Need Baptism Help Asap!

[StMichael]

Every Church in Fayetteville, NC is telling a friend that she can't get her infant baptized in the Catholic Church unless they have been practicing for 3 months at a particular Church.

Both parents are Catholic, married and her husband is a recent Vet.

Really need some advice here on how to assist them to have their child (infant, this is an infant) baptized into the Church. Their back up plan at this point is to go Lutheran or Methodist.

I will save my distain for those who are attempting to deny this child the gift of Faith.

[sixpence]

would it be terrible to go to mass for 3 months?

[HopefulBride]

Some parishes do have strict guidelines where the parent must be an active member either at the parish they are requesting or another parish before baptism can be performed. Personally I don't see anything wrong with it. They are after all taking responsibility to raise the child in the faith, what is wrong with wanting them to show that they can indeed dot hat by going to mass for 3 months? My uncle's parish asks for more time.

A friend was telling me the other day that her husband's friends threw a fit when the parish they asked to baptize their child said that they at least needed do the prep classes for parents (we have that in some parishes in the diocese) Well they got upset and went priest shopping. When they found out that it was the same throughout the differnt churches in town - and since they wanted their kid baptized catholic - they went back to the original priest and complied. In the end it is in the best interest of the child, it is for the same reason some priests ask a catholic marrying a non-catholic (in a catholic ceremony) to commit to raising the children in the faith; my fcatholic and her baptist husband had to commit to that before the priest agreed to marry them.




Edited to add the second paragraph

Edited September 28, 2010 by HopefulBride

[StMichael]

I cannot attest nor deny their frequency of attending Mass.

As it stands, baptism is an entry way into the Church. It appears as this join Sam's Club mentality is going to fail this child.

In NYC, it is with open arms that I have witnessed infants to be baptized in the RC faith.

Also, they were stationed at Ft. Bragg, not sure where they are now, but it does not appear they would have had enough time to belong to a civilian parish.

Seeking others to assist.

Thanks.

[quote name='sixpence' timestamp='1285704100' post='2176511']
would it be terrible to go to mass for 3 months?
[/quote]

[StMichael]

Marriage is between 2 adults.

And this is not about the adults but the infant. I agree they should be participating, but this is a recent war vet and I have no idea how long they have been away from the Fort.

I can't say I agree with punishing the child for the parents (that is why they have God Parents as well), so it appears unless I can provide an answer to them, this child will not be part of the Catholic faith.

[quote name='HopefulBride' timestamp='1285704422' post='2176514']
Some parishes do have strict guidelines where the parent must be an active member either at the parish they are requesting or another parish before baptism can be performed. Personally I don't see anything wrong with it. They are after all taking responsibility to raise the child in the faith, what is wrong with wanting them to show that they can indeed dot hat by going to mass for 3 months? My uncle's parish asks for more time.

A friend was telling me the other day that her husband's friends threw a fit when the parish they asked to baptize their child said that they at least needed do the prep classes for parents (we have that in some parishes in the diocese) Well they got upset and went priest shopping. When they found out that it was the same throughout the differnt churches in town - and since they wanted their kid baptized catholic - they went back to the original priest and complied. In the end it is in the best interest of the child, it is for the same reason some priests ask a catholic marrying a non-catholic (in a catholic ceremony) to commit to raising the children in the faith; my fcatholic and her baptist husband had to commit to that before the priest agreed to marry them.




Edited to add the second paragraph
[/quote]

[Lil Red]

ask the Bishop if it is diocesan policy. if he's military, they've probably been moving around a lot and can't regularly commit to a parish. ask Icey (whose hubby is military) what she might suggest.

God bless.

[StMichael]

Trying to get as many particulars as I can. But couldn't help think that this goes against Jesus' own Words:

Jesus said, "Let the children come to me, and do not prevent them; for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these." - Matthew 19:14

I do not believe I will be able to assist them and starting out this child's life baptized into the Catholic faith.

[StMichael]

Apparently the father is in Afghanistan and they targeted a date when he will be back and then he is shipping back out after.

Unbelievable if they are being said no to under the circumstances.

[HopefulBride]

[quote name='StMichael' timestamp='1285705042' post='2176520']
Marriage is between 2 adults.

And this is not about the adults but the infant. I agree they should be participating, but this is a recent war vet and I have no idea how long they have been away from the Fort.

I can't say I agree with punishing the child for the parents (that is why they have God Parents as well), so it appears unless I can provide an answer to them, this child will not be part of the Catholic faith.


[/quote]

Again it depends on the parish, in my nephew's case, my brother who is also a vet had not been in town for about a year prior to the baby's birth and my sis-in-law was staying with family in texas while my brother was away, so the priest asked that at least one of the godparents have proof of confirmation and proof of being an active parishioner. It sounds to me this is the guideline of the parish or even the diocese they are trying to baptize the child in. Yes they can go to a Lutheran church but it defeats the purpose, the catholic church isn't about giving it to us our way when we want it, part of it is about learning obedience and trusting in our pastors and spiritual leaders.

