Freedom Posted October 24, 2012 Author Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='eagle_eye222001' timestamp='1351050681' post='2496786'] Freedom, I have learned way too much in the past six months to support Romney. Don't ever look up people like Ron Paul and spend hours poring over voting records and history. Because in the end, you'll realize the only real decision you can make will bring all the haters out. There is a grave evil that has been steadily rising in America...and it is especially evident this election given the two major "choices" presented to the American people. I can only think of the snake in the valley that offered me two different fruits. One was red, the other was blue....I told him he reminded me of the snake in the garden of Eden. He said they were unrelated. Sincerely, Enslaved and Caged [/quote] Then just vote for Obama because you have a liberal soul. Nobody can convince you of anything. One is only a slave if he accepts to be a slave.
Lil Red Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1351051829' post='2496805'] The more you say it, the more true it is! That is step two to becoming a politician. Good work my young friend. [/quote] don't make fun of Freedom's goal of becoming a politician. everyone has to have goals! or the terrorists win! [size=2]or something....[/size]
Lil Red Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052025' post='2496811'] Then just vote for Obama because [b]you have a liberal soul[/b]. [/quote] ummm what? [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052025' post='2496811']Nobody can convince you of anything. [/quote] you remind me of that kid who never wanted to be told they were wrong, so they just plugged their ears and yelled, "nananana, i can't hear you"[quote name='qfnol31' timestamp='1351051623' post='2496803'] I shoulda used that! It's much clearer than anything I could say after a nice glass of cognac... [/quote] lol[quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1351051970' post='2496809'] No, the people voting for Obama caused Obama to win. Oh, and the media. They deserve an honorable mention for their hard-fought efforts. [/quote] good point.
Freedom Posted October 24, 2012 Author Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1351051829' post='2496805'] The more you say it, the more true it is! That is step two to becoming a politician. Good work my young friend. [/quote] Only some politicians are liars & I'm not
qfnol31 Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1351050657' post='2496785'] Explain to us how this works because apparently we are slow. A vote for Ron Paul is a vote for Ron Paul. A vote for Barrack Obama is a vote for Barrack Obama. Logically a vote for Barrack Obama can NEVER become a vote for Ron Paul, just as a vote for Ron Paul can never become a vote for Barrack Obama. Ron Paul is the candidate that is most in-line with Catholic teaching. You are selling yourself out to the same old lies you've been taught to believe and have been disappointed in time and again. It's time for not believing in lies anymore. It's time for the truth to be told and believed in. [/quote] Physically speaking you are correct. Morally speaking there's a lot more nuance to this question. If a person performs a bad action you can: 1) Go along with it (evil) - vote for Obama 2) Go along with it materially because you have no choice or this is a lesser evil than the alternative (no moral culpability on your part) - vote for a somewhat immoral, but more more candidate than Obama who can prevent Obama from retaining office [voting for a third-party candidate might fall here if a greater evil is [i]actually [/i]avoided in doing so] 3) Ignore it (which amounts to materially supporting whatever outcome occurs because you haven't acted in the best way to prevent it or ensure it) - don't cast a vote [voting for a third-party candidate might fall here depending on the final outcome] 4) Stop it (which is normally the most moral option if it exists at all) - vote for a perfect candidate who wins (won't happen) So while I don't agree with Freedom's simplistic view, material cooperation can occur by both supporting and not supporting a person who will act unjustly. There are a number of factors that go into play. If in fact Romney wins, then your support of a third-party candidate could be more easily morally justified than if Obama wins. But the full argument (which I have yet to articulate) is incredibly nuanced.
Winchester Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052025' post='2496811'] Then just vote for Obama because you have a liberal soul. Nobody can convince you of anything. One is only a slave if he accepts to be a slave. [/quote] Start reading. http://www.tomwoods.com/
Nihil Obstat Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1351052157' post='2496813'] ummm what? you remind me of that kid who never wanted to be told they were wrong, so they just plugged their ears and yelled, "nananana, i can't hear you" [/quote] The philosopher's response would be to say that he is confused. Philosophers tell each other that a lot. "My colleague is very confused."Freedom's username is delightfully ironic.
eagle_eye222001 Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052025' post='2496811'] Then just vote for Obama because you have a liberal soul. Nobody can convince you of anything. One is only a slave if he accepts to be a slave. [/quote] Silly, I can't vote for Obama. And as a Ron Paul supporter, I assure you, I don't have a liberal soul. I have a soul that believes in Freedom, life, and liberty. That is precisely why I'm not voting for Romney either. Actually I'm not a slave. I'm making a choice to break out of the two awful choices and make a better one. Sincerely, A Revolutionist.
