Which Spirituality?

[JulianofLdn]

I've done a phorum search, and whilst I can find polls where people discuss their preferred spirituality, I couldn't find anything on the topic of discerning which spirituality is your best fit.

 

Yep, rolling back the discernment process for somebody starting out! I read today a quote from somebody (a Vocation Director, I think) saying you couldn't make a Carmelite a Dominican even if you tried...which made me wonder, how do you know which one you are? How do you know which spirituality is your best fit? 

 

(I didn't grow up as a Catholic so I'm starting from scratch.)

 

And if you don't know, what's the best way to find out? Which books to read? (Think introductory books, starting points.)

 

I know some of you are very passionate about a particular family of spirituality, so I'd be interested to know why that is, too. Is it the founder? Particular saints? Experiences of bringing elements of that spirituality into your daily life? 

 

Hope you don't mind all the questions, but you all are so knowledgeable I couldn't resist!  :hehe:

 

Thank you :)

[beatitude]

I don't think it's something you really test for, like a blood type. It's just something you discover from experience - rather like learning that you're in love with someone. :) The metaphor of the desert as a place of prayer speaks to me (perhaps because I have lived for so much of my life in desert environments), I have a great affinity with the Carmelite saints (especially St John of the Cross, and some others less well-known), solitude and silence are significant to me, etc. I felt very home in a Carmelite monastery when I visited, but still not quite at home enough. Then I met the Little Sisters of Jesus and everything fell into place. When they were founded, their bishop didn't know what to do with them at first because he had neve encountered sisters who combined "the work of the Vincentians with the prayer of the Carmelites". They were inspired by the life of Blessed Charles de Foucauld, who lived out his life alone in the desert of the Hoggar - and who was also hugely influenced by St John of the Cross. His writings made perfect and crystal clear sense to me and they fitted my life like a key into a lock; it was like recognising a language I already speak. I can appreciate Benedictine and Franciscan spiritualities as very beautiful and rich, but they don't speak to me in the same way - they are communicating the same truth in another dialect, and it isn't quite mine.

[cmaD2006]

Personally I think it becomes clearer over time. I used to think that I was 100% franciscan but now I am convinced that I am an Ignatian at heart. That will probably not change but it was when I kept being exposed to the Ignatian style of prayer that it started becoming more obvious.

[nikita92]

Is there a female Ignatian based community?

[beatitude]

Eowyn, yes, there are a few - the Faithful Companions of Jesus and the Congregation of Jesus are two that I have come into contact with personally. My spiritual director for a while was an FCJ. They're a lovely community. I know there are several other Ignatian-inspired communities for women.

[juchu]

 I know there are several other Ignatian-inspired communities for women.

 

For example the St. Andrews Sisters:

 

http://www.saint-andre.be/fr/
 

They are all over the world.

 

And also the "Congregatio Jesu", before known as Sisters of Mary Ward:

 

www.congregatiojesu.org/

[Eowyn]

Personally I think it becomes clearer over time. I used to think that I was 100% franciscan but now I am convinced that I am an Ignatian at heart. That will probably not change but it was when I kept being exposed to the Ignatian style of prayer that it started becoming more obvious.

 

That's been my experience, also.  I started out with a strong attraction to the Carmelites, but then St Francis got ahold of me.  I've heard that the Carmelites and Franciscans are very similar.  I don't know how to put it in words, but there is just something about the Franciscan spirituality that really works for me.   

[thepiaheart]

I think one can only see this, barring some kind of exceptional grace or the gift of growing up with great exposure to a particular tradition, over time, for it is in living out our relationship and intimacy with the Trinity that we come to understand the place to which God may call us if the religious life is our vocation. I can also underscore from personal experience that one needs to be relatively whole, emotionally and spiritually, and possess a mature degree of self-knowledge, before an understanding of spirituality is possible. I was discerning very seriously with a contemplative Dominican community, but in the 1.5 years since, God has broken me into pieces and put me together again, in intense, often drastic ways, to bring necessary healing to deep and semi-forgotten wounds, and if I were to discern with any community now, I would have no doubt start with Carmel--my entire way of being, my way of being before God, is completely new, for the Lord has made it so.

Edited January 19, 2014 by thepiaheart

[cartermia]

I first loved the Franciscans because one of my mother's best friend's sister was a Franciscan sister from Clinton, Iowa and I felt a peace when I first met her.

I walked down to  my mother's friend's house after school since my mother could not pick me up and I met Sr. Louise. We only talked for a little bit but then she told me to do my homework, since she said she was a teacher and students should get their homework done right after school. So I went out on the front porch and did my homework just thinking about St. Francis, my favorite saint at the time.