Edited September 28, 2010 by HopefulBride

[CatherineM]

Our parish has turned away children that they fear will not be raised in the faith. There are good reasons for it.

In this situation though, I'd try the Catholic chaplain at the base. Keep in mind that Deacons are also allowed to baptize.

[HopefulBride]

[quote name='StMichael' timestamp='1285708075' post='2176535']
Apparently the father is in Afghanistan and they targeted a date when he will be back and then he is shipping back out after.

Unbelievable if they are being said no to under the circumstances.
[/quote]

What about the mother? some parishes do not require both parents to be active.

[StMichael]

She was active at Ft. Bragg, can't say how long they have been off the Fort.

They seem to be stuck in between as her husband is now in Afghanistan as a civilian contractor, not military as I had thought (he was military).

She is hoping to get a letter from their new parish, allowing the Ft. Bragg RC Church to baptize the child, but thus far no success.


[quote name='HopefulBride' timestamp='1285708520' post='2176540']
What about the mother? some parishes do not require both parents to be active.
[/quote]

[Lilllabettt]

My mother baptized all of us secretly in the bathtub. She was a nervous sort. Then we had a regular church baptism in case the other one didn't take. My Mum is not a theologian.

Tell them to call the Bishop and ask for an exception. My mother took my brother, without an appointment, to St. Patrick's Cathedral for his "church" baptism. A seminarian who happened to be standing around was the godfather.

Of course, my mother is strongly willed. But if there's a good reason, I bet dollars to donuts the Bishop will make an exception. If all else fails there is the military archdiocese. They handle cases like this all the time.

[Maggyie]

[quote name='Lilllabettt' timestamp='1285714114' post='2176569']
My mother baptized all of us secretly in the bathtub. She was a nervous sort. Then we had a regular church baptism in case the other one didn't take. My Mum is not a theologian.

Tell them to call the Bishop and ask for an exception. My mother took my brother, without an appointment, to St. Patrick's Cathedral for his "church" baptism. A seminarian who happened to be standing around was the godfather.

Of course, my mother is strongly willed. But if there's a good reason, I bet dollars to donuts the Bishop will make an exception. If all else fails there is the military archdiocese. They handle cases like this all the time.
[/quote]

Lilla, mama is reading Phatmass over my shoulder and she says it wasn't a seminarian, just a random usher dude! Yay random usher dudes. And they weren't going to baptize him at all but my Dad mentioned that if Jesus was there, He would baptize him. That made the priest embarrassed and he agreed to do it. But yes I would say talk to the military archdiocese. They are the experts on this kind of situation. Maybe they could give her a letter or something.

Edited September 28, 2010 by Maggie

[IcePrincessKRS]

[quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1285705189' post='2176522']
ask the Bishop if it is diocesan policy. if he's military, they've probably been moving around a lot and can't regularly commit to a parish. ask Icey (whose hubby is military) what she might suggest.

God bless.
[/quote]

Where we are stationed the local parish wanted us to be registered parishioners for 6 months (X would have been over a year old by that point as we'd already put his Baptism off due to Ranger school and moving). My on post pastor at the time wanted us to go to a class, which they changed the date of and then "didn't know" when the next one would be held (thus putting Baptism on hold indefinitely). And he was terribly rude to me. We turned around and went back to Matt's home parish and got X Baptized there with family and friends in attendance.

I tried contacting the military archdiocese to get a dispensation from the class since we had already gone through all that (X is our 4th kid after all) but they never got back in touch with me.

[quote name='CatherineM' timestamp='1285708432' post='2176539']
Our parish has turned away children that they fear will not be raised in the faith. There are good reasons for it.

In this situation though, I'd try the Catholic chaplain at the base. Keep in mind that Deacons are also allowed to baptize.
[/quote]

Yes.

My two cents, wait the three months. This is the pastor/parish's way of ensuring that the Baptismal promises are most likely to be kept. It's not punishing anyone, it's making sure the parents are actually practicing Catholics and not just having their baby Baptized because it's "what you're supposed to do." Had they arranged the Baptism while she was pregnant and gotten classes out of the way there never would have been any need for this situation in the first place. I am not speaking to judge their situation other than the fact that I have been in that exact scenario myself.

[Cherie]

I completely understand your frustration.

Our child will be born any day now, and we only recently (i.e. for less than three months) relocated out of our home state. We are actually currently living on a military base, so I know even moreso what your friend is going through!

Thankfully, my husband's family is very close to their pastor back in Pennsylvania, so when our baby is born we are going to take him asap to Pennsylvania to have him baptized by the priest. Since Msgr. knows us so well, he knows we are very faithful, practicing Catholics, so we are not required to take any Baptismal courses. For that, I am extremely grateful to God.

