010 - 11:02 PM' timestamp='1271829743' post='2097234']
This is how you should identify yourself:

First Name, Baptismal Name, Last Name.




WHy pigeonhole yourself or anyone else? Especially if there are struggles there in the first place. DOn't put yourself inside or outside any boxes. Or closets.
[/quote]

You forgot "Confirmation Name"

[infinitelord1]

[quote name='Sternhauser' date='25 April 2010 - 07:41 AM' timestamp='1272199281' post='2099681']
Can you clarify this statement? It looks as though you're slipping into the fundamental option theory. I know you're probably not going into it knowingly, but it is a heresy. One act is all it takes to transform one's "fundamental option."

~Sternhauser
[/quote]


So I just did research on this idea of "fundamental option". Basically what I have gathered is that because other people have done something it justifies you doing the same thing. Which, yes, this is an incorrect way of thinking.

So when you say "One act is all it takes to transform one's "fundamental option." are you suggesting that if we choose to do something, that we know is a sin, that one thing that we do can totally destroy our salvation? because it seems to me that many of us, especially the ones who were raised with a christian background (since we have a deeper understanding of morality), have chosen sin over doing the right thing at points in our lives. I would think that we should seek forgiveness for our sins and make a conscience effort to resist future temptations.

please correct me if i have commited heresy yet again...thanks.

Edited April 26, 2010 by infinitelord1

[infinitelord1]

[quote name='infinitelord1' date='26 April 2010 - 12:40 AM' timestamp='1272260413' post='2100214']
So I just did research on this idea of "fundamental option". Basically what I have gathered is that because other people have done something it justifies you doing the same thing. Which, yes, this is an incorrect way of thinking.

So when you say "One act is all it takes to transform one's "fundamental option." are you suggesting that if we choose to do something, that we know is a sin, that one thing that we do can totally destroy our salvation? because it seems to me that many of us, especially the ones who were raised with a christian background (since we have a deeper understanding of morality), have chosen sin over doing the right thing at points in our lives. I would think that we should seek forgiveness for our sins and make a conscience effort to resist future temptations.

please correct me if i have commited heresy yet again...thanks.
[/quote]

OK..so i have done more research on this subject matter...

Let me clarify that i think i have committed Mortal sin in my life...fornication. Is the only way to be forgiven of a mortal sin by confessing to a priest? Are there other ways to seek forgiveness? I have talked to a priest about this...i cant remember if i formally confessed to him or not. I have also talked to people whom i trust about the acts i have committed. Of course, someone who does not have a profound knowledge of the severity of sins cannot really assign penance.

Here is a bible quote on confessing sins...

Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man is powerful and effective. James 5:16

Edited April 26, 2010 by infinitelord1

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='infinitelord1' date='26 April 2010 - 03:00 AM' timestamp='1272268846' post='2100240']
OK..so i have done more research on this subject matter...

Let me clarify that i think i have committed Mortal sin in my life...fornication. Is the only way to be forgiven of a mortal sin by confessing to a priest? Are there other ways to seek forgiveness? I have talked to a priest about this...i cant remember if i formally confessed to him or not. I have also talked to people whom i trust about the acts i have committed. Of course, someone who does not have a profound knowledge of the severity of sins cannot really assign penance.

Here is a bible quote on confessing sins...

Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man is powerful and effective. James 5:16
[/quote]

Infinite,

I think I have committed mortal sin in my life, too. As Catholics, we believe that one mortal sin is enough to send oneself to hell. It would be a heresy to say that the only way one can ever be forgiven a mortal sin is to confess it to a priest. It would also be heresy to say that one should ever avoid confessing one's sins to a priest, and that it is the wisest, most prudent, and safest thing for a Catholic to do. Confession of any mortal sins is required at least once a year. Anything besides confession to a priest would probably be borderline, if not bald-faced, presumption upon the mercy of God. Another sin.

James said what he said to everyone. This is what Jesus said only to his Apostles (not even His mother was there at the time.) "Receive the Holy Spirit. Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them. Whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." James did not say that confessing one's sins to your neighbor will gain you forgiveness from God. But it can be a phenomenal exercise in humility and building close spiritual relationships with your brethren. Confessing your sins honestly and openly to a priest [i]will [/i]obtain the forgiveness of God. None but a few saints have ever been assured of the state of their soul at any point in their lives, or the certainty of their salvation. But confessing one's sins is the method that cannot be emphasized strongly enough. Sins are like a dam that we build. We can hardly notice it's there, if we become accustomed to it. Whether deliberate or not, it keeps God's graces and favors out. Take a hammer to that dam in the confessional, and God's graces, which have been building up behind that dam, will pour into your life once again.

