Didacus Posted December 17, 2023 Share Posted December 17, 2023 Is tolerance a christian virtue? Yes or No? STATE YOUR CASE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted December 17, 2023 Share Posted December 17, 2023 No. The seven heavenly virtues are: Humility Charity Chastity Gratitude Temperance Patience Diligence Tolerance does not appear in that list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didacus Posted December 18, 2023 Author Share Posted December 18, 2023 I agree. Why is it that Christians are called upon to be tolerant then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted December 18, 2023 Share Posted December 18, 2023 Define tolerance and how it is applied. Is allowing your unwed and pregnant daughter to live in your home being tolerant of her lack of chastity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luigi Posted December 18, 2023 Share Posted December 18, 2023 Tolerance, by me, includes the idea of allowing the other person to exercise her independence - she has to think for herself, exercise her own conscience, make her own decisions, live (or die) with the consequences of those decisions, take responsibility for her own life. It also involves the idea of charity - seeing myself as connected to you. So I shouldn't rush to cut someone off from my acquaintance, or social circle. What is called 'shunning' in some churches should be a last resort. But love should trump all of that. I still need to want what is best for the other person. And here, one can make very few generalizations. In the example of the unwed pregnant daughter, if she's very capable and independent, it might be best for her not to live in your home; if she's immature, naive, or gullible, then maybe it's best for her to live in your home. And in this particular example, there's also the need to want what's best for the forthcoming child. There's also the question of one's relationship to the person being 'tolerated' (which goes back to charity). Is this my child, for whom I'm responsible, and whom I should train up in the ways of the Lord? How old is the child? OR is this my eight-years-older sibling, who might accept some input from me but who isn't going to follow my suggestions unless she can see clear personal benefits to herself? OR is this a college student in my class, whom I'm responsible to respect and teach but not so much to form as a human being? OR is this a coworker? A neighbor? A stranger in the grocery store? Charity tells us to accept - and respect - each person as a sister or brother. But some of our sisters and brothers are like sheep without a shepherd. If I'm in a position to offer counsel, I should do that; if I'm not... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted December 18, 2023 Share Posted December 18, 2023 Yeah, don't confuse tolerance with any of the Christian virtues we should be adhering to. We should not tolerate evil, but we should always tolerate people, because that's charity, not tolerance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
little2add Posted December 29, 2023 Share Posted December 29, 2023 “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. I came not to call the righteous, but sinners.” JC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Credo in Deum Posted December 29, 2023 Share Posted December 29, 2023 (edited) On 12/17/2023 at 12:59 PM, Didacus said: Is tolerance a christian virtue? Yes or No? STATE YOUR CASE! Yes and no, it depends. We are called to be tolerant of individuals, but not towards ideas. We are called to be tolerant of sinners, not towards sin. Edited December 29, 2023 by Credo in Deum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didacus Posted January 3 Author Share Posted January 3 Seems that many modern day christians confuse tolerance of the sinner with tolerance of the sin. Society has 'played' christians on that angle it seems... when sinners define themselves by their sins and cannot differentiate between the two for themselves, it really stagnates the christian approach to reality. aka - sexual preferences defined as what a person is... `born this way' hence alleviating themselves of their personnal responsiblity. To me tolerance is to extend my love, even though the sin of the sinner hurt me (aka, he stole 20$ from me, I'll neve have it back, but I will refrain from seeking revenge and still be charitable to the thief) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norseman82 Posted January 14 Share Posted January 14 In my experience, "Tolerance" is a buzzword the enemy is using to shame people for stating the truth, especially in deviant sexual behaviors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luigi Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 On 1/3/2024 at 1:27 PM, Didacus said: Seems that many modern day christians confuse tolerance of the sinner with tolerance of the sin. ... `born this way' hence alleviating themselves of their personal responsibility. I agree. We can understand this, perhaps more easily or clearly, if we substitute something other than an outright sin: - "I was born diabetic;" right, but you're still personally responsible for eating in such a way as to not make your diabetes worse - "I was born alcoholic" (some people do have a genetic proclivity toward alcoholism): right, but you're still personally responsible for not driving drunk or letting alcoholism affect your life - and other people's lives - negatively - "I was born with ADD;" right, but you are still personally responsible for learning to make lists, set timelines/deadlines, reward yourself for staying on task, or whatever else. We're all born with some positive traits and some negative traits. And we're all personally responsible for strengthening the positive traits and learning to deal with the negative traits. It's not that complicated, and it's not a new idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didacus Posted January 16 Author Share Posted January 16 On 1/14/2024 at 12:19 PM, Norseman82 said: In my experience, "Tolerance" is a buzzword the enemy is using to shame people for stating the truth, especially in deviant sexual behaviors. A sneaky trick, but unfortunately effective. People fear being tagged with 'ugly words' like intolerant more so then being on the wrong side of the conversation. Takes courage to state the truth these days, especially stating the Truth. 16 hours ago, Luigi said: I agree. We can understand this, perhaps more easily or clearly, if we substitute something other than an outright sin: - "I was born diabetic;" right, but you're still personally responsible for eating in such a way as to not make your diabetes worse - "I was born alcoholic" (some people do have a genetic proclivity toward alcoholism): right, but you're still personally responsible for not driving drunk or letting alcoholism affect your life - and other people's lives - negatively - "I was born with ADD;" right, but you are still personally responsible for learning to make lists, set timelines/deadlines, reward yourself for staying on task, or whatever else. We're all born with some positive traits and some negative traits. And we're all personally responsible for strengthening the positive traits and learning to deal with the negative traits. It's not that complicated, and it's not a new idea. Yes indeed, I agree! Its like the primacy of conscience - we are to act to the limit of our conscience, regardless of scripture or dogma... HOWEVER - we are held responsible to exercise our conscience to its potential by discerning scripture and dogma. Primacy of conscience is NOT A LICENSE TO DO WHAT YOU WANT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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