I understand why churches require baptismal classes or a minimum involvement. Yes, it's to ensure the parents are "really" Catholic and will raise their child in the Faith. Unfortunately, it really doesn't play out that way. Parents take the classes, ok, but they still don't teach their children anything about the faith. It's often like pre-Cana, which is usually pitiful in most dioceses in the United States. Alas, they do try -- but I think in situations like these, it's better to offer a "dispensation" of sorts and baptize the child anyway. This is BAPTISM, people! It's NECESSARY for salvation!!! If a couple wants to get their child baptized in the first place, than I think that's a pretty good sign their heart is in the right place! I would be HORRIFIED if something happened to our baby before he had the chance to be baptized, and I think three months is WAAAAYYY too long to wait for a child to be baptized. Children were often baptized on the DAY they were born. I wish we could do it that way!

If they went to Mass on base, my suggestion is to get a letter from the chaplain there and hand it to the priest of the current parish. The priest would [i]have[/i] to honor it. I honestly think that is their best bet.

Really, baptism is NECESSARY. Oftentimes these tricky requirements and miles of red tape make it seem like it were just some sort of "special ceremony" like so many people of other faiths look at it. If a child were to stop breathing, they'd take him to get medical care immediately. The child is in need of salvation -- therefore they should baptize him as soon as possible!

Just my two cents, anyway. I feel very strongly about it!

[tinytherese]

[quote name='CherieMadame' timestamp='1285723181' post='2176612']

Really, baptism is NECESSARY. Oftentimes these tricky requirements and miles of red tape make it seem like it were just some sort of "special ceremony" like so many people of other faiths look at it. If a child were to stop breathing, they'd take him to get medical care immediately. The child is in need of salvation -- therefore they should baptize him as soon as possible!

Just my two cents, anyway. I feel very strongly about it!
[/quote]

Ave Maria and Pax Christi.

I can sympathize with what you are saying, but please do keep in mind that if heaven forbid a little one died before Baptism even though the parents intended to do so but didn't in time that the baby would still go to heaven because that would qualify as Baptism of desire which does save.

[MithLuin]

My nephew was baptized at less than one month old while his father was deployed in Afghanistan.

Of course, the child's grandfather is a deacon, so arranging that was not difficult .


If the parents think it is most important that the baptism be on a particular day and would be willing to have the baby baptized Methodist on account of this...then perhaps the local parish was right to request some indication of their intention to raise the child Catholic? Because they don't sound terribly committed at the moment. And yes, I know Lutheran baptism 'counts', but you do realize that you promise to raise the child in the Methodist faith during a Methodist baptism, right?

It looks as though the choices are: have the baby baptized at Ft. Bragg, where the chaplain/priest would know the family, or attend a local parish for three months and then baptize the baby.

I'm a little surprised the father of the baby has so little time at home. I would think he'd get at least a month. Poor guy.

[MissScripture]

[quote name='tinytherese' timestamp='1285726237' post='2176621']
Ave Maria and Pax Christi.

I can sympathize with what you are saying, but please do keep in mind that if heaven forbid a little one died before Baptism even though the parents intended to do so but didn't in time that the baby would still go to heaven because that would qualify as Baptism of desire which does save.
[/quote]

And if there is an emergency, anyone can baptize the baby.

[IcePrincessKRS]

[quote name='MithLuin' timestamp='1285728208' post='2176629']
My nephew was baptized at less than one month old while his father was deployed in Afghanistan.

Of course, the child's grandfather is a deacon, so arranging that was not difficult .


If the parents think it is most important that the baptism be on a particular day and would be willing to have the baby baptized Methodist on account of this...then perhaps the local parish was right to request some indication of their intention to raise the child Catholic? Because they don't sound terribly committed at the moment. And yes, I know Lutheran baptism 'counts', but you do realize that you promise to raise the child in the Methodist faith during a Methodist baptism, right?

It looks as though the choices are: have the baby baptized at Ft. Bragg, where the chaplain/priest would know the family, or attend a local parish for three months and then baptize the baby.

I'm a little surprised the father of the baby has so little time at home. I would think he'd get at least a month. Poor guy.
[/quote]

Yes, that was my point in mentioning that the wait tries to ensure that the parents are actually practicing Catholics. We promise to raise our children as Catholics, and, personally, I'm just not comfortable with lying to God. I'd rather wait and Baptize Catholic after a couple months than Baptize Methodist or Lutheran and be a liar.

I don't know how it works with contractors, but soldiers get 14 days of leave. The only way to get an extension on that is if there is an emergency (and great aunt Susie getting sick doesn't count). The reason why they limit it is because each battalion has about a 6 month window (because, for various reasons, on a 12 month deployment, they do not send anyone home--except for emergencies--for the first and last 3 months) to get anywhere from 300 to 1,200 troops home for their leave time (in my experience it's usually between 300-500, but google says it can be as high as 1,200). During that time they have to maintain a certain percentage of their troops so only a certain number can be sent home at once. The shorter amount of time ensures that everyone gets their chance to go home and see their loved ones.

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1285728323' post='2176631']
And if there is an emergency, anyone can baptize the baby.
[/quote]

I always gave my babies a conditional Baptism in case something happened to them before we got the official Baptism done.