If you're not sure that you've confessed your sins, just go to confession. Priests have heard [i]everything. [/i]There is nothing you can say that will shock them. They are in the confessional as representatives of the Man Himself. Stammer, stutter if you want. They've heard it all. They're just happy you're there. Picture the prodigal son's father, pacing back and forth, worried by the absence of his son. He wants you back in his home.

~Sternhauser

[infinitelord1]

[quote name='Sternhauser' date='26 April 2010 - 08:25 AM' timestamp='1272288301' post='2100275']
Infinite,

I think I have committed mortal sin in my life, too. As Catholics, we believe that one mortal sin is enough to send oneself to hell. It would be a heresy to say that the only way one can ever be forgiven a mortal sin is to confess it to a priest. It would also be heresy to say that one should ever avoid confessing one's sins to a priest, and that it is the wisest, most prudent, and safest thing for a Catholic to do. Confession of any mortal sins is required at least once a year. Anything besides confession to a priest would probably be borderline, if not bald-faced, presumption upon the mercy of God. Another sin.

James said what he said to everyone. This is what Jesus said only to his Apostles (not even His mother was there at the time.) "Receive the Holy Spirit. Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them. Whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." James did not say that confessing one's sins to your neighbor will gain you forgiveness from God. But it can be a phenomenal exercise in humility and building close spiritual relationships with your brethren. Confessing your sins honestly and openly to a priest [i]will [/i]obtain the forgiveness of God. None but a few saints have ever been assured of the state of their soul at any point in their lives, or the certainty of their salvation. But confessing one's sins is the method that cannot be emphasized strongly enough. Sins are like a dam that we build. We can hardly notice it's there, if we become accustomed to it. Whether deliberate or not, it keeps God's graces and favors out. Take a hammer to that dam in the confessional, and God's graces, which have been building up behind that dam, will pour into your life once again.

If you're not sure that you've confessed your sins, just go to confession. Priests have heard [i]everything. [/i]There is nothing you can say that will shock them. They are in the confessional as representatives of the Man Himself. Stammer, stutter if you want. They've heard it all. They're just happy you're there. Picture the prodigal son's father, pacing back and forth, worried by the absence of his son. He wants you back in his home.

~Sternhauser
[/quote]
you know...i really think we should start a thread on this.

[CatherineM]

[quote name='infinitelord1' date='26 April 2010 - 10:09 AM' timestamp='1272294575' post='2100300']
you know...i really think we should start a thread on this.
[/quote]
It would make an interesting thread. I have told a priest something in confession that he hadn't heard before that flustered him and made him drop his book.

[Laudate_Dominum]

Imagine having to confess the destruction of Alderaan. "Yo Fathah, I'm sawwy for destroyin planits and stuff."

[Laudate_Dominum]

We should make a lame board thread for wacky confessions.

My typical confession:

"Father, forgive me, I partook of burnt offerings to Cthulhu, after which I... I... enjoyed a spanking from the Easter Bunny at the Mall."
"Is there anything else my son?"
"Uh.. yeah.. uh... well, I..."
"It's okay, I've heard it all, don't be nervous."
"Oh, right.. okay.. well.. I.. Told my friend that I prefer chicken to pork when in fact I prefer pork to chicken."
"Is that all?"
"No. I spoke in gibberish on the bus in order to deceive the passengers into believing that I was a foreigner."
"Now why would you do that my son?"
"For the lulz I guess father."
"Are you sorry for your sins?"
"Indubitably."

[infinitelord1]

Now that we have established that homosexuality, like most sexual sins, is not only a sin but a mortal sin...

I would like to start getting into the causes of homosexuality. There have been some scientific studies done on the matter. Some studies have pointed towards homosexuality being biological. Other studies have suggested, from a biological standpoint, that homosexuality is not biological. Some studies have revealed that homosexuality is a phenomenon that is a result of environmental factors in key developmental stages of a persons life.

I have talked with different people who were experiencing many issues in which i have experienced in regards to my sexuality. I have also talked with people who have experienced things that I have never experienced in regards to sexuality. I have been discriminated against/identified not only by people who are predominately attracted to the opposite sex, but also by people who claim they are predominately attracted to the same sex. This discrimination occurs for many different reasons. You have people who have a hostile mentality towards anything that they percieve to be homosexual. You have people who want to be with you who may peer pressure you into acting out in a homosexual way. You also have people who have been through a lot of pain because of their lifestyle, and they want to pull as many people into their agenda to appear as if they have a more unified front. And you have those people who dont want to see people who are SSA+ struggle...so they tell that person that they are gay. As a christian, we should not be acting like this (identifying people). We should be setting an example by encouraging people to get involved in groups and therapy so that they may learn more about themselves, and what it is going to take to overcome the things that are weighing them down. As you can see, as a christian who experiences some level of same sex attraction...it is very difficult to be accepted by anybody, and very easy to start identifying as gay.

