Young Women As Altar Servers

[Norseman82]

Remember, even the soldiers prophesied, "If it is not of God it will fall on it's own.  But if it is, then you might find yourself fighting against God!"  (not sure if that is exactly what was said - but the meaning is sound).

That was Gamaliel at the end of Acts 5...

[Winchester]

Blonde,

Just to clarify: You're saying you would leave the Church over a disciplinary matter? I don't understand the reasoning here. Do you believe the Catholic Church is the One True Church? If yes, then would you not have to submit to her will, since she is perfect and you are not? If no, then why are you in the Church currently?

[BLAZEr]

The reasoning was this:  in the role of leading others in their spirituality and other things that priests do in general, women are actually more likely to be good at this. (Guys, no offense meant!!)  Women are instinctively more nurturing because of their natural roles as mothers, so they would be great as mothers to an entire congregation, right?  Well, no.

The thing is, since the beginning of time, women have emphasized to be gentle, forgive people, and care for them.  If Jesus was a women, and was preaching this, would anyone have listened? Probably not, that's what women do already!  There are many statistics that show women in general are more involved in religion than men.  For example, traditionally, families assume the religion of the wife.

The importance of having male priests is the same as the importance of Jesus being a man.  There needs to be a male role model of faith and morals that is clearly visible.  Taking into account the natural tendency for women to be more involved in the church, just think how much more that would happen if many of the priests were female.

Claire,

Think this is a brilliant line of thought, really brings up an interesting point, but it seems like a definition seeking a word . . . in other words: Its a nice idea but it just doesn't get to the heart of what the priesthood is. It seems to place too great an emphasis on women's religious affinity as a reason for Christ being a man and the priesthood being masculine. I'm sorry, but I don't think God made Christ a man just because no one would listen to a woman.

Instead, I think CS Lewis (who wasn't even a Catholic) makes the best point in suggesting why its necessary for the priest to be a man. He also makes the best point for why Christ MUST be a man. You can read his essay here:

http://huey.cc/dunstan/PriestessesintheChurch.HTM

I also find it interesting that we keep saying that this isn't a debate about women priests. I would disagree. I think that is exactly what it is and that is why so many people have read this thread and posted to it. Whether we choose to acknowledge it or not, this discussion has tread so closely to the women's ordination question because it is NATURAL for us to associate the Altar Server with the Priest. Even the most orthodox among us suggest that "having girl altar servers won't lead to women's ordination." Yet each us says this with bated breath because we know that that's exactly where the logical end of this habit will lead us. Girl altar servers are a human invention . . . and so if left to our human understanding we would follow this line of "inclusion" all the way to to its logical end. Thank God the Church is not merely human.

I think its an interesting testament to Bishop Bruskewitz and the "boy only" policy in Lincoln that Lincoln is leading (per capita) in the number of Priests AND nuns . . . (by the way, just to make it clear, the decision to allow female altar server does not rest only with the bishop, it rests with the priest. An individual pastor can decide not to let girls be Altar Servers and his bishop can do nothing about it.)

Now, BlondewithaBrain, I think you have the whole Church thing upside down.

God doesn't reject girls serving the Altar. God doesn't reject anyone. He also didn't put them there. We did! And maybe, just maybe, we were wrong. This is not a teaching ex cathedra it is a discipline that started in the United States not Rome.

Second, you misunderstand God's call. It doesn't happen regardless of the surroundings a man finds himself in, it happens BECAUSE of the surroundings a man finds himself in. God calls many many men to the priesthood, but so many can't hear the Call because of the things around them. Be that a difficult family situation, or a job that pays well, or a girlfriend they just can't leave . . . a vocation is not an indelible and unavoidable call . . . it is easily avoidable. Maybe the reason we have so few priests is because more boys aren't serving at the altar . . .

[Cure of Ars]

I don’t think that girl’s should be alter servers for two reasons. The first is that is sends a mixed message that one-day women will be priests.

The second is that men are naturally weaker spiritually than women. For some reason it is easier for women to be spiritual. There have been more women saints than men saint. And if you look at who is present at Mass (at least where I am from) there are always more women present. I could continue with these examples but I wont. Men have the need to have responsibilities. We need a special role. We are more task oriented while women are more relationship oriented. Let me use a example. The male role in families has been greatly reduced in the family in our society because men have been told that their role is not essential. That woman can do it on their own and look what happened. We have en epidemic of fatherless ness. Men are presently confused about their role and they do not feel like they are really essential to child rearing. Because of this they do not perticipate and they remain selfish Peter pans. Our society does not really know what a father is. And I believe this trend will continue with alter serving.

