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a sola scriptura argument


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HomeTeamFamily
Posted

here is a hopefully fresh way of looking at sola scriptura

consider the sentence "I never said you stole money"

everyone knows what all of those words mean by themselves

however consider the following sentences with emphasis

"[i]I[/i]never said you stole money"
--but someone else did

"I never [i]said[/i] you stole money"
--but i thought you did

"I never said [i]you[/i] stole money"
--but i said someone else did

"I never said you [i]stole[/i] money"
--but i said you borrowed it

"I never said you stole [i]money[/i]"
but i said you stole food

see how the different emphasis can change the whole meaning of the sentence?

that is why we need a teaching church who understands, through apostolic succession back to those who knew the writers of the Gospels so intimately, what they meant by what they wrote

goldenchild17
Posted

Yeah, makes sense.

Posted

Ahhh, another Patrick Madrid fan.
He's great.

phatcatholic
Posted

[quote name='Tink' date='Jan 2 2005, 08:04 PM'] Patrick Madrid? [/quote]
yup, patrick madrid ;) he's a popular modern catholic apologist

[url="http://www.surprisedbytruth.com/"][b]check him out[/b][/url]

HomeTeamFamily
Posted

ok ok i admit, that wasnt an original argument, but i still like it because it is simple, and gets the point across very well

im still working on this whole apologetics stuff....work with me here people hehe

Fiat_Voluntas_Tua
Posted

Volo...that is tight...thanks for the interesting view point from Patrick Madrid, i enjoyed it.

Totus Tuus,
Andrew Joseph

phatcatholic
Posted

[quote name='VoloHumilisEsse' date='Jan 3 2005, 03:49 PM'] ok ok i admit, that wasnt an original argument, but i still like it because it is simple, and gets the point across very well

im still working on this whole apologetics stuff....work with me here people hehe [/quote]
its all good bro. personally, i have been influenced greatly by David Armstrong. we all have to start somewhere.

Posted

Madrid and Keating

Kreeft and Hahn

Akin and Armstrong

Sheed and Chesterton

Irenaeus and Martyr

Augustine and Athanasius

Ad infinitum

On the shoulders of giants.

phatcatholic
Posted

[b]Popular Catholic Apologists[/b]
[i][u]David Armstrong[/u][/i]
--[url="http://ic.net/~erasmus/RAZ25.HTM"]Personal Page[/url]
--Homepage: [url="http://ic.net/~erasmus/RAZHOME.HTM"]Biblical Evidence for Catholicism[/url]
--[url="http://ic.net/~erasmus/BOOKS.HTM"]Books by David Armstrong[/url]
--[url="http://www.geocities.com/luisperezbus.rm/"]Works Translated in Spanish[/url]
--[url="http://socrates58.blogspot.com/"]Blog: [i]Cor Ad Cor Loquitur[/i][/url]
--[url="http://ic.net/~erasmus/RAZ43.HTM"]Literary Resume[/url]
[i][u]Hilaire Belloc[/u][/i]
--[url="http://www.catholic.net/Catholic Church/Periodicals/Dossier/1998-05-06/rest.html"]Hilaire Belloc and "All the Rest of It"[/url]
--[url="http://soli.inav.net/~jfischer/feb99/thomasstorck.html"]How to Form a Catholic Mind: Read Belloc[/url]
--[url="http://www.catholiceducation.org/links/jump.cgi?ID=68"]Hilaire Belloc: Defender of the Faith[/url]
--[url="http://rcatholic-l.freeservers.com/belloc.html"]Belloc's Archived Works Online[/url]
--[url="http://www.linkstoliterature.com/belloc.htm"]Links to Literature: Hilaire Belloc[/url]
[i][u]G.K. Chesterton[/u][/i]
--[url="http://www.catholic.net/Catholic Church/Periodicals/Faith/1112-96/literatu.html"]Introduction to G.K. Chesterton[/url]
--[url="http://www.e3mil.com/vm/index.asp?vm_id=6&art_id=6558"]G.K. Chesterton[/url]
--[url="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/listmania/list-browse/-/HILKI8ZODIZP/ref=cm_aya_av.lm_more/103-0518009-0376652"]Top 10 Books About G.K. Chesterton[/url]
--[url="http://www.dur.ac.uk/martin.ward/gkc/books/index.html"]Chesterton's Works Online[/url]
--[url="http://www.chesterton-library.net/index.html"]The G.K. Chesterton Library[/url]
--[url="http://ic.net/~erasmus/RAZ27.HTM"]G.K. Chesterton: The Colossial Genius[/url] ([b]150 works/articles/links[/b])
[i][u]Ronald Knox[/u][/i]
--[url="http://www.catholicexchange.com/vm/index.asp?vm_id=6&art_id=6960"]Ronald Knox[/url]
--[url="http://www.catholicauthors.com/knox.html"]Ronald Knox: Biography[/url]
--[url="http://www.cin.org/liter/belief1.html"][i]Belief of Catholics[/i][/url]
--[url="http://www.cin.org/liter/knoxcreed0.html"][i]Creed in Slow Motion[/i][/url]
--[url="http://ewtn.com/library/ANSWERS/SPIRITUN.HTM"][i]The Essentials of Spiritual Unity[/i][/url]
--[url="http://ewtn.com/library/PRIESTS/PRIESTLY.TXT"][i]The Priestly Life[/i][/url]
--[url="http://www.cin.org/messhope.html"][i]The Messianic Hope[/i][/url]
--[url="http://www.cin.org/liter/knoxepistle.html"][i]The Epistles and Gospels for Sundays and Holydays[/i][/url]
[i][u]Fr. William G. Most[/u][/i]
--[url="http://www.catholicculture.org/docs/most/start.cfm?choice=2"]Complete Biography of Fr. William Most[/url]
--[url="http://www.catholicculture.org/docs/most/start.cfm"]The [i]Most[/i] Theological Collection[/url]
--[url="http://ewtn.com/library/ANSWERS/APOL.ZIP"]The [i]Most[/i] Apologetics Collection[/url] ([b]note:[/b] zip file contains 57 articles)
[i][u]John Henry Cardinal Newman[/u][/i]
--[url="http://www.catholicexchange.com/vm/index.asp?vm_id=6&art_id=6435"]John Henry Cardinal Newman[/url]
--[url="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/listmania/list-browse/-/36J9Q5KPJ30CX/ref=cm_aya_av.lm_more/103-0518009-0376652"]Top 10 Biographical Books About John Henry Newman[/url]
--[url="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/listmania/list-browse/-/WG7RP0OTDIKS/ref=cm_aya_av.lm_more/103-0518009-0376652"]Top 10 Books on The Thought of John Henry Newman[/url]
--[url="http://www.newmanreader.org/index.html"]Newman Reader: His Written Works and His Life[/url]
--[url="http://ic.net/~erasmus/RAZ22.HTM"]Venerable John Henry Cardinal Newman: The "Father" of the Second Vatican Council[/url] ([b]242 works/articles/links[/b])
[i][u]Frank Sheed[/u][/i]
--[url="http://www.crisismagazine.com/march2002/feature3.htm"]Frank Sheed: The Prophet of Hyde Park[/url]
--[url="http://www.catholicexchange.com/vm/index.asp?vm_id=6&art_id=7060"]Frank J. Sheed[/url]
--[url="http://www.catholicculture.org/docs/doc_view.cfm?recnum=1001"][i]Marriage and the Law of God[/i][/url]
--[url="http://www.catholicculture.org/docs/doc_view.cfm?recnum=1002"][i]Marriage Existential[/i][/url]
--[url="http://www.catholicculture.org/docs/doc_view.cfm?recnum=1000"][i]The Nature of Sex and Marriage[/i][/url]
--[url="http://ewtn.com/library/ANSWERS/SHEEDEUC.HTM"][i]The Mass and the Eucharist[/i][/url]
--[url="http://ewtn.com/library/HOMESCHL/CHRCLS.HTM"][i]Christ in the Classroom[/i][/url]
--[url="http://ewtn.com/library/HOMESCHL/TCHREL.HTM"][i]Are We Really Teaching Religion?[/i][/url]
--[url="http://ewtn.com/library/MARRIAGE/MARRIAGE.TXT"][i]Marriage and the Family[/i][/url]
--[url="http://ewtn.com/library/MARRIAGE/NULITY.TXT"][i]Nullity of Marriage[/i][/url]
--[url="http://ewtn.com/library/SPIRIT/MAPLIF.TXT"][i]A Map of Life[/i][/url]
--[url="http://www.columbia.edu/cu/augustine/arch/freelove.html"][i]Freedom to Love[/i][/url] ([b]note:[/b] an exerpt from [i]Society and Sanity[/i])

