Joe Biden Get's Excommunitcated From The Catholic Church!

[Freedom]

[color=#73080D][center][font='times new roman', times, serif][url="http://catholicleague.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=e7e656b0a27630ee25cd133ac&id=5c9e9cb04d&e=6f5ef0fc1b"][color=#800000][u][b]CATHOLIC LEAGUE[/b][/u][/color][/url][/font][/center][/color]
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[font='times new roman', times, serif][color=#800000][b][i]FOR RELIGIOUS AND CIVIL RIGHTS[/i][/b][/color][/font][/center][/color]
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[b] [font="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"][size="5"]Biden’s Weary Catholicism[/size][/font][/b]

[size=4][font=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]October 12, 2012[/font][/size]
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[size=4][font="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"]Bill Donohue comments on Vice President Joe Biden’s remarks on Catholicism that were given at the end of his debate:

Vice President Joe Biden has been instructed by bishops not to present himself for Communion; he has been the subject of many reprimands; and he has been banned from speaking at Catholic institutions. Most of these sanctions are a function of his pro-abortion views.

Last night, Biden added to his problems by saying he agrees that life begins at conception, but he doesn’t want to do anything to ensure the rights of the unborn child. The Catholic Church is opposed to animal cruelty as well, yet it is a sure bet that Biden has no problem with laws that punish dog fighting. Maybe if he began to think of little baby in his mother’s womb the way he thinks of Fido, more babies would live.

Just as obnoxious was Biden’s claim that the Obama administration is not interfering with the religious liberties of Catholic non-profits. Is he unaware of the dozens of lawsuits filed by the bishops, the laity, and Catholic institutions seeking to insulate themselves from the Health and Human Services (HHS) mandate? Of course not.

The vice president really outdid himself when he [i]twice[/i] said it is “a fact” that there is nothing for Catholics to worry about. Here’s a real fact: Biden initially registered his misgivings about the policy, and even went so far as to warn that the HHS mandate would not sit well with Catholics. So what changed your mind, Joe?

Listening to Biden discuss his Catholicism is getting weary. [/font][/size]

[size=4][size=4][font=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]Contact our director of communications about Donohue’s remarks:
Jeff Field
Phone: 212-371-3191
E-mail: [email="cl@catholicleague.org"]cl@catholicleague.org[/email][/font][/size][/size]
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[PhuturePriest]

This isn't excommunication. He is no longer allowed to receive the Eucharist, but that is not full-blown excommunication.

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1350675187' post='2494955']
This isn't excommunication. He is no longer allowed to receive the Eucharist, but that is not full-blown excommunication.
[/quote]

For the age we live in it pretty much is and probably as far as it will go.

[Nihil Obstat]

Unless something changed from the article I read a couple days ago, he was merely cautioned by one specific bishop (not his own), that he should not present himself for communion in that diocese. Would appreciate sources, if there have been other developments.

[Winchester]

http://theoatmeal.com/comics/apostrophe

[4588686]

Bill Donohue is a truly terrible human being.

[Groo the Wanderer]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1350680850' post='2495010']
Bill Donohue is a truly terrible human being.
[/quote]

[Socrates]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1350680850' post='2495010']
Bill Donohue is a truly terrible human being.
[/quote]
Your face.

[Tab'le De'Bah-Rye]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1350680850' post='2495010']
Bill Donohue is a truly terrible human being.
[/quote]

So saying no is terrible ?

[ardillacid]

[color=#282828][font='Open Sans', sans-serif]Joe Biden is a truly terrible human being.[/font][/color]

[Lil Red]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1350676649' post='2494966']
[url="http://theoatmeal.com/comics/apostrophe"]http://theoatmeal.co...mics/apostrophe[/url]
[/quote]


apostrophe abuse hurts us all

[cappie]

The point is that, while people are rightly upset by politicians, objectively not in full communion with the Church, spouting their muddled thinking with no consequence, it is wrong to make the jump that they ought to be excommunicated. That’s not the law of the Church as it exists now.
Are there other penal remedies available? Most certainly. Canon 1399 exists to provide for those cases not specifically envisioned in the law in which divine or canon law is broken and the gravity of the situation demands the repair or prevention of scandal. Certainly it is a cause for concern when the Vice-President of the United States peddles his beliefs that his Catholic faith is merely a private affair. How many Catholics has he led down the same fuzzy-thinking path? That’s scandal in the canonical sense. Is excommunication an answer, even in this case? Well, ultimately that’s up to the Ordinary. But beware that canon law also states that censures, like excommunication, are to be enacted with the greatest moderation and only for the more grave offenses (c. 1318). The Code also states that a penal procedure is to be undertaken only when no other remedy, pastoral, canonical or otherwise, would be effective (c. 1341).

[url="http://musingsofacanonist.wordpress.com/2012/10/18/ought-biden-and-broten-be-excommunicated/"]http://musingsofacanonist.wordpress.com/2012/10/18/ought-biden-and-broten-be-excommunicated/[/url]

[r2Dtoo]

[quote name='Hasan' timestamp='1350680850' post='2495010']
Bill Donohue is a truly terrible human being.
[/quote]
Flame bait much?

