Why Don’t Priests Follow Rubrics? Fr. Z Cheerfully Rants.

[Slappo]

Just a couple quick thoughts:

 

1. People tuning into a live feed of mass online aren't actually attending mass. The mass is not publicly celebrated as it is not celebrated in a public place where any lay faithful can walk in and participate... that is unless Fr. Z extended an invitation for everyone to come to his house?

2. If this was "years ago" that he was doing it (I follow him off and on the past couple years and haven't seen it), was it when he was in touch with the local ordinary and the local ordinary may have approved it?

3. I definitely understand the skepticism. I greatly appreciate that he cites sources and bows down when he gets pwnt by those with authority on the interpretation of something (see canon law, Card. Burke, and whether or not attending saturday vigil mass fulfills a saturday holy day of obligation and sunday obligation at the same time).

4. If you're worried about Fr. Z taking a cruise retreat, mayhaps you should jump on the back of Franciscan University as well which is hosting an Alaskan retreat/cruise this summer for it's alumni. And Franciscan's have a vow of poverty (yes at least one of the TOR's will be on it).

 

 

The idea of Fr. Z running a retreat on a cruise ship is not nearly as ludicrous to me as the $200+ you had to pay to get Fr. Corapi's catechism series. It looks like the cruise has relatively low cost options ($1,100). Michael Voris will be with him, so who knows maybe his company even paid to sponsor Fr. Z going as they needed a priest for the sacraments and spiritual direction. At least those readers that donate can see what he is doing and that he spent the money to go on a retreat. Maybe a particularly wealthy reader said "here's $1k go on vacation". How many times have we invited our parish priests over for a nice dinner and bottle of wine, or taken them out for lunch, or got them something they may have particularly liked? I really do understand the skepticism, and I will probably never do more than use his amazon.com link or buy mystic monk coffee through his webpage to support him monetarily. But let's not jump on him for some crazy rash spending... Do you think the average parish priest never takes a vacation or does nice things? he is working entirely off of your donations too, although it's filtered through the diocese or parish before it hits his personal checkings account...

[Evangetholic]

1 Timothy 5:17-18

Elders who do their work well should be respected and paid well,
especially those who work hard at both preaching and teaching. For the
Scripture says, “You must not muzzle an ox to keep it from eating as it
treads out the grain.” And in another place, “Those who work deserve
their pay!”

 

1 Corinthians 9:14

In the same way, the Lord ordered that those who preach the Good News should be supported by those who benefit from it.

 

 

The word here rendered "elder" by the NLT is normally "presbyter" in modern Catholic Translations, I would guess the Douay says "priest" but am not sure.

Edited February 11, 2013 by Evangetholic

[Nihil Obstat]

1 Timothy 5:17-18

Elders who do their work well should be respected and paid well,
especially those who work hard at both preaching and teaching. For the
Scripture says, “You must not muzzle an ox to keep it from eating as it
treads out the grain.” And in another place, “Those who work deserve
their pay!”

 

1 Corinthians 9:14

In the same way, the Lord ordered that those who preach the Good News should be supported by those who benefit from it.

 

 

The word here rendered "elder" by the NLT is normally "presbyter" in modern Catholic Translations, I would guess the Douay says "priest" but am not sure.

Yes, the Douay Rheims translates it as priest. Knox has it as presbyter.

[Evangetholic]

Yes, the Douay Rheims translates it as priest. Knox has it as presbyter.

 

Fr. Knox. Reading about Father Knox and how mightily he struggled to translate the Bible took the very first brick out of my anti-Catholic Wall.

He also refused conditional baptism when he converted to Catholicism--it was almost always done automatically then, but he'd been baptized by his father who was Anglican Bishop of Manchester, in the days when Anglicans were still trying to change the world, not be conformed to its wickedness.

[Nihil Obstat]

Fr. Knox. Reading about Father Knox and how mightily he struggled to translate the Bible took the very first brick out of my anti-Catholic Wall.

He also refused conditional baptism when he converted to Catholicism--it was almost always done automatically then, but he'd been baptized by his father who was Anglican Bishop of Manchester, in the days when Anglicans were still trying to change the world, not be conformed to its wickedness.

It sounds like he was a truly excellent and fascinating man. As were many of his contemporaries, come to think of it. So many personalities in those years, in and around England.

 

I very much enjoy reading the Knox Bible in parallel with the Douay Rheims. I love and respect the very strict precision of the Douay Rheims, and with the freer, more poetic Knox beside it I feel like I am covering all my bases as far as the Vulgate is concerned.

[Apotheoun]

Wow, this thread certainly went all over the place.  It was a true chore to read.

[NonNovi]

With both FSSP priests I have had the pleasure of meeting, both do a thing I really appreciate during Mass. At the moments where they are instructed to turn around, to say "Dominus vobiscum" or "Orare fratres", they never look at the congregation. They keep their heads bowed and eyes cast downwards. The more I notice it, the more I appreciate what they are trying to do. They are trying as little as possible to insert themselves in the Mass. They do not want that temptation to try to 'interact' with the congregation. And at the same time it lets us as a congregation remember that the priest there on the altar is not there as himself, but as Christ. That his personality while he is up there means nothing.

 

They're not 'trying' to do anything, they have to do that, it's in the rubrics :hehe2:

 

"...tum, junctis manibus ante pectum, demissisque oculis ad terram,..."

 

" ... then, with the hands joined in front of the chest, and the eyes lowered to the floor..."

 

Yay rubrics!! (by the way, your explanation shows us exactly why there are rubrics and why it's necessary for priests to follow them)
 

[Nihil Obstat]

They're not 'trying' to do anything, they have to do that, it's in the rubrics :hehe2:

 

"...tum, junctis manibus ante pectum, demissisque oculis ad terram,..."

 

" ... then, with the hands joined in front of the chest, and the eyes lowered to the floor..."

 

Yay rubrics!! (by the way, your explanation shows us exactly why there are rubrics and why it's necessary for priests to follow them)
 

Yeah, I did not mean to imply that they were doing it on a personal whim, but that is how it ended up sounding. :hehe: I have noticed it often enough to realize that it must be instructed somewhere.

[Starets]

I wish they would. The "Novus Ordo" Mass can be a beautiful thing when done properly, and I have seen it offered reverentially and beautifuly literally hundreds of times. It can be done, boys and girls.