The More Planned Parenthood Speaks Up. The More We See The Vitriol

[kujo]

LOL @ people on here being offended by people pejoratively-referring to pro-lifers as "anti-woman" or "anti-choice" or whatever. This is the same crowd whose ranks routinely refer to their opposition as "baby killers" who are "pro-abortion" while driving billboard-laden-trucks around town with pictures of aborted fetuses and the like.

I consider myself pro-life (and anti-death penalty, to answer Hasan's highly-accurate charge of hypocrisy) and refuse to engage in all of that nonsense rhetoric people on "my side" engage in. I don't begrudge the "other side" their rhetoric flourishes, because we are just as guilty of it.

[Ice_nine]

You know even taking into account that "our side" spews out pejoratives and the like, doesn't mean it all of the sudden becomes oki dokie when the other side does it.

"This isn't vitriolic, you're side does the same thing." is not a good argument. Perhaps both sides can be














VITRIOLIC

but that's not what we're discussing here. If you want to talk about the vitriolic pro-life rhetoric in this debacle, then do so. Making generalized accusations about the pro-life side is useless. I"m well aware pro-lifers can be arse portals. We're people too.

Have a nice day

Edited February 5, 2012 by Ice_nine

[kujo]

[quote name='Ice_nine' timestamp='1328469926' post='2381583']
You know even taking into account that "our side" spews out pejoratives and the like, doesn't mean it all of the sudden becomes oki dokie when the other side does it.

"This isn't vitriolic, you're side does the same thing." is not a good argument. Perhaps both sides can be














VITRIOLIC

but that's not what we're discussing here. If you want to talk about the vitriolic pro-life rhetoric in this debacle, then do so. Making generalized accusations about the pro-life side is useless. I"m well aware pro-lifers can be arse portals. We're people too.

Have a nice day
[/quote]

I'm pretty sure I can do what I want.

And what I "want" is for you and others to recognize this irony. It's there...laugh at it.

[Jaime]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1328460222' post='2381493']
LOL @ people on here being offended by people pejoratively-referring to pro-lifers as "anti-woman" or "anti-choice" or whatever. This is the same crowd whose ranks routinely refer to their opposition as "baby killers" who are "pro-abortion" while driving billboard-laden-trucks around town with pictures of aborted fetuses and the like.

I consider myself pro-life (and anti-death penalty, to answer Hasan's highly-accurate charge of hypocrisy) and refuse to engage in all of that nonsense rhetoric people on "my side" engage in. I don't begrudge the "other side" their rhetoric flourishes, because we are just as guilty of it.
[/quote]

Just because there are some who call themselves pro-life and are equally vitriolic does not mean that I no longer am allowed to be offended when someone insults me. I would argue that people who use the signs, blow up clinics and engage in vitriolic language are more accurately called anti abortion and less accurately pro-life. But just because they exist doesn't mean that I can't take exception to someone else's language when they are addressing me. To suggest otherwise is ridiculous.

But again you're missing the point I was trying to make in the OP. Planned Parenthood supports this language. They encourage it!! You will find most pro-life people not agreeing with those who are on the extreme side and consider themselves a part of the pro-life movement. And it makes me happy that PP is starting to show their true colors. The truth is eventually going to bear out.

They have no intention to better the health of poor women or any women
They are a racist organization
They promote and support the sex trade of minors
Their existance is directly related to abortion being the #1killer of African Americans today.

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='jaime' timestamp='1328473913' post='2381616']
They are a racist organization
They promote and support the sex trade of minors
Their existance is directly related to abortion being the #1killer of African Americans today.
[/quote]
These are the most offensive to me. I understand being pro-abortion (well, I don't understand it, but I understand that people are), but I don't understand how you can be so ignorant or stubborn to support an organization that is so intrinsically rotten.

[Anastasia13]

[quote name='Brother Adam' timestamp='1328404923' post='2381127'][font=arial, verdana, sans-serif][size=2][color=#ff0000][size=4][ ... contraception is never a need. ][/size][/color][/size][/font]
[/quote]
I disagree with this. There are rare cases where childbirth is too great a medical risk for the mother. I would say it is 99.998% of the time not a need. As I recall, there are rare, special cases where a priest would permit a couple to use contraception.

Edited February 5, 2012 by Light and Truth

[Anastasia13]

Lord have mercy.

[Basilisa Marie]

[quote name='Light and Truth' timestamp='1328475460' post='2381631']
I disagree with this. There are rare cases where childbirth is too great a medical risk for the mother. I would say it is 99.998% of the time not a need. As I recall, there are rare, special cases where a priest would permit a couple to use contraception.
[/quote]

Right, but not as contraception. Usually these cases are when a wife is taking hormones to treat a really bad reproductive system illness, even AFTER adopting lifestyle changes like a special diet and whatnot, and the couple can't have any intentions of using those hormones for their contraceptive side affects as well. The priest would have to know the couple very well and it would take a very mature spirituality on behalf of both spouses. But in these very, very tiny number of cases, birth control isn't being used as a contraceptive.

With that many necessary qualifications, I think it's reasonable to say that contraception is never a need.