[Socrates]

[quote name='cappie' timestamp='1350765455' post='2495443']
The point is that, while people are rightly upset by politicians, objectively not in full communion with the Church, spouting their muddled thinking with no consequence, it is wrong to make the jump that they ought to be excommunicated. That’s not the law of the Church as it exists now.
Are there other penal remedies available? Most certainly. Canon 1399 exists to provide for those cases not specifically envisioned in the law in which divine or canon law is broken and the gravity of the situation demands the repair or prevention of scandal. Certainly it is a cause for concern when the Vice-President of the United States peddles his beliefs that his Catholic faith is merely a private affair. How many Catholics has he led down the same fuzzy-thinking path? That’s scandal in the canonical sense. Is excommunication an answer, even in this case? Well, ultimately that’s up to the Ordinary. But beware that canon law also states that censures, like excommunication, are to be enacted with the greatest moderation and only for the more grave offenses (c. 1318). The Code also states that a penal procedure is to be undertaken only when no other remedy, pastoral, canonical or otherwise, would be effective (c. 1341).

[url="http://musingsofacanonist.wordpress.com/2012/10/18/ought-biden-and-broten-be-excommunicated/"]http://musingsofacan...excommunicated/[/url]
[/quote]
Our present Holy Father, as Prefect of the CDF, taught that pro-abortion politicians should indeed be denied Holy Communion. (This may not be the same thing as formal excommunication, but it's still clear that ministers should make it clear to pro-abort pols that they cannot receive Communion, and refuse it to them if the obstinately persist.)

[url="http://www.ewtn.com/library/curia/cdfworthycom.htm"][b][font=Arial][size=4]Worthiness to Receive Holy Communion: General Principles[/size][/font][/b][/url]


[quote]
5. Regarding the grave sin of abortion or euthanasia, when a person’s formal cooperation becomes manifest ([b]understood, in the case of a Catholic politician, as his consistently campaigning and voting for permissive abortion and euthanasia laws[/b]), his Pastor should meet with him, instructing him about the Church’s teaching, informing him that he is not to present himself for Holy Communion until he brings to an end the objective situation of sin, and warning him that he will otherwise be denied the Eucharist.

6. When "these precautionary measures have not had their effect or in which they were not possible," and the person in question, with obstinate persistence, still presents himself to receive the Holy Eucharist, [b]"the minister of Holy Communion must refuse to distribute it[/b]" (cf. Pontifical Council for Legislative Texts Declaration "Holy Communion and Divorced, Civilly Remarried Catholics" [2002], nos. 3-4). This decision, properly speaking, is not a sanction or a penalty. Nor is the minister of Holy Communion passing judgment on the person’s subjective guilt, but rather is reacting to the person’s public unworthiness to receive Holy Communion due to an objective situation of sin.
[/quote]

Edited October 20, 2012 by Socrates

[cappie]

I think here the issue is excommunication is not whether or not he should approach, or should be given, Holy Communion. Cardinal Burke and Dr. Edward Peters have already explored those issues with erudition and profound insight. Here the question is whether or not Biden’s public comments, and/or voting records, constitute delicts in the Church. In order to determine whether or not the delict has occurred, we must determine what constitutes the act of heresy. If it is a heresy to believe that we may not take away a woman’s right to choose, then certainly Biden has committed the delict. But is it a heresy?

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='cappie' timestamp='1350802888' post='2495599']
I think here the issue is excommunication is not whether or not he should approach, or should be given, Holy Communion. Cardinal Burke and Dr. Edward Peters have already explored those issues with erudition and profound insight. Here the question is whether or not Biden’s public comments, and/or voting records, constitute delicts in the Church. In order to determine whether or not the delict has occurred, we must determine what constitutes the act of heresy. If it is a heresy to believe that we may not take away a woman’s right to choose, then certainly Biden has committed the delict. But is it a heresy?
[/quote]


Agreed. Canon law is a very narrow, very technical subject, and any interpretation of canonical legal terms is necessarily complicated and more prudently reserved to highly specialized people.

[Socrates]

[quote name='cappie' timestamp='1350802888' post='2495599']
I think here the issue is excommunication is not whether or not he should approach, or should be given, Holy Communion. Cardinal Burke and Dr. Edward Peters have already explored those issues with erudition and profound insight. Here the question is whether or not Biden’s public comments, and/or voting records, constitute delicts in the Church. In order to determine whether or not the delict has occurred, we must determine what constitutes the act of heresy. If it is a heresy to believe that we may not take away a woman’s right to choose, then certainly Biden has committed the delict. But is it a heresy?
[/quote]
1) While the op's title was inaccurate (the article actually said nothing about excommunication), it's very clear from Cardinal Ratzinger's statements that Biden and other "Catholic" politicians who take a pro-abortion stance should be denied Holy Communion. Whether or not such politicians are formally delicts from the Church, by their continuing political support of abortion, they are living a life of public, unrepentant sin.

Unfortunately, many priests and bishops prefer avoiding political controversy to doing the right thing in this regard.

2) While I don't believe you take a pro-abortion stance, I would respectfully ask that you not use the enemy's language (" take away a woman’s right to choose.") Such rhetoric trivializes the issue at stake, and makes the position of pro-abortion pols sound far more innocuous than it is in reality. No one wants to "take away a woman’s right to choose" in some generic sense; this is about killing a child, which is never a legitimate right. Would you refer to a "right to choose" to murder any other group or class of person? Or would you talk about " man's "right to choose" rape? And let's keep in mind also that the "pro-choice" position of such politicians involves not only allowing or tolerating abortion, but forcing the rest of us to pay for them (whether we choose to or not)

Just a thought, because language matters.

[Ed Normile]

Language does matter ! The language needed here is the language of prayer for VP Biden and the other death providers/promoters who brandish their catholicism like a badge of honor while leading many souls down the path to sin.

ed