I am going to leave off here so I can gather my thoughts as to how I want to continue this thread.

Edited April 26, 2010 by infinitelord1

[Jesus_lol]

[quote name='BibleReader' date='20 April 2010 - 03:31 PM' timestamp='1271802673' post='2097000']
I have to say I agree with pretty much everything written in this thread, however, I have a Devil's Advocate sort of question. Something I've never really got around to rationalizing.

What about the people who are raised in a way that demoralizes homosexuality to an astonishing extent, and they themselves have a hatred towards gays, yet they themselves are gay? It is a rare condition, but an existing one. These people often horrid emotional issues because of their conflicts, and fear of family play into it also. Just wondering what anyone's take is on it.
[/quote]

it seems to be a bit of a cliche, the extremely homophobic guy being a closet homosexual (ie some recent politicians involved in scandals), though i wouldnt say they represent the whole group.

but as for children growing up in that sort of environment... yeah that is fairly typical. isnt Johnsonville brat Cheney's daughter a lesbian? if there was ever a father that less wanted his daughter to "disgrace" him like that, i dunno.
its that whole "**** you i wont do what you tell me" thing, so parents shouldnt clamp down too hard unless they want the opposite reaction.

[CatherineM]

Causes of homosexuality. I have no scientific studies to fall back on, but I dealt with several dozen gay clients, both male and female, and few somewhere inbetween. For the women, they all seemed to have some kind of trauma in their background that made them distrustful of men. Some were practically male haters, others afraid. It also seemed like their lives weren't about the sex so much as the companionship. With the men, it seemed like the sex was everything. The men I dealt with all said they knew they were different even as children where the women seemed to only later in life figure it out, or decide they were.

[infinitelord1]

[quote name='CatherineM' date='26 April 2010 - 11:26 AM' timestamp='1272299162' post='2100349']
Causes of homosexuality. I have no scientific studies to fall back on, but I dealt with several dozen gay clients, both male and female, and few somewhere inbetween. For the women, they all seemed to have some kind of trauma in their background that made them distrustful of men. Some were practically male haters, others afraid. It also seemed like their lives weren't about the sex so much as the companionship. With the men, it seemed like the sex was everything. The men I dealt with all said they knew they were different even as children where the women seemed to only later in life figure it out, or decide they were.
[/quote]

There is a good Scientific study on NARTH's website that you should check out if you are interested. It involves 100 sets of biological twins.

Some studies have suggested that women develop homosexual tendencies because they have been molested at an early age. Also, that they had experienced an emotional disconnection from their mother at a very early age. In the case of being molested or sexual abused...that would explain a fear or even anger for men later on in life. In the case of emotional disconnection, it is possible that they witnessed their mother being abused either physically or emotionally by their father (at an early age) and developed a negative view for their mother and father. This negative view for her mother may be developed because of the fact that her mother put up with her fathers poor treatment. The little girl will then grow up thinking to herself that she does not want to be like her mother. There are also cases where the mother may have a traumatic experience during a little girls key developmental stage (around 5 years old) and because of that, the mother is not in an emotional state to meet the emotional needs of her little girl. Hence, that emotional disconnection that leaves the little girl yearning for female affection which later becomes sexualized. I dont really know much about female homosexuality but there are a lot of similarities between it and male homosexuality...just a few minor differences.

[infinitelord1]

[quote name='Jesus_lol' date='26 April 2010 - 11:25 AM' timestamp='1272299101' post='2100347']
it seems to be a bit of a cliche, the extremely homophobic guy being a closet homosexual (ie some recent politicians involved in scandals), though i wouldnt say they represent the whole group.

but as for children growing up in that sort of environment... yeah that is fairly typical. isnt Johnsonville brat Cheney's daughter a lesbian? if there was ever a father that less wanted his daughter to "disgrace" him like that, i dunno.
its that whole "**** you i wont do what you tell me" thing, so parents shouldnt clamp down too hard unless they want the opposite reaction.
[/quote]

Most violence that occurs towards people with same sex attraction are committed by people who also experience same sex attraction. There are a lot of people out there who are homophobic and SSA+ because they have unwanted sexual urges towards the same sex. I personally do not have any anger towards SSA+ people unless they start trying to tell me that I am "gay" or if they persistantly persue me in a sexual way. That is the only time I really start to develop anger towards them. The best way to handle a situation like that is to inform them that you feel uncomfortable around them because of their behavior. Then simply just stay away from them. Dont put yourself in a position to where you feel vulnerable to their gestures.