Studies Find Yelling At Children As Harmful As Hitting Them

[PhuturePriest]

So I said yelling has to be your first response?  Really, I said that?  Hmm, me thinks not. 

 

Glad the guy who has no children is giving out parenting advice.  The guy who has absolutely no experience in dealing with children of his own but feels experienced enough to give out advice.  Your similar to the person in the supermarket who has no problem talking about how much better of a parent you would be then the woman over there. 

 

Its easy to play backseat driver in our society.  Its a lot harder to not judge others until you have actually walked in their shoes.

 

Honestly, trying to give out advice on something you know nothing about comes off as pretentious. 

 

Underline where I gave advice. Nowhere on this thread to I give advice. I said a statement supported by research: yelling at your children is wrong. Nowhere do I say "This is what you should do if you get angry", or even "If I were a parent, this is what I would do". I said that I don't find it right and that I've promised myself to do my best not to do it, but nowhere have I actually given advice.

[havok579257]

When did she say raising children was easy? It's sometimes *easier* for some, but that doesn't imply it's easy. Lebron James might find it *easier* than me to slam dunk, but that doesn't mean it's easy for him. It still takes work and effort to do it. Some people are just naturally very organized with parenting and have got everything under control. Ever seen 19 Kids and Counting? Most organized family on the entire planet. It's never unruly and they never lose their tempers. They have in fact said they always do their best not to, because doing so will "harm the relationships with their children".

 

 

no parent has everything under control.  No human being has everything under control.  So false statements.

[havok579257]

Underline where I gave advice. Nowhere on this thread to I give advice. I said a statement supported by research: yelling at your children is wrong. Nowhere do I say "This is what you should do if you get angry", or even "If I were a parent, this is what I would do". I said that I don't find it right and that I've promised myself to do my best not to do it, but nowhere have I actually given advice.

 

 

Yelling accomplishes nothing but escalating the situation. Try to deescalate a situation by having a screaming fit and tell me how it works out. I'm not saying I have parental experience, and I'm not saying it's not incredibly difficult sometimes to not yell. But what I am saying is that yelling at your children is wrong, and that it IS possible to never yell at them (The same goes for your spouse).

 

 

this is what you said.  trying to give advice about things.

 

 

also you don know that they have studies to prove and disprove everything?  I take all studies with a grain of salt.  One study will say whole eggs are horrible for you, another will say they are good.  Another study will say diet soda promotes obesity but another that just came out said its not so bad for you.  Another study said fish oil is good for you(a healthy fat) and then another comes out saying its bad because it hardens your arteries.  I imagine you know this.

 

and no I do not believe the study that says yelling at kids is the same as hitting them.  hitting your kids is way worse than yelling at them.

Edited September 6, 2013 by havok579257

[PhuturePriest]

Yelling accomplishes nothing but escalating the situation. Try to deescalate a situation by having a screaming fit and tell me how it works out. I'm not saying I have parental experience, and I'm not saying it's not incredibly difficult sometimes to not yell. But what I am saying is that yelling at your children is wrong, and that it IS possible to never yell at them (The same goes for your spouse).

 

 

this is what you said.  trying to give advice about things.

 

 

also you don know that they have studies to prove and disprove everything?  I take all studies with a grain of salt.  One study will say whole eggs are horrible for you, another will say they are good.  Another study will say diet soda promotes obesity but another that just came out said its not so bad for you.  Another study said fish oil is good for you(a healthy fat) and then another comes out saying its bad because it hardens your arteries.  I imagine you know this.

 

and no I do not believe the study that says yelling at kids is the same as hitting them.  hitting your kids is way worse than yelling at them.

 

I state an opinion in your quoted part. I didn't say "You shouldn't yell at your children, because it only escalates the situation, you simpleton." I said yelling escalates a situation. It's a simple fact. There is a difference between a statement and giving advice.

 

Obviously you and I have had different experiences with parents yelling at you.

[havok579257]

I state an opinion in your quoted part. I didn't say "You shouldn't yell at your children, because it only escalates the situation, you simpleton." I said yelling escalates a situation. It's a simple fact. There is a difference between a statement and giving advice.

 

Obviously you and I have had different experiences with parents yelling at you.

 

 

and obviously you can not have a conversation without resorting to name calling.  So yelling bad but name calling ok? 

 

Being hit, not spanked but actually hit is worse than being yelled at.  Just imagine for a moment, your parent yelling at you over something you did wrong.  No imagine same scenario but instead of yelling they are hitting you in the corner.  Its not that hard to see which is worse. 

[Luigi]

Did they also research the effects of children yelling at - or even in the same house as - parents? 

[havok579257]

I state an opinion in your quoted part. I didn't say "You shouldn't yell at your children, because it only escalates the situation, you simpleton.

 

 

 

So this thread is not even 2 full pages long are your unable to stay in enough control to not resort to name calling.  You say you will never yell at your children yet can't have a debate without resorting to acting childish and name calling.  Yep, no troubles here.

[GeorgiiMichael]

FP, do you realize how annoying and condescending everything you've posted sounds? By making a judgement like "yelling at your kids is wrong" you imply sin and come across as judgmental. You found one study saying that yelling can be as bad as hitting, and you decry both as evil and sinful. Sure, you might not have said that exactly, but that's how it sounds.

