Catholic Church needs more Catholics like Kobe. Rest In Peace.

[Guest]

 

[Dogtag]

Actually we need more saints

[Guest]

Your b i t c h a s s comment was erased in the other Kobe thread. Why make another one?

Edited February 3, 2020 by Guest

[Lilllabettt]

I believe in forgiveness but I also think what this is like for the victim for her perp to be eulogized. Even 20 yrs later - you never get over being raped.  It seems like he was trying to do good and his death was sudden and untimely. A tragedy. But, he doesn't deserve unqualified praise - do any of us? The most Christian thing would be to pray for his soul. 

It kind of reminds me of when Princess Diana died, and then in the same week, Mother Teresa. Princess Di's death was so tragic and it got all the attention.  

[Guest]

He wasn't convicted of rape. He said it was consensual sex. I believe him.

And agreed about praying for him.

Edited February 3, 2020 by Guest

[Guest]

Kobe could sleep with almost any woman he wanted. I believe him when he said he truly believed it was consensual. But I also respect the fact he said he could see how it wasn't from her point of view. Although noway do I believe it was rape in the sense she was not willing at all or wasn't open to hooking up leading up to the moment.

 

 

Edited February 3, 2020 by Guest

[Lilllabettt]

1 hour ago, Delivery said:

Kobe could sleep with almost any woman he wanted. I believe him when he said he truly believed it was consensual. But I also respect the fact he said he could see how it wasn't from her point of view. Although noway do I believe it was rape in the sense she was not willing at all or wasn't open to hooking up leading up to the moment.

 

 

Please don't do the thing where you impugne the victim. He understands how she did not view it as consensual because her consent was not explicit and enthusiastic.  Just as an aside if a girl is crying while you have sex with her, that's a good sign you dont have her consent. If inserting your penis into a woman requires the level of force that will give her 2 inch lacerations in her vagina, which are consistent with rape, that's a good sign her consent is not explicit and enthusiastic. 

Unfortunately a lot of men are rapists because they aren't taught what consent is.

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, Lilllabettt said:

Unfortunately a lot of men are rapists because they aren't taught what consent is.

Rape is horrible. Any guy who rapes a woman deserves ridicule and the book thrown at him. Although I don't believe Kobe raped this woman. Is it possible he did? Yeah. But with everything I read on the case I'm not convinced. Also besides the details of the case I don't see him personally raping a woman. Like he could literally get any woman he wanted. It makes no sense. What's likely imo is she gave mixed signals ect. But I don't buy he forcefully raped her with her giving no consent to the sexual encounter.

But all this is a great reason not to have sex before marriage. So you never put yourself in this situation. 

Edited February 3, 2020 by Guest

[Lilllabettt]

4 minutes ago, Delivery said:

Rape is horrible. Any guy who rapes a woman deserves ridicule and the book thrown at him. Although I don't believe Kobe raped this woman. Is it possible he did? Yeah. But with everything I read on the case I'm not convinced. Also besides the details of the case I don't see him personally raping a woman. Like he could literally get any woman he wanted. It makes no sense. What's likely imo is she gave mixed signals ect. But I don't buy he forcefully raped her with her giving no consent to the sexual encounter.

But all this is a great reason not to have sex before marriage. So you never put yourself in this situation. 

Well, rape isnt about sex really. It's about control. And power.

Unfortunately rape happens in marriages too. 

[little2add]

Funny thing about the catholic faith, when you fail and ask forgiveness and truly repent 

your sins are forgiven, no matter how serious. 

Kobe fell from grace, like most mortals do.  However from what i know or have heard he turned his life around and became a good catholic ...

Pray for his widow, surviving children and immediate family for there great loss!

Amen

Edited February 3, 2020 by little2add

[Lilllabettt]

2 hours ago, little2add said:

Funny thing about the catholic faith, when you fail and ask forgiveness and truly repent 

your sins are forgiven, no matter how serious. 

Kobe fell from grace, like most mortals do.  However from what i know or have heard he turned his life around and became a good catholic ...

Pray for his widow, surviving children and immediate family for there great loss!

Amen

Right, I believe in forgiveness and redemption. His death was tragic. However he doesn't deserve unqualified praise. It seems he tried to live a good life in the 20 yrs after this happened.  If he was a good man he wouldn't want his sins to be white washed. The person he hurt is still living a d has to live every day.

[Seven77]

I think that we can learn a lot from his life and death. 1st, the preciousness of life. He was doing something routine, flying in a helicopter which he may have done so many times before. And then this something happens just like that. Appreciate life. 2nd, always be prepared because you never know how long you have. Thirdly, he was turning his life around. His life was sanctified between receptions of the Holy Eucharist, often at Daily Mass. 4th – – he did things for the community, I believe especially for the homeless. 5th, his turning life around shows the power of God's grace and forgiveness when one accepts and receives it. And I think these lessons are more evident because of his popularity.

No, his life is not more important than others lives. That's not the point. The point is, even his popularity, even that can be and is used for God to manifest his great glory and mercy.

Also, I am certain that he would be praying for that person especially now

[nikita92]

Catholic? He cheated on his wife! Just sayin

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, nikita92 said:

Catholic? He cheated on his wife! Just sayin

Oh of course Catholics never cheat on their wives. Why even have Confession? Catholics are just perfect flawless people. Imagine a parallel universe where priest's in the Church actually sexually abused kids and hierarchy up to the Popes covered it up. I know that's crazy and couldn't happen. Because...Catholic...But just imagine if it did.

