RezaMikhaeil Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1305421513' post='2241600'] Can someone explain how this is 'barbaric' but locking somebody in a small cage for 23 hours a day for years on end is enlightened and just?[/quote] I completely agree. If you take into account the psychological affects of solitary confinement, those are much worse. [quote]Violence is inherent to the state system. People just prefer it be disguised rather than accept it as an essential part to the system they depend on. So people want to put criminals away and pretend that if they just lock them in a small cage with other violent men, out of sight out of mind, we are being enlightened and humane. [/quote] Indeed the American system pretends to "rehabilitate" their criminals, but this is all a joke. [quote name='Era Might' timestamp='1305421527' post='2241601'] I don't think it's any more arbitrary and unreasonable than American sentencing. Would you rather have acid thrown on your face or be put in prison for 25 years? I think I'd take the acid. The American justice system thinks that because it does not inflict physical harm, that therefore it does not inflict harm. Frankly, I think some corporal punishments can be more humane than years and years of mental anguish in prison (not that either type of punishment solves the real problem). I'm not saying I support throwing acid in people's faces as punishment. I'm just saying that I don't think it's necessarily any more cruel than locking a man away for years. [/quote] I'm not sure which I'd pick but I don't think that I'd throw acid on a beautiful woman's face just because she rejected my hand in marriage either. However I do agree with you. [quote name='dairygirl4u2c' timestamp='1305421619' post='2241602'] we should also pray for her to find the path to forgiveness (at least if he's sorry, which is another long difficult thread in itself to address). she's been put in a difficult path in life. [/quote] Well maybe she has forgiven, just not forgotten. Forgiveness is not expecting that he not face consequences to his actions. No doubt this woman has "a pair" bigger then most men that I know. I mean it does take courage to go through with such. She was willing to do it herself. [quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1305421637' post='2241603'] Wow. Stop the presses. Era and Hassan agree. [/quote] Stop the clocks, for that matter. [quote name='Era Might' timestamp='1305422227' post='2241607'] How bout that. By the way, I feel bad for the lady who had acid thrown in her face. Such an unconscionable thing to have happen to you. [/quote] No doubt. Most victims of it in Iran, Bangladesh, India, Pakistan, etc. never get this sort of justice.
RezaMikhaeil Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1305422838' post='2241611'] Catholic belief precludes torture though, including that which doesn't leave lasting damage. [/quote] Putting someone in solitary confinement is torture too, just not external, but internal.
Nihil Obstat Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='RezaMikhaeil' timestamp='1305423146' post='2241615'] Putting someone in solitary confinement is torture too, just not external, but internal. [/quote] You won't hear me disagreeing.
xSilverPhinx Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1305422944' post='2241613'] Good question. How do you define emotional or psychological torture? [/quote] Well for one I think it's more subjective than it seems. Some might find incarceration to be unbearable psychological or emotional torture, even if no physical harm is inflicted. I think it's anything intentional that[i] causes distress[/i], and psychological and emotional scars outlast physical scars in the distress they cause. For instance, trying to get someone to believe that they're going to hell for not accepting a particular doctrine can be psychological torture. There are some people who really develop phobias and post traumatic stress disorders as results of this. IMO, loosing one eye (even if no physical pain is felt) is more distressful than having some painful acid thrown on my back for instance. I think that in some cases (such as with sadistic people who inflict torture for their own pleasure and amusment) an eye for an eye can show them the very basic principle that is the golden rule. If you don't want something to happen to you, then don't inflict it on others. Or at least don't cry about it. (I know a lot of sadistic people and I'm sort of ranting here)
Lil Red Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='xSilverPhinx' timestamp='1305417868' post='2241578'] Apparently he might only get blinded in one eye, and only after he's unconcious in a hospital ward. More like 'an eye for two eyes'. [/quote] to quote an article I read today, because one man is worth two women.
xSilverPhinx Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1305426013' post='2241627'] to quote an article I read today, because one man is worth two women. [/quote] [url="http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/13/iran-blind-criminal-acid?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487"]Link[/url]
RezaMikhaeil Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='xSilverPhinx' timestamp='1305423989' post='2241621'] For instance, trying to get someone to believe that they're going to hell for not accepting a particular doctrine can be psychological torture. There are some people who really develop phobias and post traumatic stress disorders as results of this.[/quote] This was me as a child. [quote]IMO, loosing one eye (even if no physical pain is felt) is more distressful than having some painful acid thrown on my back for instance. [/quote] In this situation, he spilled acid on her entire face and his punishment is a few drops in one eye. [quote]I think that in some cases (such as with sadistic people who inflict torture for their own pleasure and amusment) an eye for an eye can show them the very basic principle that is the golden rule. If you don't want something to happen to you, then don't inflict it on others. Or at least don't cry about it. (I know a lot of sadistic people and I'm sort of ranting here) [/quote] I think that you're onto something here. [quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1305426013' post='2241627'] to quote an article I read today, because one man is worth two women. [/quote] This is not true.
