Murder

[dairygirl4u2c]

ty

[Groo the Wanderer]

from the point of view of the murderer, i would have to say the ideal situation is to not get caught.



is that what you meant?

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote name='Groo the Wanderer' timestamp='1305031721' post='2239606']
from the point of view of the murderer, i would have to say the ideal situation is to not get caught.



is that what you meant?
[/quote]

... yes...

Edited May 10, 2011 by dairygirl4u2c

[Don John of Austria]

It is longestablished that murder is a state issue.

[Amppax]

Murder is something that is wrong everywhere (and that really isn't debatable) thus it would have to be something banned everywhere.

[dairygirl4u2c]

just seein if the abortion result would be different than the full fledged murder one
which as i wasn't surprised, is more 'let's ban federal' for murder but not as much for abortion

Edited May 10, 2011 by dairygirl4u2c

[RezaMikhaeil]

Well murder is really not debatable but what is is the punishments for such. This is where states rights comes in, as well as defining such as murder.

[Amppax]

I'm confused dairygirl, what is the debate here? If it is whether murder is wrong and should be banned nationally, i don't think there is any disagreement. But is it a debate on which level of government should handle it? then that would be state. Could you clarify please?

Edited May 11, 2011 by Amppax

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='Amppax' timestamp='1305073566' post='2239871']
I'm confused dairygirl, what is the debate here? If it is whether murder is wrong and should be banned nationally, i don't think there is any disagreement. But is it a debate on which level of government should handle it? then that would be state. Could you clarify please?
[/quote]



I will goone record saying I do ntothink Murder should be regulated in anyway by the Federal government.

[Groo the Wanderer]

agreed. if it were, they would start issuing licenses to collect more taxes...

[knightec]

[quote name='Groo the Wanderer' timestamp='1305031721' post='2239606']
from the point of view of the murderer, i would have to say the ideal situation is to not get caught.



is that what you meant?
[/quote]

That's why I'm studying criminal justice

[Amppax]

[quote name='Don John of Austria' timestamp='1305089578' post='2239975']
I will goone record saying I do ntothink Murder should be regulated in anyway by the Federal government.
[/quote]

Why? I'm afraid i just really don't understand your perspective, could you perhaps explain?

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='Amppax' timestamp='1305144707' post='2240179']
Why? I'm afraid i just really don't understand your perspective, could you perhaps explain?
[/quote]


THe federal government was not created to deal with the managment of the everyday lives of individual people. It has no role in creation of laws on marriage, sex, drinking, driving, sped limits, or even murder. It is there to allow our union to function with other nations, facilitate trade within the Union itself, and prevent conflicts between states from becoming wars between them.

That is all it should be doing.


Murder is illegal everywhere, but the Federal government is not a body equiped to make such laws. Nor should it be.

[Amppax]

[quote name='Don John of Austria' timestamp='1305149752' post='2240222']
THe federal government was not created to deal with the managment of the everyday lives of individual people. It has no role in creation of laws on marriage, sex, drinking, driving, sped limits, or even murder. It is there to allow our union to function with other nations, facilitate trade within the Union itself, and prevent conflicts between states from becoming wars between them.

That is all it should be doing.


Murder is illegal everywhere, but the Federal government is not a body equiped to make such laws. Nor should it be.
[/quote]

For the most part i agree with you, but in the event that a state were to allow murder (whatever form) I do think that the federal government should then step in and ban murder.

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='Amppax' timestamp='1305151196' post='2240231']
For the most part i agree with you, but in the event that a state were to allow murder (whatever form) I do think that the federal government should then step in and ban murder.
[/quote]



I don't.

History has shown that the federal government is more likely to allow such things than the State. That said, I simplly do not believe the Federal Government has the authority to do so. However I wouldn't have a problem with them expelling the State from the Union, and then treating them as a hostile foriegn power.

[Nihil Obstat]

A law against murder is sort of irrelevant, since any person has the right to defend themselves and innocents, with lethal force if necessary.
However, as a law, it is certainly legitimate because it is in accordance with natural law and is not aggressive in any sense.

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote name='Amppax' timestamp='1305073566' post='2239871']
I'm confused dairygirl, what is the debate here? If it is whether murder is wrong and should be banned nationally, i don't think there is any disagreement. But is it a debate on which level of government should handle it? then that would be state. Could you clarify please?
[/quote]

im mostly just curious to see if more people would vote that the federal government should ban murder, than the exact issue with abortion. more people vote that teh federal government should ban murder than they vote that they should ban abortion. my hypothesis is correct. the real debate i'd like to see, that i wouldn't expect people to know to read my mind, is why one is higher than the other. particularly the peopel who voted differently should say why.
unless this issue just compelled people who otherwise wouldn't vote, to vote, and there's no inconsistencies.

the issue about sovreignty and states rights i assumed would pop up, and is an interested issue, though, particularly about murder.

there's been laws against rape by the feds, then nothing by the state, and then the rapist got off by supreme court, just cause the feds didn't have power to make that law they said. it's interesting whether something would or at least could happen with murder. of course, it could phappen.

Edited May 12, 2011 by dairygirl4u2c

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' timestamp='1305160756' post='2240289']
im mostly just curious to see if more people would vote that the federal government should ban murder, than the exact issue with abortion. more people vote that teh federal government should ban murder than they vote that they should ban abortion. my hypothesis is correct. the real debate i'd like to see, that i wouldn't expect people to know to read my mind, is why one is higher than the other. particularly the peopel who voted differently should say why.
unless this issue just compelled people who otherwise wouldn't vote, to vote, and there's no inconsistencies.

the issue about sovreignty and states rights i assumed would pop up, and is an interested issue, though, particularly about murder.

there's been laws against rape by the feds, then nothing by the state, and then the rapist got off by supreme court, just cause the feds didn't have power to make that law they said. it's interesting whether something would or at least could happen with murder. of course, it could phappen.
[/quote]


1. I am against the Fed having authority over murder, I am agaisnt the fed havving authority over abortion. Even if a constitutional amendment were to be passed that acknowledged the unborn as persons I would hope that the punishment for murdering them would be left up to the states. We are a Union of Soverign State's not a single unified one.



2. What are you talking about... all states have had laws on rape, was this some particular definition? A civil rightscase? can you give some details?

Edited May 12, 2011 by Don John of Austria

[CatherineM]

The feds do have laws against murder. Tim McVey was executed by the feds, not by Oklahoma.

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='CatherineM' timestamp='1305170862' post='2240373']
The feds do have laws against murder. Tim McVey was executed by the feds, not by Oklahoma.
[/quote]


Thqat only applies to federal agents in the act of doing their duty, and on military bases and the like. And on the high seas. It is not generally applicable.