PhuturePriest Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052025' post='2496811'] Then just vote for Obama because you have a liberal soul. Nobody can convince you of anything. One is only a slave if he accepts to be a slave. [/quote] Freedom, I don't remember exactly, but I'm almost certain you told me in chat once that you were only fourteen. I know you think you know everything, but you don't. It's a hard reality to face, it really is, but it's something you must deal with. I'm sixteen and I know it's hard trying to keep your mouth shut and your mind open, but please, do so. You are doing a disservice to yourself by putting your hands on your ears and shutting off anything that disagrees with you. Aloysius, Lil Red, Winchester, Nihil Obstat, etc, they're all older than you and me probably combined (Not sure in Nihil's case, he's still in college). They know the game of politics more than you like to think you know. They've seen more, they have experienced more. Don't you think they *may* just know more about politics than you do? Don't you think that they *may* know what they are talking about since they after all have lived on their own, paid their own bills, some of them are married and have kids or are getting married, etc? Experience equals knowledge, and neither of us have much of either. I would kindly suggest listening to their kind wisdom. I'm not advocating taking in everything they say like a robot, but have an open mind. I've done it, and it's benefited me. I would also recommend stopping the insults. It gets you nowhere and it makes everybody automatically discredit your opinions. Everyone who votes for Ron Paul has a liberal soul? Not only is that so theologically whacked I don't know where to start, but that's insulting. My spiritual director, one of the most wonderful Priests I have ever known, is a Ron Paul supporter. You are suggesting he is a liberal just because he has a formed conscience that he listens to? If so than I'm afraid you have a lot of learning and maturing to do. Edited October 24, 2012 by FuturePriest387
Vincent Vega Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1351052311' post='2496817'] Freedom's username is delightfully ironic. [/quote] "If you vote for someone who isn't the man who wants to restrict many of your freedoms, you're effectively voting for the man who wants to restrict many of your freedoms (albeit different ones)." [img]http://www.brainlesstales.com/images/2012/Oct/seems-legit.jpg[/img] Seems legit!
Winchester Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 Frederic Bastiat, Catholic. Liberal. http://bastiat.org/en/the_law.html A real liberal. Classical liberal. Look it up, kid.
Freedom Posted October 24, 2012 Author Posted October 24, 2012 Just what liberals are notorious for: personal attacks. Goodnight everyone, sweet dreams.
Vincent Vega Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 Liberal only means "someone who doesn't vote for Romney". [img]http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mbx9e56pZv1qzthlho1_1280.jpg[/img] [b][i]I'm surprised you didn't know that.[/i][/b]
Lil Red Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052804' post='2496824'] Just what liberals are notorious for: personal attacks. Goodnight everyone, sweet dreams. [/quote] you're funny. [img]http://kiddos1234.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/funny-kid-tells-joke-to-dog.jpg[/img]
PhuturePriest Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1351052963' post='2496828'] you're funny. [img]http://kiddos1234.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/funny-kid-tells-joke-to-dog.jpg[/img] [/quote] That dog is so big I can't tell if I should laugh or be frightened.
Winchester Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 (edited) “Socialism, like the ancient ideas from which it springs, confuses the distinction between government and society. As a result of this, every time we object to a thing being done by government, the socialists conclude that we object to its being done at all. We disapprove of state education. Then the socialists say that we are opposed to any education. We object to a state religion. Then the socialists say that we want no religion at all. We object to a state-enforced equality. Then they say that we are against equality. And so on, and so on. It is as if the socialists were to accuse us of not wanting persons to eat because we do not want the state to raise grain.†― [url="http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/89275.Fr_d_ric_Bastiat"]Frédéric Bastiat[/url], [i] [url="http://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/2548001"]The Law[/url] [/i] [i]That's [/i]a liberal. “But how is this legal plunder to be identified? Quite simply. See if the law takes from some persons what belongs to them and gives it to other persons to whom it does not belong. See if the law benefits one citizen at the expense of another by doing what the citizen himself cannot do without committing a crime.†― [url="http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/89275.Fr_d_ric_Bastiat"]Frédéric Bastiat[/url], [i] [url="http://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/2548001"]The Law[/url] [/i] Edited October 24, 2012 by Winchester
Nihil Obstat Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052804' post='2496824'] Just what liberals are notorious for: personal attacks. Goodnight everyone, sweet dreams. [/quote] You sound like a fun person. But your argument here, and your argumentation is shallow and misguided. You sound smart, so I think you can do much better than this. But calling us all liberal for not falling in lockstep with the sociopath who calls himself a republican is just silly. It is also hilariously false, but it will be even more hilarious if you discover that on your own. I will give you a small hint on this one; give my profile picture a good analysis. God bless you, but please do not be so narrow minded. Edited October 24, 2012 by Nihil Obstat
Lil Red Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='FuturePriest387' timestamp='1351053014' post='2496830'] That dog is so big I can't tell if I should laugh or be frightened. [/quote] he's about to eat her, because an evil clown is inside the dog. if you're worried an evil clown will come get you next, be frightened.
Vincent Vega Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052804' post='2496824'] Just what liberals are notorious for: personal attacks. [/quote] [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052025' post='2496811'] Then just vote for Obama because you have a liberal soul. Nobody can convince you of anything. [/quote] [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351034115' post='2496587']either the DemocRAT [/quote] [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351026028' post='2496458'] Mr. Obama is a good liar, I don't blame you for believing him. [/quote] [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351022346' post='2496435']Everything out of his mouth is a lie [/quote] [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052804' post='2496824'] Just what liberals are notorious for: personal attacks. [/quote] [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052804' post='2496824'] [size=5]Just what liberals are notorious for: personal attacks. [/size] [/quote] [quote name='Freedom' timestamp='1351052804' post='2496824'] [size=5]Just what[/size] [size=6]liberals are notorious for: personal attacks.[/size] [/quote] [img]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-HHQp8i5Puo4/TWMpQOCNTiI/AAAAAAAAAEI/P6yIleICGVM/s1600/inglip.jpg[/img] [i]FREEDOM IS A LIBERAL.[/i] Edited October 24, 2012 by USAirwaysIHS
Winchester Posted October 24, 2012 Posted October 24, 2012 [quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1351053125' post='2496834'] he's about to eat her, because an evil clown is inside the dog. if you're worried an evil clown will come get you next, be frightened. [/quote] that's so meta!
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