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allis-challmers

What Religions Believe In The True Presence Of The Eucharist

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allis-challmers

My wife and I was talking yesterday and I told her that I thought the Lutheran religion believed that Jesus was present in the Eucharist like Catholics do.  We had received a grab bag from someone that had a kids sunday school book in it that said that.  So I was wondering What religions believe in the Eucharist and am I right about the Lutheran religion.

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Apotheoun

Obviously Catholicism (both Eastern and Western) teaches that the Eucharist is the true body, blood, soul and divinity of Christ; and in addition to the Catholic Churches the Orthodox Churches (Oriental Orthodox and Eastern Orthodox) also teach that Christ is really present in the Eucharistic elements. It is important to note that the Catholic Churches accept the sacramental mysteries of the Orthodox Churches as fully valid.

 

Now as far as the Lutherans and Episcopalians (Anglicans) are concerned, they teach that Christ is present in the Eucharist, but the Catholic Churches and the Orthodox Churches do not accept that the Lutheran and Anglican communities have a valid Eucharist, because neither group has maintained the fullness of faith in connection with the holy sacraments, and in particular the mystery of holy orders. To put it another way, the ecclesial communities that arose out of the Reformation did not maintain the Apostolic priesthood of the ordained, and so their celebrations of the Eucharist are not valid. Nevertheless, those some Protestant groups (i.e., those with a more or less "High Church" approach) do teach that Christ is present in some way in the Eucharist.

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Noel's angel

I think the question should really be, "In which religions is Jesus truly present in the Eucharist"? Some ecclesial communities might believe they have something that they don't.

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CatholicsAreKewl

Many religions acknowledge the true presence of the Eucharist.

Ibn Hisham notes, "Though we are at odds with the Christians, we must admire their gift of the bread and wine with which Allah reveals himself unto them".

 

Raghavan N. Iyer has a similar view, "Krishna manifests himself in various forms..... and, most notably, to the Catholics as Christ through the Eucharist". 

 
"Had it not been for our rich Jewish heritage, who could resist conversion to Catholicism, with the Eucharist at its core?"
Charles S. Liebman

 

 

Edited by CatholicsAreKewl

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Noel's angel

It is important to make a distinction between the real presence of Christ in the gathered community of believers and the Real Presence (the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity) in the Sacrament of the Eucharist. 

Catholics and Orthodox - Christ is truly present in the Eucharist.

Everyone else....nope.

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Apotheoun

I thought Luther taught/believed a 'consubstantiation"...

Yes, Luther believed in a type of impanation, but the Western Catholic Church condemned that notion as false centuries before Luther was born. The Eastern Churches have also condemned theories that posit a type of "blending" for lack of a better word of the earthly elements of the bread and wine with the body and blood of Christ. In the East the term "transubstantiation" is not traditional, but the notion that the bread and wine cease to be bread and wine and become the body and blood of Christ is firmly taught even if the scholastic term used in the West is not commonly accepted.

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Anastasia (L&T)

I thought Luther taught/believed a 'consubstantiation"...

 

As an ex-Lutheran, that is the official teaching of the Lutheran churches. I believe it is also the teaching of the Anglican/Episcopalian church from what I have read. Most ministers in these churches also do not have the same line of apostolic succession which I heard years ago is a reason why they rarely have real presence.

 

Eastern churches have real presence but in a less defined way than the Roman Catholic transubstantiation. These include: Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, and Assyrian Church of the East.

 

While it can be said that most high church Protestants believe in real presence, this is often not the case for high church Presbyterians as most Calvinist thinking on this is a "spiritual real presence."  I know of an exception who seems to believe in it and attends a Korean Young Nak Presbyterian church

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Anastasia (L&T)

Yes, Luther believed in a type of impanation, but the Western Catholic Church condemned that notion as false centuries before Luther was born. The Eastern Churches have also condemned theories that posit a type of "blending" for lack of a better word of the earthly elements of the bread and wine with the body and blood of Christ. In the East the term "transubstantiation" is not traditional, but the notion that the bread and wine cease to be bread and wine and become the body and blood of Christ is firmly taught even if the scholastic term used in the West is not commonly accepted.