Edited February 4, 2020 by Guest

[nikita92]

So...he is better than any other catholics?

Maybe he is now a "Saint" in heaven...

[Seven77]

On 2/3/2020 at 7:50 PM, nikita92 said:

So...he is better than any other catholics?

Maybe he is now a "Saint" in heaven...

Wait I'm confused. Whoever said that he was better than any other Catholic? Maybe I don't know how to read or have poor comprehension because I certainly missed that.

I believe in the power of divine mercy. We all bunch of miserable sinners in need of Jesus.

ThereIs a saying attributed to St. Augustine: every saint has a past, every si sinner has a future

As to who is a saint who is not, we must leave that to God and to the judgment of the Church, accordingly.: e

 

[Kateri89]

I didn’t know much about him other than his reputation as a great NBA player and I had a vague memory of the sexual assault allegations.  After the crash, I was reading all sorts of articles and watching videos about him and all I can say is that he seemed to acknowledge his sin although he denied that it was rape.  He fought to save his marriage and practiced corporal works of mercy.  He went to daily mass and according to the priest at his parish, he had just asked about getting confirmed right before he died (not sure why he hadn’t been confirmed yet).  This seems to me to be exactly the point of Christ’s sacrifice.  We all need redemption because we have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.  He wasn’t perfect but none of us are.  He did, however, remain an inspiration to many and by all appearances was a loving and devoted father and husband.  I’m heartbroken thinking of his final moments with his daughter and the other passengers and of course with the family and friends they all left behind.  We have reason to hope they are all in heaven and an obligation to pray for all of them just in case.  I think we also have an obligation to pray for their loved ones.  God bless <3

[Peace]

On 2/2/2020 at 8:39 PM, Dogtag said:

Actually we need more saints

Actually we need Jesus.

Peace wins.

[Peace]

On 2/3/2020 at 1:45 AM, Lilllabettt said:

Please don't do the thing where you impugne the victim. He understands how she did not view it as consensual because her consent was not explicit and enthusiastic.  Just as an aside if a girl is crying while you have sex with her, that's a good sign you dont have her consent. If inserting your penis into a woman requires the level of force that will give her 2 inch lacerations in her vagina, which are consistent with rape, that's a good sign her consent is not explicit and enthusiastic. 

Unfortunately a lot of men are rapists because they aren't taught what consent is.

Well we don't know what the facts are in the Bryant rape case because it never went to trial. Lacerations can be the result of rape or they can be the result of having rough sex with multiple partners over a short period of time. They can be the result of S & M and other perversions. And having sex with another man after the alleged rape (which could have resulted in the other semen found in her panties during her rape exam) would cast doubt on the accusation (it is somewhat difficult to believe that she would have sex with another man within hours of being raped). Attempting to cast the alleged victim as promiscuous just for the sake of shaming her is wrong, but raising the issues noted above is legitimate. A man has a right to defend himself against accusations just as anyone else accused of a crime.

That is not me declaring him innocent either. It is rash to say one way or the other without the type of testing of evidence that would occur with an actual trial.

But you raise an interesting issue. You write that men aren't taught what consent is. In your view, what specifically constitutes consent? Does the man need to produce a written contract, have her sign it, and get two witnesses to attest? Must he say "Cindy. Shall we transition from the couch into the bedroom for 12 minutes of fornication"? Look, we are adults here. When fornication happens, you don't really have these explicit, clear conversations. Typically most guys will keep advancing until they get a clear sign to stop, such as the words "No."

Heck - even crying (apparently) is not all that uncommon during consensual sex. I just googled it. There are tons of articles that discuss why women often cry during sex.

On 2/3/2020 at 2:01 AM, Lilllabettt said:

Well, rape isnt about sex really. It's about control. And power.

According to the person who first thought that up back in the 70's. To me this always seemed to be a trope that is used to push a feminist agenda rather than dealing with facts as they actually exist.

Rape can be about power in many cases but in many it is primarily about the desire for sex. Let's take your typical case at a college frat house party when a guy and a girl both are drinking heavily and making out in his room. He wants to escalate to sex but she has gone far enough and wants to stop, and he rapes her in his intoxicated state. He was young, stupid, drunk, horny, and wanted to get laid. Reprehensible, but the guy isn't trying to exert his "male power" over her or world or whatever. He's not trying to make a political statement or perpetuate the patriarchy.

All of that being said - I would not go around saying that Kobe Bryant is the Catholic that we should all be modeling our lives after. He seemed to be a person who went to Mass every week, loved his children, and did charitable works according to his means. That is practically the bare minimum for any Christian. It ain't exactly laudable, or are our standards really that low? And the guy committed adultery, and may have raped someone. So if people take issue with this particular person being held up as a model for Catholics, I have no problem with that at all.

On 2/3/2020 at 7:37 PM, nikita92 said:

Catholic? He cheated on his wife! Just sayin

Well, he didn't kill her husband like St. David did.

Just saying!

[dominicansoul]

He asked for forgiveness and apologized.  From what we know he never did this again to anyone else.  I guess it will always be a part of him though.  No one ever forgets the worst you do in life.  

May God have mercy on his soul and I hope he made it.  I kept thinking that he will probably be in purgatory for a long time...and how sad it will be for him when his daughter gets to leave but he stays behind... pray for his soul...