Posted

[quote][b]personally, i have been influenced greatly by David Armstrong.[/b][/quote]

I love Dave Armstrong. I thoroughly enjoyed his book [i]A Biblical Defense of Catholicism[/i]. ^_^

goldenchild17
Posted

I'm on his website all the time checking stuff out.

Posted

I make a few short posts to his blog every week.

Thanks to a jerk in Newark Airport security, I lost my Biblical Evidence for Catholicism along with two Tenchi Muyo manga. I still have More Biblical Evidence for Catholicism.

phatcatholic
Posted

i really need to get his books........

Posted

He would really appreciate it if you got his books.

:P

You can buy them hard-copy from Amazon for under $40 (with free shipping) or you can get them from his website in Word format. I am not sure which would be of more benefit to him . . . or you.

Posted

[quote name='phatcatholic' date='Jan 4 2005, 04:18 PM'] i really need to get his books........ [/quote]
I just bought his book [i]The Catholic Verses[/i] yesterday. I can' wait to read it! :P

thessalonian
Posted

I like it.

I have always said that the scriptures are written to people who have a certain level of understanding. I just heard some protestants talking about where Eve says that they are not even to touch the tree in the middle of the garden. I was dumfounded at the speculation regarding this verse. Well because it wasn't where God spoke directly to Adam, Eve either made it up or she added to the word of God, or Adam added to God's words. The exmaple I like to use is of my wife telling me to go get milk. The first time she tells me about it she has to tell me the roads to take to get to the store etc. etc. If it were my son she was telling he would have to go through drivers ed and learn to drive, make sure there was gas in the car, etc. etc. But much of that is assumed, i.e. I know how to drive, how to get to the store, approximately how much milk costs so I have sufficient funds at the cash register, etc. etc.. All of this is implied in her words "Honey could you go to the store and get some milk for breakfast". The same with the early Christians. Paul in particular is not giving full doctrinal expositions in every verse. He assumes a certain amount of knowledge and deals with the problems of the early Church.

Blessings

HomeTeamFamily
Posted

interesting proposition indeed!

Posted

[quote]see how the different emphasis can change the whole meaning of the sentence?

that is why we need a teaching church who understands, through apostolic succession back to those who knew the writers of the Gospels so intimately, what they meant by what they wrote [/quote]
I'm sorry I just don't see how the logic follows. Ok, so you can read a sentance and get a different meaning than me. I could logically say that that is why I need to look to the Holy Spirtit for guidance in interpretating and appling the Bible as God's truth in [b]my[/b] life. Thats more direct.
Not saying I'm saying that...just that you made a HUGE jump there.

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