 

I'm going to tell you something right now, I will not hesitate from yelling at or spanking my children if the situation seems to require such a thing. Will it be an everyday occurrence? No. Do I hope it never happens? Yes. Can I guarantee such a thing? Absolutely not. And I will not take such things to confession, because I do not believe such things are sinful. There is no teaching from the Church indicating that these thing are sinful, and no secular study will convince me that they are. 

 

Parenting fads are ridiculous, and I'll not be swayed by "studies" in pseudoscience. 

[arfink]

I know the effects of our 4 year old yelling I mean shrieking at the top of her voice like an angered Nazhgul.

 

 

Sometimes a raised voice is necessary in order for her, or anyone else, to actually hear anything at all. Besides her shrieking, that is.

[PhuturePriest]

FP, do you realize how annoying and condescending everything you've posted sounds? By making a judgement like "yelling at your kids is wrong" you imply sin and come across as judgmental. You found one study saying that yelling can be as bad as hitting, and you decry both as evil and sinful. Sure, you might not have said that exactly, but that's how it sounds.

I'm going to tell you something right now, I will not hesitate from yelling at or spanking my children if the situation seems to require such a thing. Will it be an everyday occurrence? No. Do I hope it never happens? Yes. Can I guarantee such a thing? Absolutely not. And I will not take such things to confession, because I do not believe such things are sinful. There is no teaching from the Church indicating that these thing are sinful, and no secular study will convince me that they are.

Parenting fads are ridiculous, and I'll not be swayed by "studies" in pseudoscience.

I'm sorry if my posts are coming off that way. I'm sure you know I certainly don't mean them to, and I'll work on making myself clearer and more concise.

[PhuturePriest]

So this thread is not even 2 full pages long are your unable to stay in enough control to not resort to name calling. You say you will never yell at your children yet can't have a debate without resorting to acting childish and name calling. Yep, no troubles here.

You misunderstood me. I was NOT by any means calling you a simpleton. I used that as an example to try and say I wasn't trying to belittle and teach you and other parents. I perhaps failed at that and I apologize for it if I did.

[Lilllabettt]

Ever seen 19 Kids and Counting? Most organized family on the entire planet. It's never unruly and they never lose their tempers. They have in fact said they always do their best not to, because doing so will "harm the relationships with their children".

 

let me get this straight. you are referencing the content of a reality tv show to validate your statements. is that right.

 

I really think the popular obsession with/ holding up of "super parents" like those of the 19 kids and counting gang is pathological.  It comes from a deeply-rooted fear and dread of being unsatisfied parents and unsatisfactory as parents.  This is also the source of "parenting philosophies."  Their popularity is fear-based. It's also the root cause of the mommy wars.

 

Social consequences are pernicious; some parents will read this study and despair because, having yelled at junior to clean his room, they stand convicted in their own minds as the equivalent of a child beater. Not a few people decline to become parents at all because they feel incapable of achieving and maintaining the (ridiculously high) standards of parenting they feel children are entitled to.

 

not healthy.

[Ice_nine]

I've been raised to talk/yell at least 10 dB's above normal volume in most everyday situations.

 

 

[arfink]

let me get this straight. you are referencing the content of a reality tv show to validate your statements. is that right.

 

I really think the popular obsession with/ holding up of "super parents" like those of the 19 kids and counting gang is pathological.  It comes from a deeply-rooted fear and dread of being unsatisfied parents and unsatisfactory as parents.  This is also the source of "parenting philosophies."  Their popularity is fear-based. It's also the root cause of the mommy wars.

 

Social consequences are pernicious; some parents will read this study and despair because, having yelled at junior to clean his room, they stand convicted in their own minds as the equivalent of a child beater. Not a few people decline to become parents at all because they feel incapable of achieving and maintaining the (ridiculously high) standards of parenting they feel children are entitled to.

 

not healthy.

 

This post makes me so sad.

 

Because I have but one prop to give.

[PhuturePriest]

I've been raised to talk/yell at least 10 dB's above normal volume in most everyday situations.

I feel bad for your vocal chords. My aunt Tania has collapsed her lungs twice because she yells so much. That's the type of yelling I'm referring to when I say yelling is bad, because that's what comes to mind when I think of yelling. Is there a different kind? If there is, I honestly didn't know.

[MarysLittleFlower]

Well show me one person who thinks raising children is easy after having children of their own and then we can talk?

 

 

I didn't say it's easy.. I said that we can learn to control *ourselves* so we respond to situations without anger.

no parent has everything under control.  No human being has everything under control.  So false statements.

But with grace, we can learn to control how we act on our feelings... I'm not talking about raising your voice when a kid is screaming so they can hear you, though I don't know how this works, - my mom said that distracting the kid tends to actually work better. (Otherwise it just builds). But I'm talking about getting angry, calling the kid names, etc, - out of anger or rage.

