Refuting "sexist" Attacks On The Church

[infinitelord1]

[quote name='CatherineM' timestamp='1306966160' post='2248932']
Christ broke every social taboo of his day. Had he wanted to ordain women, he would have. [u][b]He [/b][/u]chose not too. Had he wanted me to be a priest, he would have made me a man. God didn't. He also didn't intend for me to be a gymnast or a jockey. I'm too tall. He didn't want me to be a ballerina because he gave me really big feet. That's an unfair discrimination against me. You can turn anything into a discrimination if you try hard enough. Sometimes life is unfair, but that doesn't make it a hate crime.
[/quote]

Good Point. One question I always ask protestants is...."where is salvation on earth in the bible?". I think the same applies here. A good question would be..."where is ordained female ministers in the Bible?". If they can't answer then ask them if they believe in Sola Scriptura. Case Closed.

[Vincent Vega]

In my experience, most Sola Scriptura types are not the kind to 'ordain' females.

[Ash Wednesday]

I'm a woman, and I know I'd be one of the worst priests ever. Once a month I'd be weeping and popping chocolate on the other side of the confessional instead of listening to people's sins and worries. "YOU think you have problems?!?! YOU TRY BEING A PRIEST AND A WOMAN!!!!! I GIVE YOU THREE HAIL MARYS FOR YOUR PENANCE, LEARN TO RESPECT YOUR WIFE MORE NEXT TIME, NOW GET OUT!"

[Ash Wednesday]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' timestamp='1307999432' post='2253315']
In my experience, most Sola Scriptura types are not the kind to 'ordain' females.
[/quote]

This is a good point, many fundamentalists outside of mainline Protestantism are considerably more traditional about gender roles. Most people of the mainline liberal Protestant variety that accuse the Church of sexism seem to also espouse many other heterodox views in light of Christian tradition and an increasing number of them also add "homophobic" to the litany of problems they have with the Church as well.

And yet, more or less all of them have roots in sola scriptura traditions. Go figure.

Edited June 14, 2011 by Ash Wednesday

[MIKolbe]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' timestamp='1308049168' post='2253530']
I'm a woman, and I know I'd be one of the worst priests ever. Once a month I'd be weeping and popping chocolate on the other side of the confessional instead of listening to people's sins and worries. "YOU think you have problems?!?! YOU TRY BEING A PRIEST AND A WOMAN!!!!! I GIVE YOU THREE HAIL MARYS FOR YOUR PENANCE, LEARN TO RESPECT YOUR WIFE MORE NEXT TIME, NOW GET OUT!"
[/quote]
Interesting side story...Father once gave me a pennace of giving my wife a 30 minute foot rub. Shea almost gave him a big hug after Mass. lol

[kujo]

The Church is NOT sexist; rather, it recognizes and affirms the fact that men and women have different but equal intrinsic values.

[quote name='Lilllabettt' timestamp='1307142580' post='2249648']
A woman who wants to be a priest does not really understand the identity of a priest or the identity of women.

Women are the pinnacle of creation; upon their fate the destiny of the world pivots. This is why Satan attacked Eve in the garden, because of her exquisite significance in the order of the world, because of her particular role in making creation "good" and "complete."

Priests are called to be imitators of Jesus Christ, the 2nd Adam. Unlike the 1st Adam, Jesus and all the priests who come after Him must directly confront Satan. Priests must walk around with a giant target on their backs. They must be nailed to the Cross.

So we know about:
1. the significant role women have in determining the spiritual welfare of mankind and
2. the dangerous role priests have

Knowing that, it would seem rather dumb to let women be priests.

The Statue of Liberty is a strong woman - and a terrorist target. So we put artillery around her. Not because we think she is not valuable, or a hunk of junk, or weak - but because she is valuable to us ... which is also precisely why the bad guys are out to get her.

Ignore what happened in the movie. If aliens really invaded earth, would we [i]really[/i] let the President of the United States fly F-22's in the air battle against them? Of course not. We'd put the President in a bunker somewhere. Why, because we think the President isn't strong enough to fight? No - its just what happens to the President matters too much to the future of the country, and can't be risked that way.

So God is not going to suggest that we take women, upon whom the salvation of the world pivots, and throw them into a grudge match with the Prince of Darkness.
[/quote]

So, in essence, you're saying that women need to be protected, like children, from the Big Bad Wolf?

I mean, I agree with the Church's teaching on this, and THIS has to be the [b]worst[/b] explanation ever. Not trying to be rude...

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' timestamp='1308049168' post='2253530']
I'm a woman, and I know I'd be one of the worst priests ever. Once a month I'd be weeping and popping chocolate on the other side of the confessional instead of listening to people's sins and worries. "YOU think you have problems?!?! YOU TRY BEING A PRIEST AND A WOMAN!!!!! I GIVE YOU THREE HAIL MARYS FOR YOUR PENANCE, LEARN TO RESPECT YOUR WIFE MORE NEXT TIME, NOW GET OUT!"
[/quote]

I know you're joking, but couldn't the whole "once-a-month" thing be used to argue against women being the head of ANYTHING?!?! I mean, I remember when I was growing up, I'd hear other boys say "There'll never be a female president! Once a month she'd [i]nuke[/i] somebody!"