With this being said I submit to my present Bishop who allows female alter servers.

[cmotherofpirl]

Absolutely true Cure.

[jasJis]

I haven't read the whole thread, but that ain't stopping me from putting my two cents worth.

At our parish, we have a senior altar server position. It would be a teen or a seminarian. The regular altar servers wear a white robe. The senior altar server wears a black cassock and white surplus. This seems to work out good. Girls and boys can be altar servers, but only males (usually at least 15) are the senior and wear the black cassock. They also direct the other Altar servers. I like this because both males and female children can be altar servers, but only males are "alcolytes" (i don't know if they actually are). It gives females an opportunity to serve, but designates the male has a different role, possible priesthood.

Since we have a school and other nuns at the parish, there are plenty of women religious that also provide a leadership role model for females. The Director of CCD is a woman, The school Principal is a nun, a Director for a pastoral ministry is a nun as well.

Women need to take a greater role in the Church, as all lay persons should. There is a big difference though, between a sacramental service, and service in the other minsitries. Works of mercy are both Spiritual and Corporal. If girls are alllowed to be Altar Servers, some catechesis needs to go with to make sure that it doesn't lead to speculation that women can become priests.

[Good Friday]

Point 1: Can anyone here tell me how many men were at the foot of the cross? How many women? The altar is the foot of the cross, is it not?

Point 2: I find it despicable that you have attacked her faith because she think it's sexist (and it is) to disallow female altar servers, especially since they have been allowed for quite some time. If the Vatican doesn't drive her out of the Church, surely you folks will.

Point 3: Why do boys get preferential treatment? Can you explain this to me based on the Bible rather than the ever-changing teaching of the Church?

Point 4: Someone mentioned that she's lucky to be allowed to receive the Holy Sacrifice of the Altar. Allowed? You're kidding, right? I'm pretty sure that Jesus intended for everyone to be allowed to receive it.

Point 5: Without even going into the issue of Vatican exclusionism, what kind of effect do you think Phatmass exclusionism is having on the Church assembled here? How many do y'all plan to drive out before you've accomplished your goal?

[vianney]

I agree with Jas Jis, The idea of a lead altar server wearing a cassock is a good idea while keeping girls and boys as altar servers. Infact I think that is the best idea i have heard in a long time Jas Jis. If i am ordained i think that is how i will do it.

[Jake Huether]

Point 1:  Can anyone here tell me how many men were at the foot of the cross?  How many women?  The altar is the foot of the cross, is it not?

Point 2:  I find it despicable that you have attacked her faith because she think it's sexist (and it is) to disallow female altar servers, especially since they have been allowed for quite some time.  If the Vatican doesn't drive her out of the Church, surely you folks will.

Point 3:  Why do boys get preferential treatment?  Can you explain this to me based on the Bible rather than the ever-changing teaching of the Church?

Point 4:  Someone mentioned that she's lucky to be allowed to receive the Holy Sacrifice of the Altar.  Allowed?  You're kidding, right?  I'm pretty sure that Jesus intended for everyone to be allowed to receive it. 

Point 5:  Without even going into the issue of Vatican exclusionism, what kind of effect do you think Phatmass exclusionism is having on the Church assembled here?  How many do y'all plan to drive out before you've accomplished your goal?

Why do boys get preferential treatment?

It isn't preferential treatment.

Please don't confuse the issue.

Boys aren't "prefered" over girls.

However, boys become priests. Girls don't.

[jasJis]

Point 1:  Can anyone here tell me how many men were at the foot of the cross?  How many women?  The altar is the foot of the cross, is it not?

Point 2:  I find it despicable that you have attacked her faith because she think it's sexist (and it is) to disallow female altar servers, especially since they have been allowed for quite some time.  If the Vatican doesn't drive her out of the Church, surely you folks will.

Point 3:  Why do boys get preferential treatment?  Can you explain this to me based on the Bible rather than the ever-changing teaching of the Church?

Point 4:  Someone mentioned that she's lucky to be allowed to receive the Holy Sacrifice of the Altar.  Allowed?  You're kidding, right?  I'm pretty sure that Jesus intended for everyone to be allowed to receive it. 

Point 5:  Without even going into the issue of Vatican exclusionism, what kind of effect do you think Phatmass exclusionism is having on the Church assembled here?  How many do y'all plan to drive out before you've accomplished your goal?

Was it something I said??