 

FP, do you realize how annoying and condescending everything you've posted sounds? By making a judgement like "yelling at your kids is wrong" you imply sin and come across as judgmental. You found one study saying that yelling can be as bad as hitting, and you decry both as evil and sinful. Sure, you might not have said that exactly, but that's how it sounds.

 

I'm going to tell you something right now, I will not hesitate from yelling at or spanking my children if the situation seems to require such a thing. Will it be an everyday occurrence? No. Do I hope it never happens? Yes. Can I guarantee such a thing? Absolutely not. And I will not take such things to confession, because I do not believe such things are sinful. There is no teaching from the Church indicating that these thing are sinful, and no secular study will convince me that they are. 

 

Parenting fads are ridiculous, and I'll not be swayed by "studies" in pseudoscience. 

 

For me this discussion isn't so much about discipline, as it is about parents yelling out of anger and saying hurtful things or being too harsh with the kids.

I know the effects of our 4 year old yelling I mean shrieking at the top of her voice like an angered Nazhgul.

 

 

Sometimes a raised voice is necessary in order for her, or anyone else, to actually hear anything at all. Besides her shrieking, that is.

 

Same as above - I think it's the anger that's the topic here, not so much the raising one's voice part?

 

I don't know.. I don't read parenting tips or studies etc. I'm not against discipline. But if a parent can't control their temper, - I don't want to judge them as an individual because it's easy to lose control, for me too - but I just think that's something to watch against. Especialy if there's namecalling etc. I think that's different from just discipline... it's more emotional. I dont' know, just a thought.

[EmilyAnn]

Reading this thread, how on earth do those who are not parents feel they have all the answers. None of us who don't have kids have the faintest idea what it's like to be a parent, and a lot of this comes across as being high-and-mighty about something you don't know a thing about.

[Aloysius]

I have this temptation to move this thread into the Raising Small Humans forum just to watch the world burn.  I don't think I'll do that though, lol.

 

spare the rod, spoil the child, anyone?  honestly, just emotional irrational yelling is generally not a good move, but at the same time it's understandable and I think a parent should try to avoid it but not feel like they've done the equivalent of hitting their child if they do end up yelling (and yes, I think this study is a bit of malarky in acting like hitting and yelling are psychologically equivalent, that's far too subjective to measure that way)... but sometimes a yell is a good idea--like a dog barking, it's a matter of getting attention.  I don't think it's a good idea to give your children lectures through long screaming tirades, but "HEY, stop that!" yelled at a child who has disobeyed you for the umpteenth time can certainly be okay in getting the child's attention, the effective follow up to such a yell after you have their attention is probably a calmer tone, as the calm unemotional tone seems to work for supernanny (watching supernanny being the bulk of my experience in child raising lol)

 

as far as husbands and wives, everyone has different temperments and the way peoples' temperments mix in a marriage will produce all different kinds of relationships... it's possible to have a happy marriage where you never yell at each other, my parents always swore to having done that in their almost 30 years of marriage... it's probably not possible to have a happy marriage without arguing with each other, of course, but that doesn't necessarily mean yelling.  

[FutureCarmeliteClaire]

Everyone makes mistakes (I'm referring to the kind of irrational purely emotional and frustration yelling that Aloysius has referred to above), but I don't think FP denies that. I'm no psychoanalyst, but I think that this study struck a personal chord with FP, and so his defensiveness and perhaps condescension is very much related to that.

 

I've been yelled at through my childhood on numerous occasions. Did I deserve it? Absoultely yes. Did it make me upset and cry? Sure. Did it make me hate my parents? Not at all.

 

There's a difference between disciplinary yelling and verbal abuse.

Also depends on what you're yelling.

And WHY you're yelling.

 

I'm not a parent, but I'm the oldest of a bazillion kids. They can be incredibly frustrating. I yell at them probably more than I should. I feel awful for it sometimes. Sometimes it's for a good reason, and sometimes it's because I'm having a bad day. I simply cannot predict what I will be like as a parent. No one can.

 

Don't be so defensive, FP and parents. It's just the internet, and no one's judging your parenting. If they are, then it's their problem. FP, calm yourself, child.

[havok579257]

I didn't say it's easy.. I said that we can learn to control *ourselves* so we respond to situations without anger.

But with grace, we can learn to control how we act on our feelings... I'm not talking about raising your voice when a kid is screaming so they can hear you, though I don't know how this works, - my mom said that distracting the kid tends to actually work better. (Otherwise it just builds). But I'm talking about getting angry, calling the kid names, etc, - out of anger or rage.

 

 

For me this discussion isn't so much about discipline, as it is about parents yelling out of anger and saying hurtful things or being too harsh with the kids.

 

Same as above - I think it's the anger that's the topic here, not so much the raising one's voice part?

 

I don't know.. I don't read parenting tips or studies etc. I'm not against discipline. But if a parent can't control their temper, - I don't want to judge them as an individual because it's easy to lose control, for me too - but I just think that's something to watch against. Especialy if there's namecalling etc. I think that's different from just discipline... it's more emotional. I dont' know, just a thought.

 

 

yelling and name calling are 2 completely different things.  a parent should never call their child names as an insult, never.  although just because you yell at your children does not mean you will turn to name calling.  they are 2 very distinct different things.