[qfnol31]

[quote name='Light and Truth' timestamp='1328475460' post='2381631']
I disagree with this. There are rare cases where childbirth is too great a medical risk for the mother. I would say it is 99.998% of the time not a need. As I recall, there are rare, special cases where a priest would permit a couple to use contraception.
[/quote]Even in such a case contraception can never be permitted in the eyes of the Church. The Church will advise the woman to practice NFP, but if that's too risky, then the Church will exhort the woman to celibacy. As difficult and terrible a situation as it is, the Church cannot ever recommend an immoral practice, even if it is for some good. Pope Paul VI spelled this out very clearly in Humanae Vitae.

Just as an aside, some forms of birth control do not have to be 100% effective to be approved by the FDA, so it is still safer to abstain entirely from sex.

[Ice_nine]

[quote name='kujo' timestamp='1328473506' post='2381611']
I'm pretty sure I can do what I want.

And what I "want" is for you and others to recognize this irony. It's there...laugh at it.
[/quote]

Jaime said it better than I could

props yo

[Anastasia13]

[quote name='qfnol31' timestamp='1328475992' post='2381639']
Even in such a case contraception can never be permitted in the eyes of the Church. The Church will advise the woman to practice NFP, but if that's too risky, then the Church will exhort the woman to celibacy. As difficult and terrible a situation as it is, the Church cannot ever recommend an immoral practice, even if it is for some good. Pope Paul VI spelled this out very clearly in Humanae Vitae.

Just as an aside, some forms of birth control do not have to be 100% effective to be approved by the FDA, so it is still safer to abstain entirely from sex.
[/quote]
Maybe you could find me the quote that says that a married couple should be willing to spend 25 years not following the advice of 1 Cor 7:5 rather than take something/use something to prevent pregnancy? (Not that I will agree with it anyways, but it would be an interesting contrast to the previous post and something I read in the Q&A or Transmundane sections a while back.)

Edited February 5, 2012 by Light and Truth

[tinytherese]

[quote name='Light and Truth' timestamp='1328477829' post='2381670']
Maybe you could find me the quote that says that a married couple should be willing to spend 25 years not following the advice of 1 Cor 7:5 rather than take something/use something to prevent pregnancy? (Not that I will agree with it anyways, but it would be an interesting contrast to the previous post and something I read in the Q&A or Transmundane sections a while back.)
[/quote]

NFP is extemely effective in preventing pregnancy when that is the intention of the couple. They refrain from sex for some days in the woman's cycle, but not all of the time.

[Anastasia13]

[quote name='tinytherese' timestamp='1328492184' post='2381870']
NFP is extemely effective in preventing pregnancy when that is the intention of the couple. They refrain from sex for some days in the woman's cycle, but not all of the time.
[/quote]
Oh yes, but qfnol31 mentioned if NFP is too risky. As long as he/she has just corrected Basilisa Marie, can I get an actual citation that will correct Cardinal Christian Wiyghan Tumi, Archbishop of Douala. http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/topic/42386-cardinal-endorses-condom-use/page__hl__pill

[Jaime]

[quote name='Light and Truth' timestamp='1328501793' post='2381956']
Oh yes, but qfnol31 mentioned if NFP is too risky. As long as he/she has just corrected Basilisa Marie, can I get an actual citation that will correct Cardinal Christian Wiyghan Tumi, Archbishop of Douala. [url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/topic/42386-cardinal-endorses-condom-use/page__hl__pill"]http://www.phatmass..../page__hl__pill[/url]
[/quote]

This sounds odd coming from me but here it goes!

Could you get back on topic please? We have about a bajillion threads on contraception and NFP. Could you take this sidetrack to one of those?

[4588686]

[quote name='jaime' timestamp='1328473913' post='2381616']
They have no intention to better the health of poor women or any women
They are a racist organization
They promote and support the sex trade of minors
Their existance is directly related to abortion being the #1killer of African Americans today.
[/quote]

Right. Those racist, sex-trade peddling, murderous, liars were real meanies to you.

This is why this thread is difficult to take seriously. Right here. You just made a generalized insinuation that the people of planned parenthood are racists, support the sex trade and mass murderers of blacks. And their motives for waging this terrifying campaign are quite mysterious because they are in fact totally disingenuous as they are not merely misguided, but rather don't even really intend to help women. Buy, in an act of vitriol so grave that surely it cries out to heaven for vengeance, that murderous cabal allowed an enthusiast on a support site to publish a letter of defiance that refers to you are your compatriots as 'anti-woman.'

Edited February 6, 2012 by Hasan

[catholicinsd]

The real problem is a lack of self-discipline which begets immodest practices, namely sexual relations.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Righteous Anger' timestamp='1328508406' post='2382129']
The real problem is a lack of self-discipline which begets immodest practices, namely sexual relations.
[/quote]
What, it isn't unmentionable anymore?

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='Righteous Anger' timestamp='1328508406' post='2382129']
The real problem is a lack of self-discipline which begets immodest practices, [s]namely sexual relations.[/s]
[/quote]
You scandalous cowpie. Repent for this!

[catholicinsd]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1328508970' post='2382136']
What, it isn't unmentionable anymore?
[/quote]

I'm not sure what you are asking, but suffice it to say the Western World, especially, must learn to keep the legs closed.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Righteous Anger' timestamp='1328509099' post='2382140']
I'm not sure what you are asking, but suffice it to say the Western World, especially, must learn to keep the legs closed.
[/quote]
And also must refrain from face.