Gingrich Vows To Defund Planned Parenthood

[4588686]

[quote name='MissyP89' timestamp='1327434463' post='2374553']
As do I. And I really hope there is something moral driving this rather than just playing it safe and giving the party what they want.

Let's hope this goes somewhere.
[/quote]

Federal funding of abortion is illegal (and has been for decades). If the federal government cuts their funding to Planned Parenthood they are not cutting money for abortions. They are cutting money for lower-income women to get free health services.

Once again, the republicans use people concerned about moral issues to dump all over the poor.

[MissyP89]

ETA: This post was directed at Kujo.

Eh. I don't trust [i]any [/i]of those goons worth a darn, frankly. But I can hope and pray for true conversion of heart, at the very least.

Self-seeking, imperfect reasons for a pro-life stance are still better than not having one at all, IMO.

Edited January 24, 2012 by MissyP89

[kujo]

[quote name='MissyP89' timestamp='1327434877' post='2374561']
ETA: This post was directed at Kujo.

Eh. I don't trust [i]any [/i]of those goons worth a darn, frankly. But I can hope and pray for true conversion of heart, at the very least.

Self-seeking, imperfect reasons for a pro-life stance are still better than not having one at all, IMO.
[/quote]

Well said, sis. If I could give props, I would...

[4588686]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1327434693' post='2374557']
Newt Gingrich, who has been against federal funding for Planned Parenthood for most of his public life--during which time he has shown that his "driving" force isn't exactly moral orthodoxy--suddenly developed a conscious? I don't remember who is was that said it, but someone once said that they don't trust conversions on death row or on the campaign trail.
[/quote]

I'd be more likely to believe a conversion on death row than on the campaign trail. Newt has been planning to run since at least 2007. Everybody knew it (and here I'm talking about right wing radio hosts I was listening to at the time) when he made his unprompted admission of the affair towards the beginning of the campaign session.

I wouldn't believe Newt Gingrich if he told me the sky is blue. And frankly, I've never heard him say anything particularly intelligent. I have heard him make relatively inane observations with very ornate, masculine language.

[Papist]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1327434693' post='2374557']
Newt Gingrich, who has been against federal funding for Planned Parenthood for most of his public life--during which time he has shown that his "driving" force isn't exactly moral orthodoxy--suddenly developed a conscious? I don't remember who is was that said it, but someone once said that they don't trust conversions on death row or on the campaign trail.
[/quote]

Hence, "Perhaps".

[Papist]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1327435020' post='2374562']
Well said, sis. If I could give props, I would...
[/quote]

I did it for you.

[kujo]

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1327437350' post='2374578']
I did it for you.
[/quote]

Appreciate it.

[XIX]

Maybe Newt is serious, maybe he is full of it. But look at his voting record. Look at his political body of work. Words mean less than nothing this time of year.

[thessalonian]

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1327358283' post='2374040']
Defunding PP is a good thing.
[/quote]

It's a GREAT THING!

[thessalonian]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1327434801' post='2374559']
Federal funding of abortion is illegal (and has been for decades). If the federal government cuts their funding to Planned Parenthood they are not cutting money for abortions. They are cutting money for lower-income women to get free health services.

Once again, the republicans use people concerned about moral issues to dump all over the poor.
[/quote]

That's a shell game.

[4588686]

[quote name='thessalonian' timestamp='1327440064' post='2374593']
That's a shell game.
[/quote]

If by 'shell game' you mean 'it's illegal for the federal government to fund abortions' then yes. It is indeed a shell game.

[Jesus_lol]

I think he is saying that it will still indirectly aid the organization.

of course, if the government is not allowed to fund prayer and religious speak, why should they still fund other parts of the catholic church and related organizations? its just a shell game obviously, as giving the church money for humanitarian aid and education is just allowing the Church to spend even more of prayer and other stuff. obviously the govt. should stop funding the Catholic schools, etc

[brianthephysicist]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1327434801' post='2374559']
Federal funding of abortion is illegal (and has been for decades). If the federal government cuts their funding to Planned Parenthood they are not cutting money for abortions. They are cutting money for lower-income women to get free health services.

Once again, the republicans use people concerned about moral issues to dump all over the poor.
[/quote]

Well that's the funny thing about funding. It's not that hard to get around what funding agencies don't want you to do with the money they give you.

Say that a clinic has 10 rooms dedicated to things abortion related and 10 rooms strictly for non-abortion related services. They can use government funding to build an addition to their building with 10 more rooms strictly for non-abortion related services. Well, since they really only needed 10 rooms for non-abortion related services, the 10 rooms that originally served as non-abortion related service rooms can easily be re-purposed to allow for abortion related services.

On paper, the government funded for PP to create 10 rooms for non-abortion related services, but PP was able to open up 10 more rooms for abortion related services.

I'm not saying that this is the case every time, I'm simply saying that it's easy to come up with ways to get around this restriction and use the money to fund abortion.

[Jesus_lol]

[quote name='brianthephysicist' timestamp='1327443188' post='2374624']
Well that's the funny thing about funding. It's not that hard to get around what funding agencies don't want you to do with the money they give you.

Say that a clinic has 10 rooms dedicated to things abortion related and 10 rooms strictly for non-abortion related services. They can use government funding to build an addition to their building with 10 more rooms strictly for non-abortion related services. Well, since they really only needed 10 rooms for non-abortion related services, the 10 rooms that originally served as non-abortion related service rooms can easily be re-purposed to allow for abortion related services.

On paper, the government funded for PP to create 10 rooms for non-abortion related services, but PP was able to open up 10 more rooms for abortion related services.