 

Several years later my grandmother told me that my mother's friend had told her Sr. Louise said I would do great things and that I guess was when I decided I wanted to be a Franciscan.

 

I have just recently discovered the Benedictines way of life and it just feel right, the Franciscans  never felt like the perfect fit but the Benedictines do.

 

 

Good book to read- In This House of Brede by Rumer Godden 

[Kayte Postle]

I've had a similar situation to Carter.  When converting to Catholicism I was exposed to Franciscan spirituality a lot. The parish I attended and was confirmed in was Franciscan, we had several Franciscan orders visit campus, St. Francis and St. Clare were the first two saints I got to know. Because of the fact that I was surrounded by Franciscans I simply thought that was a sign that I was a Franciscan. Bing bang boom. However, as I started to grow in my faith and discover the many different "flavors" of the Church, Franciscan  spirituality just didn't fit me. I too recently have been learning about Benedictine spirituality, and I am finding that it very much makes sense to me.

 

i think it's just a matter of exploring the spiritualities that you are drawn to. The right one will just click, it will just make sense.

 

[deusluxmea]

Two things:

 

Loreto and Ursuline sisters also follow Ignatian spirituality, I believe. 

 

For me, I knew I was Benedictine from the outset. Can't explain why, but I just knew that's what I was meant to be. 

[JulianofLdn]

Thanks for all the replies, everybody :)

 

Ignatian Spirituality! Well, that's the one I know best. The church I attend is a Jesuit parish and they have a community centre attached which runs day retreats and drop-in prayers and all sorts of groups that have allowed me to experience Ignatian practices. Which I'm very fond of, by the way. So I know a fair amount of what prayer looks like in the Ignatian tradition and how that feeds into their charism. The others, I have no idea...

 

(And, ps, there's also the RSCJ sisters...)

 

Cartermia: a book recommendation! Perfect, thank you. Reading is the best way for me to get my head around stuff. (What does that make me... ;) )

 

I know Ignatian spirituality pretty well, then, but as to the rest... I'm not even really sure if I know how Carmelite prayer is different to Dominican prayer, for example. 

Edited January 21, 2014 by JulianofLdn

[EmilyAnn]

It's a work-in-progress but a friend and I have been working on this guide to discerning your spirituality. It's imperfect, but it's just the things we've found helpful and found in other resources. 

[PhuturePriest]

I've honestly never bothered myself with finding which "spirituality" I am. I know what appeals to me and what doesn't, and that's what matters the most. There really isn't a rule stating you have to label yourself this or that spirituality, and it's best to just discern what really speaks to you and go with that. It's also really easy to kind of unintentionally strive for one spirituality or another, because your favorite Saint had this one or that one. That's a pitfall I've noticed with some people, and I know myself enough to know I would probably end up being one of those people, so I just avoid the matter altogether.

Edited January 21, 2014 by FuturePriest387

[cartermia]

^^^^^

That is what I used to do but now I kind of think I know what I want and am being called to be.

[Kayte Postle]

It's a work-in-progress but a friend and I have been working on this guide to discerning your spirituality. It's imperfect, but it's just the things we've found helpful and found in other resources. 

 

Thank you for that resource EmilyAnn, I've been reading through it the past hour and there's so much useful information!

[SilentJoy]

It's a work-in-progress but a friend and I have been working on this guide to discerning your spirituality. It's imperfect, but it's just the things we've found helpful and found in other resources. 

Thank you, I'm interested as well. I think I will really enjoy looking at your site!

[PhuturePriest]

^^^^^

That is what I used to do but now I kind of think I know what I want and am being called to be.

 

It's not a matter of not knowing what you want and are called to be, it's just not knowing what specific established spirituality you fall under. There is a difference. I think I know what I want to do and am planning to go through with it, even though I don't know what spirituality I fall under. I just don't see the need to find a spirituality to label yourself, really. As long as you have a spiritual director that helps you figure out who you are as a person, you'll know what works best for you spiritually and what you should work on, even without knowing what spirituality you fit closest to.

 

I don't dislike the idea of spiritualities and am not attacking the idea, just to be clear. I was just giving my opinion that finding the spirituality you fit closest under is not nearly as important as just finding out who you are as a person and what you are drawn towards. After all, no two people have the same spiritualities. They may have a lot in common, but they do differ on specific points that both find important to them.

Edited January 22, 2014 by FuturePriest387

[beatitude]

I've honestly never bothered myself with finding which "spirituality" I am. I know what appeals to me and what doesn't, and that's what matters the most. There really isn't a rule stating you have to label yourself this or that spirituality, and it's best to just discern what really speaks to you and go with that. It's also really easy to kind of unintentionally strive for one spirituality or another, because your favorite Saint had this one or that one. That's a pitfall I've noticed with some people, and I know myself enough to know I would probably end up being one of those people, so I just avoid the matter altogether.

