Anyone Ever Discern An Order While Working Full Time?

[oremus1]

how did you do it? in the usa you get only like 2 weeks holiday from work. in Europe, about 4 weeks.

 

many say you need to spend at least 14 days there to properly discern. 

 

how is it possible? my friends who are teachers visit many orders for like a week at a time.

 

I only have small holiday leave. but if I only visit for a weekend I look uncommitted. but I want to visit a few

 

what did you do?

[Nunsense]

Yes, it's hard, but not impossible. I have done it many times. I would say 2-3 weeks is the minimum time needed as the first week is really a settling in period. By the second week, things start to feel familiar, and by the third week, it is clear whether or not one wants to come back and try as a Postulant. First impressions can be changed so a weekend isn't really enough time to make an important decision like entering as a Postulant.

[oremus1]

Yes, it's hard, but not impossible. I have done it many times. I would say 2-3 weeks is the minimum time needed as the first week is really a settling in period. By the second week, things start to feel familiar, and by the third week, it is clear whether or not one wants to come back and try as a Postulant. First impressions can be changed so a weekend isn't really enough time to make an important decision like entering as a Postulant.

I was thinking of several weekends, maybe consecutively.

 

most places wont allow 3 weeks off of work. besides. if you did spend the three weeks with one order then found they were not for you, you'd have to wait a whole year (to get more annual leave) before visitng any other orders in a serious way. that is the issue.  

 

a related question, how do people who visit many orders for like a week each, manage that? are they mostly 18 or 21 and just out of education and living with parents? how do they have the time. it isn't a case of find the time because with an annual leave allowance of 2 - 4 weeks, I don't see how you can find more than 2 - 4 weeks a year while keeping your job!!
 

Edited July 24, 2014 by oremus1

[Catherine Therese]

Some places will allow a little unpaid leave as well if you put in place a coverage plan... so between weekend retreats, and a combination of paid leave and unpaid leave, you can make it work. 

 

I discerned through corporate craziness, mission critical responsibilities and an essentially middle-management-tier position. A few other things Providentially fell into place as well, and if they hadn't happened it may have been harder... but thats just it. The Lord provided. 

 

Prayers for you!

[TheresaThoma]

For most of my discernment I have either been in school part time/working part time, going to school full time, or working full time. Another challenge for me is I live pretty far from the communities I have discerned with. The approach I have found that has worked is when I am first looking into a community is to spend a long weekend there. This was a decent amount of time to know if I wanted to start really discerning with that community. If so I would plan a longer visit. And go from there. Since you can't spend a ton of time consecuatively this probably means that you will spend more time in discernment (a year or two) than if you could make longer visits.
It can be difficult because I would love to spend more time with the community but typically a week is all I can manage to take. Between visits I call, email and sometimes Skype. Its not the same as being there but it helps.

[oremus1]

For most of my discernment I have either been in school part time/working part time, going to school full time, or working full time. Another challenge for me is I live pretty far from the communities I have discerned with. The approach I have found that has worked is when I am first looking into a community is to spend a long weekend there. This was a decent amount of time to know if I wanted to start really discerning with that community. If so I would plan a longer visit. And go from there. Since you can't spend a ton of time consecuatively this probably means that you will spend more time in discernment (a year or two) than if you could make longer visits.
It can be difficult because I would love to spend more time with the community but typically a week is all I can manage to take. Between visits I call, email and sometimes Skype. Its not the same as being there but it helps.

 

 

many thanks, yes, ths is a very good idea indeed - a lot of long weekends. i shall do this.

[maximillion]

I managed it, I was nursing at the time in England and the community were in France!

 

First visit, a week holiday.

 

Second visit in the Enclosure and two weeks, four months later.

 

Third visit was six months later for a further two weeks at the end of which I applied and was accepted. Went home to give notice and pack.

 

In between I wrote a weekly letter to the NM at her request, then about a month before my final visit, we had weekly phone calls in addition.

All in all I knew the community for a year prior to entry.

 

It was harder the previous year, when I visited five communities in England. Weekends off in nursing are rare, so I saved up my off duty time, sometimes working 10 days to get three or four off duty in a bunch, and did mid week visits.

[freedomreigns]

I discerned while working full-time.  I visited 3 different communities for weekend discernment retreats.  The community I entered has a 2 week visit for those applying for entrance for discernment on both the part of the applicant and the community.  

 

A lot will depend on what the actual community one is interested in recommends.  Some would not be able to accommodate long stays.  (I know the community I was with would not have been able.)  