I'm not saying that this is the case every time, I'm simply saying that it's easy to come up with ways to get around this restriction and use the money to fund abortion.
[/quote]

this is true, and i mentioned a similar potential situation above your post. Using the same logic could prevent funding of good things just because they may indirectly aid bad or illegal things. this could probably apply to a lot more organizations than just PP, including the Catholic Church

[MissyP89]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1327435020' post='2374562']
Well said, sis. If I could give props, I would...
[/quote]

Yeah, just noticed I can't prop you. Way to be a rebel.

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1327437350' post='2374578']
I did it for you.
[/quote]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1327437873' post='2374581']
Appreciate it.
[/quote]

Thank you, gentlemen.

[BG45]

Federal funding for abortion is illegal, however Planned Parenthood, per former employees, does not differentiate the money used on abortion services and family planning according to former employees. It all goes into one pot, account wise, and gets spent accordingly.

[4588686]

[quote name='brianthephysicist' timestamp='1327443188' post='2374624']
Well that's the funny thing about funding. It's not that hard to get around what funding agencies don't want you to do with the money they give you.

Say that a clinic has 10 rooms dedicated to things abortion related and 10 rooms strictly for non-abortion related services. They can use government funding to build an addition to their building with 10 more rooms strictly for non-abortion related services. Well, since they really only needed 10 rooms for non-abortion related services, the 10 rooms that originally served as non-abortion related service rooms can easily be re-purposed to allow for abortion related services.

On paper, the government funded for PP to create 10 rooms for non-abortion related services, but PP was able to open up 10 more rooms for abortion related services.

I'm not saying that this is the case every time, I'm simply saying that it's easy to come up with ways to get around this restriction and use the money to fund abortion.
[/quote]

I understand what his point was. It's been a republican refrain for sometime. But that's still not a shell game. The money is not secretly going to abortions. The money they get from the federal government goes towards providing those services to women. None of which funds abortions. Abortion is a constitutionally protected right. What the advocates of funding as a 'shell game' really want is to prevent Planned Parenthood from being able to provide abortion and contraceptive services at all. They don't simply want to free the conscience's of their pro-life constituents. They want to infringe on the rights of others and their real enemy is Planned Parenthood as such. They don't like Planned Parenthood because they provide contraceptives and and STD testing and the only people who need those services are naughty people having naughty sex and if they didn't have recourse to Planned Parenthood then maybe they won't have naughty sex.

That's the real goal of just about every person who has a problem with Planned Parenthood. The finding scheme is fine. It's a perfectly reasonable compromise. The real target here is what people convinced that they're soldier's in the Lord's army take to be illicit sex.

[brianthephysicist]

[quote name='Jesus_lol' timestamp='1327443359' post='2374627']
this is true, and i mentioned a similar potential situation above your post. Using the same logic could prevent funding of good things just because they may indirectly aid bad or illegal things. this could probably apply to a lot more organizations than just PP, including the Catholic Church
[/quote]
sorry I didn't see your other post until after I posted (I type slow lol)

And yes, I do realize that this is a valid point. I had been thinking more along the lines of scale of the problem: being accused of funding prayer is significantly less of a charge than being accused of funding murder.

Hmm...My first thought to this was that yes, it would be worth it. I would be fine with the government pulling all its funding on the catholic church and other organizations with similar situations as long as it also pulled all its funding for agencies that supported abortion. But now that I'm thinking about it, that wouldn't really work either. I'm funded by gov't money for my education. Some of the money I would have had to spend on school, I have been able to donate to the catholic church. So by funding my education, the gov't has indirectly helped fund the catholic church which in turn would mean it funded prayer.

This really raises a tough question. I don't know of any way to separate this. All I can say is that I'm going to continue fighting to stop gov't funding of PP, even if it means the end of gov't funding to anything catholic, because funding murder is worse than not funding help for the poor; God will show us a different way to take care of those less fortunate.

[4588686]

[quote name='BG45' timestamp='1327444841' post='2374643']
Federal funding for abortion is illegal, however Planned Parenthood, per former employees, does not differentiate the money used on abortion services and family planning according to former employees. It all goes into one pot, account wise, and gets spent accordingly.
[/quote]

Any evidence? I doubt it. Because if there were any hard evidence for that claim there are any number religious groups with plenty of funding and fairly litigious inclinations who would love to see Planned Parenthood shut down and its members jailed.

[4588686]

[quote name='brianthephysicist' timestamp='1327445632' post='2374655']
sorry I didn't see your other post until after I posted (I type slow lol)

And yes, I do realize that this is a valid point. I had been thinking more along the lines of scale of the problem: being accused of funding prayer is significantly less of a charge than being accused of funding murder.

Hmm...My first thought to this was that yes, it would be worth it. I would be fine with the government pulling all its funding on the catholic church and other organizations with similar situations as long as it also pulled all its funding for agencies that supported abortion. But now that I'm thinking about it, that wouldn't really work either. I'm funded by gov't money for my education. Some of the money I would have had to spend on school, I have been able to donate to the catholic church. So by funding my education, the gov't has indirectly helped fund the catholic church which in turn would mean it funded prayer.

This really raises a tough question. I don't know of any way to separate this. All I can say is that I'm going to continue fighting to stop gov't funding of PP, even if it means the end of gov't funding to anything catholic, because funding murder is worse than not funding help for the poor; God will show us a different way to take care of those less fortunate.
[/quote]

Right. And by that reasoning the government is also indirectly funding Islam, Judaism, Protestantism, and numerous other heretical and heathenistic groups. And since your religious faith won't allow you to permit poor women to get health care if it means indirectly funding abortions I'm sure that, being the sincere Catholic that you are, you won't take the federal student funding that helps propagate false doctrines that leads innumerable lost souls to hell and away from the Salvic truths of the Holy Roman Church.