 

It's what I was taught 18 years ago. I do not know how common it was, but that is what I was taught in my church class. I was Evangelical Church of America, btw. The synod that is more liberal than the Missouri or Wisconsin synods. I was not taught impanation but rather the common accepted understanding of consubstantiation. I ever heard it again 11 years ago when I emailed my old pastor about it as I am forever mixing up consubstantiation and transubstantiation.

Edited by Light and Truth

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Apotheoun

 

Many religions acknowledge the true presence of the Eucharist.

Ibn Hisham notes, "Though we are at odds with the Christians, we must admire their gift of the bread and wine with which Allah reveals himself unto them".

 

Raghavan N. Iyer has a similar view, "Krishna manifests himself in various forms..... and, most notably, to the Catholics as Christ through the Eucharist". 

 
"Had it not been for our rich Jewish heritage, who could resist conversion to Catholicism, with the Eucharist at its core?"
Charles S. Liebman

 

I am sure that the comments above are meant to be kind, but they are theologically indifferentist, and so I cannot - as a Christian - accept them as a proper reflection of the truth. Thus, I do not believe that the fictitious character known as Krishna is made manifest in the Holy Eucharist. 

 

Of all the comments above, the Jewish comment is the most reasonable, but it is important to remember that Rabbinic Judaism is itself founded upon opposition to Christ. The Church is the true Israel, the true people of God, and Christ is the true Temple. The shekinah that once resided in the Jerusalem Temple is now present in the Catholic and Orthodox Churches and in the particular in the Holy Eucharist. This is the preaching of the Church and this is why it is necessary that Christians pray for the conversion of the Jews (and Muslims, Hindus, etc.) to the truth faith of Abraham.

Edited by Apotheoun

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Anastasia (L&T)

I am sure that the comments above are meant to be kind, but they are theologically indifferentist, and so I cannot - as a Christian - accept them as a proper reflection of the truth. Thus, I do not believe that the fictitious character known as Krishna is made manifest in the Holy Eucharist. 

 

Of all the comments above, the Jewish comment is the most reasonable, but it is important to remember that Rabbinic Judaism is itself founded upon opposition to Christ. The Church is the true Israel, the true people of God, and Christ is the true Temple. The shekinah that once resided in the Jerusalem Temple is now present in the Catholic and Orthodox Churches and in the particular in the Holy Eucharist. This is the preaching of the Church and this is why it is necessary that Christians pray for the conversion of the Jews (and Muslims, Hindus, etc.) to the truth faith of Abraham.

 

Besides, while some Jews may admire something in Christianity, Orthodox Judaism condemns the drinking of blood. It is not kosher, and that is part of what was shocking to them about Jesus's teachings.

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CatholicsAreKewl

I am sure that the comments above are meant to be kind, but they are theologically indifferentist, and so I cannot - as a Christian - accept them as a proper reflection of the truth. Thus, I do not believe that the fictitious character known as Krishna is made manifest in the Holy Eucharist. 

 

Of all the comments above, the Jewish comment is the most reasonable, but it is important to remember that Rabbinic Judaism is itself founded upon opposition to Christ. The Church is the true Israel, the true people of God, and Christ is the true Temple. The shekinah that once resided in the Jerusalem Temple is now present in the Catholic and Orthodox Churches and in the particular in the Holy Eucharist. This is the preaching of the Church and this is why it is necessary that Christians pray for the conversion of the Jews (and Muslims, Hindus, etc.) to the truth faith of Abraham.

Wait, you guys took those quotes seriously? I just made them up.  :disguise:

Edited by CatholicsAreKewl

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Apotheoun

Wait, you guys took those quotes seriously? I just made them up. 

Yes, I took you at your word. I did not google them.

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CatholicsAreKewl

Yes, I took you at your word. I did not google them.

 

That's actually an ego-boost. I thought my writing would have been too shabby to fool anyone. 

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Apotheoun

That's actually an ego-boost. I thought my writing would have been too shabby to fool anyone. 

Actually the more indifferentist the comment the more likely it is to be true in the modern politically correct environment of the Western world.

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