 

[SophiaMaria]

It depends on the job and where you work. A friend of mine is a director of religious education at a good parish and Father has been very generous in allowing the blocks of time she needs to visit communities. Some is paid vacation and some of the other time she's taking unpaid time off

[cmaD2006]

how did you do it? in the usa you get only like 2 weeks holiday from work. in Europe, about 4 weeks.

 

many say you need to spend at least 14 days there to properly discern. 

 

how is it possible? my friends who are teachers visit many orders for like a week at a time.

 

I only have small holiday leave. but if I only visit for a weekend I look uncommitted. but I want to visit a few

 

what did you do?

 

I've done it more than once.  But -- even as a young employee I was getting 3 weeks (now I get 5, plus have the option of taking 2 weeks unpaid and I get a week off at Christmas).

 

One of my entrances -- I planned a two week visit, followed by a week/week and a half visit to the same community in a different country.

 

The other entrance -- I don't really remember.  I think I did at least 2 visits (maybe 3).  One of the visits was with my mom to calm her fears down once I knew I was going to enter.  I do think one visit was two weeks long, the other was one.  One may have been a long weekend.

 

I worked not only full time but at times I work > 40 hrs a week, plus travel (the 1 time a year I travel it's usually a 55-60 hr work week).

 

And as far as getting time off of work -- depends on what kind of job.  I actually got a month off last year (paid) for my 30 day retreat, and followed it with a two week class (paid -- I was able to save a week of vacation from the year before).

 

Finally ... a lot of long weekends are a very good idea, especially if the community is fairly close by.  If it is not then it will be harder, but still doable.

[OnlySunshine]

I, personally, found it VERY challenging to discern while working full-time as a CNA.  I had to put my discernment on the back burner because it was very difficult to get time off without requesting it months in advance - and even then you weren't assured you would get it because someone else may have asked OR the staff coordinator lost your request.  I requested my birthday off when I first got the job and the staff coordinator scheduled me anyway.  She didn't think it was important even though I never asked for any other time before or after (I left only 5 days after my birthday).  So, I can imagine it would be much more difficult trying to get at least a weekend when I worked every other weekend.  I'm SO glad I'm not at that job anymore!

 

I find discernment a little difficult now since I'm going to school full-time and I have a job starting up in the Fall, too, that's part-time, but I could make it work if I left Friday afternoon and came back Sunday.

Edited July 24, 2014 by MaterMisericordiae

[Kayte Postle]

I'm having this problem too. For the first five months of my full time internship I don't get any vacation days, and it will be hard to schedule days off (and my scheduled off days will vary week to week). Even once I go to full-time hire in December I'll still only have 2 weeks of leave. On top of that I'll be in central FL, and most of the communities I am interested in are in the midwest or west coast, so I won't be able to drive (all flying/train). While I'm nervous about being able to continue discerning, I know that God will provide. Somehow He will put things into place for me to be able to follow where He leads.  I have to keep reminding myself of that.

[Spem in alium]

how did you do it? in the usa you get only like 2 weeks holiday from work. in Europe, about 4 weeks.

 

many say you need to spend at least 14 days there to properly discern. 

 

how is it possible? my friends who are teachers visit many orders for like a week at a time.

 

I only have small holiday leave. but if I only visit for a weekend I look uncommitted. but I want to visit a few

 

what did you do?

 

I began discerning while I was studying full-time. I was also working as a tutor, which made it difficult for me to take time off during school term and even during holiday periods. I began discerning a particular order by attending their retreats and having discussions with the Sisters, and tested my feelings by visiting other orders too and seeing what I felt with them. Once I felt that I needed to continue discerning this particular order, what I managed to do follows along the lines of what TheresaThoma has mentioned; staying with them overnight or at times up to four days. I would have loved a longer visit, but my studies and work made this difficult.

 

I'm now applying to this order, and I haven't yet lived a week with them. Some may say this is foolish, but I don't really think I need to have done so. I have seen the community at work and have assisted with their various ministries, I have spent time with them in prayer, at Mass and in recreation. I have read about their foundress, their life and their charism, and feel I have learnt a lot through doing so. They feel I am becoming part of them, just as I feel they are now part of me, and this has happened without a longer visit. The first stage of my formation will also be quite flexible and will give me the choice to live in community or with my family, so I see this as the time in which I can embark on an extended stay. You could say something similar for a couple who is marrying without having lived with each other previously. How do they know they are meant to be married? They know by spending time with each other in different scenarios, by learning about each other through conversation, work, prayer, recreation; by revealing themselves to the other. This is what has happened with me and my Sisters - there is still a lot to learn, but I feel confident in moving forward even though the time I have spent with them could be considered limited.