4588686 Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1305426013' post='2241627'] to quote an article I read today, because one man is worth two women. [/quote] That's true. Without a servile class ready to care for the men who keep this country great things would fall apart. A good woman is like a sturdy cow. She may not have much to say worth listening too, but without her the farm would fall apart.
Winchester Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 Eye for an eye is a limitation. Acid in his face seems to follow that limitation. I'd kill the son of a beesh because he's a danger to society. floopy him.
4588686 Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305427936' post='2241639'] floopy him. [/quote] Exactly
RezaMikhaeil Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305427936' post='2241639'] Eye for an eye is a limitation. Acid in his face seems to follow that limitation. I'd kill the son of a beesh because he's a danger to society. floopy him. [/quote] As her father I would, or atleast make him wish he was dead but who knows. If [H.H.] Pope John Paul II can forgive his would be assasin, maybe I could forgive someone throwing acid on a child of mine. I doubt it, but who knows.
xSilverPhinx Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='RezaMikhaeil' timestamp='1305430308' post='2241677'] As her father I would, or atleast make him wish he was dead but who knows. If [H.H.] Pope John Paul II can forgive his would be assasin, maybe I could forgive someone throwing acid on a child of mine. I doubt it, but who knows. [/quote] I don't know, when family is messed with, things get complicated.
Winchester Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 If it was my daughter, I'd make a cape out of his skin and a goblet out of his skull.
RezaMikhaeil Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305430534' post='2241693'] If it was my daughter, I'd make a cape out of his skin and a goblet out of his skull. [/quote] Ouch...
Don John of Austria Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1305421513' post='2241600'] Can someone explain how this is 'barbaric' but locking somebody in a small cage for 23 hours a day for years on end is enlightened and just? Violence is inherent to the state system. People just prefer it be disguised rather than accept it as an essential part to the system they depend on. So people want to put criminals away and pretend that if they just lock them in a small cage with other violent men, out of sight out of mind, we are being enlightened and humane. [/quote] I completely, 100%, agree with you. Oh my thats twice in one week.
Don John of Austria Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='xSilverPhinx' timestamp='1305423989' post='2241621'] For instance, trying to get someone to believe that they're going to hell for not accepting a particular doctrine can be psychological torture. There are some people who really develop phobias and post traumatic stress disorders as results of this. [/quote] But what if it keeps them from going to Hell?
4588686 Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305430534' post='2241693'] If it was my daughter, I'd make a cape out of his skin and a goblet out of his skull. [/quote] I'd dance seductively for him, causing him to question his sexuality, and then call him a homo. THAT'D SHOW HIM! [quote name='Don John of Austria' timestamp='1305448328' post='2241782'] I completely, 100%, agree with you. Oh my thats twice in one week. [/quote] Edited May 15, 2011 by Hasan
Don John of Austria Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305430534' post='2241693'] If it was my daughter, I'd make a cape out of his skin and a goblet out of his skull. [/quote] The cape is a little far. I mean where would you wear it? Humanskin capes just aren't in fashion anymore, those went out in 1523. Now the goblet... good conversasion piece, and I am sure the bone inside the skullcase would ad a good flavor to wine.
ParadiseFound Posted May 15, 2011 Author Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1305415286' post='2241564'] I don't see anything unjust about this. And I don't see how this is anything other than fair and reasonable. As Reza noted, he's really getting off easy. He's just being blinded. That's only part of what he did to her. [/quote] It may have sounded like it was criticising the verdict, but I wasn't. I was criticising sharia law itself.
RezaMikhaeil Posted May 15, 2011 Posted May 15, 2011 [quote name='ParadiseFound' timestamp='1305452625' post='2241790'] It may have sounded like it was criticising the verdict, but I wasn't. I was criticising sharia law itself. [/quote] Ummm...what did you specifically critique about it? I must have missed that part...
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