 

I think this is very solid advice. As I wrote, I fit very closely with the spirituality of Charles de Foucauld, but I never went out looking for a spirituality, thinking, "Which is mine?" The realisation came gradually as I lived my life. De Foucauld placed great emphasis on doing simple work, as Jesus did at Nazareth, and taking the lowest place - something that resonated with me when I heard of it, as my first job after university was minimum wage and classed as 'unskilled'. And I could see how such work had become prayer for me, so what Brother Charles wrote in this respect made sense. Then I found many other things that made sense. It was like a jigsaw puzzle coming together, but I never actively went looking for pieces.

 

I think it is also worth remembering that in other times people had a very different attitude to religious discernment than we have today. Ruth Burrows, the Carmelite nun whose books I love (To Believe in Jesus - try it!!), felt a calling to be a contemplative nun. In her autobiography, Before the Living God, she talks about two monasteries that lay relatively close by - one Carmelite, one Cistercian - and how she consulted a priest friend about which one to enter. He suggested the Carmelites, partly because the idea of the Cistercians seemed more alarming to Ruth's mother. She entered Carmel at seventeen and is now a very elderly lady, and she's never looked back. To us, used to going on discernment retreats and reading all sorts of books about different spiritualities, this approach seems odd. But it does have its merits. Until the age of budget air and train travel, most people entered a convent or monastery nearby, and they did not place such emphasis on spirituality and charism. They simply couldn't afford to. I do not say our modern approach is wrong, or that the old approach was wrong - both have sensible reasons behind them - but we can learn from both and we should be aware that working out our spirituality may not always be the most practical way to find our home.

[PhuturePriest]

I think this is very solid advice. As I wrote, I fit very closely with the spirituality of Charles de Foucauld, but I never went out looking for a spirituality, thinking, "Which is mine?" The realisation came gradually as I lived my life. De Foucauld placed great emphasis on doing simple work, as Jesus did at Nazareth, and taking the lowest place - something that resonated with me when I heard of it, as my first job after university was minimum wage and classed as 'unskilled'. And I could see how such work had become prayer for me, so what Brother Charles wrote in this respect made sense. Then I found many other things that made sense. It was like a jigsaw puzzle coming together, but I never actively went looking for pieces.

 

I think it is also worth remembering that in other times people had a very different attitude to religious discernment than we have today. Ruth Burrows, the Carmelite nun whose books I love (To Believe in Jesus - try it!!), felt a calling to be a contemplative nun. In her autobiography, Before the Living God, she talks about two monasteries that lay relatively close by - one Carmelite, one Cistercian - and how she consulted a priest friend about which one to enter. He suggested the Carmelites, partly because the idea of the Cistercians seemed more alarming to Ruth's mother. She entered Carmel at seventeen and is now a very elderly lady, and she's never looked back. To us, used to going on discernment retreats and reading all sorts of books about different spiritualities, this approach seems odd. But it does have its merits. Until the age of budget air and train travel, most people entered a convent or monastery nearby, and they did not place such emphasis on spirituality and charism. They simply couldn't afford to. I do not say our modern approach is wrong, or that the old approach was wrong - both have sensible reasons behind them - but we can learn from both and we should be aware that working out our spirituality may not always be the most practical way to find our home.

 

Exactly. As long as you properly discern and learn about who you are, you'll know which spirituality you are simply by watching it happen before your eyes. I've noticed a trend of people who want to get their hands on what spirituality is theirs right off the bat, and I'm not sure if this is wise. If you asked me what I thought my spirituality was when I was an annoying and ignorant 14 year old, I probably would have said Franciscan, because out of all of the zillions of communities I looked at, at least 75% of them were Franciscan. But I don't feel a deep calling to dedicate my life to the poor for the rest of my life, nor do I feel called to live an extremely austere lifestyle, both of which are at the heart of a Franciscan spirituality. I find the idea of teaching in a classroom or even evangelizing in a different country far more appealing than dedicating my life to the poor. I'd even find living in a cloistered monastery more appealing than that, and I'm one of the most extroverted and talkative people I know. I don't know which spirituality that indicates (Though I do know which ones it doesn't), but I'm not going to worry myself with knowing what it is, yet. My personal spirituality is still developing and maturing, and as long as I listen to my spiritual director and keep a close relationship with God, my spirituality will unfold before my eyes, rather than be told to me by an online quiz.

Edited January 22, 2014 by FuturePriest387