Edited July 24, 2014 by Spem in alium

[inperpetuity]

The only way I could do it was to work for an agency doing homecare as a nurse.  The schedule is very flexible and they usually always give you the time you need if you give them plenty of notice.  I don't know about other types of occupations though.  I guess you just have to have vacation or personal time.  Now I have a live-in position with an elderly lady who is Catholic and supports my vocation.  God does provide and timing is everything. He seems to have moved me into the right circumstances just at the right time.  I couldn't have arranged these present circumstances myself although I constantly bugged Him about opening a door for me, but it took a long time.

[Kayte Postle]

 

I'm now applying to this order, and I haven't yet lived a week with them. Some may say this is foolish, but I don't really think I need to have done so. I have seen the community at work and have assisted with their various ministries, I have spent time with them in prayer, at Mass and in recreation. I have read about their foundress, their life and their charism, and feel I have learnt a lot through doing so. They feel I am becoming part of them, just as I feel they are now part of me, and this has happened without a longer visit. The first stage of my formation will also be quite flexible and will give me the choice to live in community or with my family, so I see this as the time in which I can embark on an extended stay. You could say something similar for a couple who is marrying without having lived with each other previously. How do they know they are meant to be married? They know by spending time with each other in different scenarios, by learning about each other through conversation, work, prayer, recreation; by revealing themselves to the other. This is what has happened with me and my Sisters - there is still a lot to learn, but I feel confident in moving forward even though the time I have spent with them could be considered limited.

 

Great point TT!

 

Reading your post I also thought how the process is very different depending on if you are discerning with an active/active-contemplative or an enclosed order.  Days visits or spending time with missioned sisters from an active order in your area could be beneficial in helping you to get a better sense of the community, and decide if you want to make a longer visit (or need one).

 

With contemplative enclosed communities I think it's much harder to really get a feel for the life outside enclosure, and as Nunsense mentioned earlier the first few days/week inside enclosure are often just getting settled in the rhythm of their life.

[cmaD2006]

II'm now applying to this order, and I haven't yet lived a week with them. Some may say this is foolish, but I don't really think I need to have done so. I have seen the community at work and have assisted with their various ministries, I have spent time with them in prayer, at Mass and in recreation. I have read about their foundress, their life and their charism, and feel I have learnt a lot through doing so. They feel I am becoming part of them, just as I feel they are now part of me, and this has happened without a longer visit. The first stage of my formation will also be quite flexible and will give me the choice to live in community or with my family, so I see this as the time in which I can embark on an extended stay.

 

It sounds like you have the benefit of being close (in close geographical proximity) to the community.  That makes a big difference ... and also gives you the opportunity to possibly stay a night or two.

 

Besides -- there are things that even a shorter live in (say a month or less) may not reveal.  Some things just won't be learned about a community until you are with the community for the longer term.

 

Finally -- some people have said that they find it very difficult to discern while studying/working full-time.  I think the kicker is this -- necessity.  I'm an older person who has been in discernment.  I didn't (and don't) have the luxury of depending on anyone during the periods of discernment.  So -- when you have bills to keep up with, and an apartment/house/car to pay, plus a full time job you do what you have to do :).  (Did I mention also ministry involvement and volunteer commitments?)

 

What has helped me to keep my focus (either on discernment or on my spiritual growth) is having a spiritual director.  Without this -- yup, I would let life simply take over.

[Spem in alium]

It sounds like you have the benefit of being close (in close geographical proximity) to the community.  That makes a big difference ... and also gives you the opportunity to possibly stay a night or two.

 

I'm about two hours away by train, so staying a single day at the convent is usually difficult, and I'm not able to get there as often as I'd like (once every few months, maybe) because of the study, work and ministry I do. When I've stayed, it's usually overnight - which has tended to be beneficial, as it's given me the opportunity to be part of the activities I previously mentioned (assisting with ministry, participating in prayer and at Mass, spending leisure time with the Sisters, etc). It has also helped me to develop a liking for the place in which I'll be - an attraction which is necessary for me. While I can't just travel to the convent whenever I'm free, I am fortunate to be able to get there with relative ease, and perhaps that in itself is why I haven't felt the necessity for a longer visit (though I would like to be able to do so).

 

What you say about the spiritual director is also very important. My director definitely guides me along my journey and keeps me focused.