[kujo]

Then again, it's hard not to view Christianity as sexist when you see a passage like this:

[quote]"The women are to keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but are to subject themselves, just as the Law also says. If they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church." - 1 Cor 14:34-35[/quote]

[Ash Wednesday]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1308054840' post='2253546']
I know you're joking, but couldn't the whole "once-a-month" thing be used to argue against women being the head of ANYTHING?!?! I mean, I remember when I was growing up, I'd hear other boys say "There'll never be a female president! Once a month she'd [i]nuke[/i] somebody!"
[/quote]

If you know I am just joking, why not just leave it at that?

Edited June 14, 2011 by Ash Wednesday

[kujo]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' timestamp='1308061644' post='2253598']
If you know I am just joking, why not just leave it at that?
[/quote]

Because perhaps someone could visit this site and NOT pick up on your high-brow humor.

[Ash Wednesday]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1308061851' post='2253600']
Because perhaps someone could visit this site and NOT pick up on your high-brow humor.
[/quote]

Well, that's mighty charitable (?) of you. Whatever that's supposed to mean.

I missed the part where making some joke about myself could seriously be applied and morphed into some kind of rational and intelligent argument about biology and a woman's competence. If someone is able to do that, I'd like them to pick me some lottery numbers as well.

[kujo]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' timestamp='1308062306' post='2253609']
Well, that's mighty charitable (?) of you. Whatever that's supposed to mean.

I missed the part where making some joke about myself could seriously be applied and morphed into some kind of rational and intelligent argument about biology and a woman's competence. If someone is able to do that, I'd like them to pick me some lottery numbers as well.
[/quote]

I'll see what I can do.

[Ash Wednesday]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1308063473' post='2253620']
I'll see what I can do.
[/quote]

[kujo]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' timestamp='1308066211' post='2253641']

[/quote]

Got 'em!

[img]http://unrealityshout.com/files/imagecache/image_460/hurley%20lost%20lotto.jpg[/img]

[MissScripture]

[quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1308051407' post='2253537']
Interesting side story...Father once gave me a pennace of giving my wife a 30 minute foot rub. Shea almost gave him a big hug after Mass. lol
[/quote]
He was trying really hard to get her to convert, I bet. lol.

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1308054840' post='2253546']
I know you're joking, but couldn't the whole "once-a-month" thing be used to argue against women being the head of ANYTHING?!?! I mean, I remember when I was growing up, I'd hear other boys say "There'll never be a female president! Once a month she'd [i]nuke[/i] somebody!"
[/quote]
But the difference is that most of the rest of the females in the world are on birth control, and that can reduce the number of "times of the month" so then they'd only need to nuke things 4 times a year, or something like that.

[kujo]

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1308070268' post='2253655']
But the difference is that most of the rest of the females in the world are on birth control, and that can reduce the number of "times of the month" so then they'd only need to nuke things 4 times a year, or something like that.
[/quote]

I think most people who are on BC just do the regular pill.

[Mr.Cat]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1308055039' post='2253547']Then again, it's hard not to view Christianity as sexist when you see a passage like this:[/quote]When I first saw this topic, I thought to myself... "[i]A Christian that can admit that his faith is at least a bit discriminatory and has been in the past is first admission to an honest discussion.[/i]" As I have grown older I truly hate white washing of history, if we forget how we made our mistakes before, we are truly doomed to repeat them. But as a history enthusiast preservation of the timeline is rather important.

Edited June 14, 2011 by Mr.CatholicCat

[kujo]

[quote name='Mr.CatholicCat' timestamp='1308071133' post='2253664']
When I first saw this topic, I thought to myself... "[i]A Christian that can admit that his faith is at least a bit discriminatory and has been in the past is first admission to an honest discussion.[/i]" As I have grown older I truly hate white washing of history, if we forget how we made our mistakes before, we are truly doomed to repeat them. But as a history enthusiast preservation of the timeline is rather important.

With that said... the Church in the mid 20th century to early 21st century has become a strong advocate for the dignity and liberties of women. That position is felt in the difference in expectations with women that I feel with Catholics in general. While I have never seen a survey done, the amount of women who contribute to the Church and offer expert opinion in theology, canonlaw, or other services I imagine is more than any other christian religion that I can immediately think of...
[/quote]

Agreed.

You'd be a fool to try and talk your way around the lecherous, lascivious and icentious behaviors espoused by some in our Church's history. Not to mention the murders, the intrigues and other awfulness.

That shouldn't degrade the value and beauty of the Church's teachings, so there's no reason to deny it.

[MissScripture]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1308070623' post='2253660']
I think most people who are on BC just do the regular pill.
[/quote]
Just from passing conversation, I was actually surprised how many of my classmates did actually use that kind, or else would just manipulate the pills to skip their periods when they didn't want them to happen. But this is totally off topic, so I'll stop now, particularly since I don't know THAT much about it, because I would punch any doctor who tried to make me take it.

[kujo]

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1308072132' post='2253672']
...because I would punch any doctor who tried to make me take it.
[/quote]

Christian chastity. Gotta love it!

[MissScripture]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1308072493' post='2253674']
Christian chastity. Gotta love it!
[/quote]
Okay, I probably wouldn't seriously, but if they suggested it, I would say no, if they pushed it, I would probably chew them out.