Question For You Catholics

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='JeffCR07' date='Jun 30 2004, 05:24 PM'] Part of me wants Dust to get rid of this thread, because if those who are not formed by their faith read this argument, they may be shaken. However, I cannot allow such a grossly unorthodox stab at the Church and at Rome go undefended.
[/quote]
I don't see any reason for deleting this thread or even for closing it at the present time. In fact it is important that these issues be discussed, and hopefully by discussing them, those who dissent from the Magisterium will be informed about the true nature of the doctrine in question, and as a result, be brought back into full communion with the Catholic Church.

[amarkich]

Jeff, there is no reason to be so hostile. Please provide an [i]authoritative [/i]document which supports your belief. See Paul VI's statements concerning Vatican II which state that the Council presents no new doctrine, so please provice something other than that. Even if you claim that Vatican II did not present new doctrine, but only interpretted it a different way (which is a dangerous concept in itself), please provide the statements from the Council which state a contrary statement.

Apotheoun, that was a cute comment about being brought "back into full communion with the Catholic Church", but since I one of the few people who is in the Church and is not a heretic (at least a material heretic), this comment is inappropriate. Further, since you (I am not speaking necessarily to you specifically but to the people who call on authority of others--especially fallible authority--which Saint Thomas Aquinas calls the worst of all arguments) are so intent on relying completely on authority, even fallible authority, then I think that you should recognize your authority is nowhere to be seen in this matter. You neither have the authority to declare a person a heretic or even to declare what heresy is (by your own logic), and you certainly have no authority as a pastor of souls, so please refrain from making comments to the contrary. With that said, I have not been instructed by my Pastor (after many discussions on the matter) of any error or heresy in any of my beliefs (as these are supported by Church teaching). Thank you.

Edited July 1, 2004 by amarkich