LIFE TEEN

[zealousrap]

[quote name='jmjtina' date='Jul 24 2005, 09:57 PM']
actually, they should have [b]stopped [/b]the Altar Calls. I know Lifeteen issued a public statement that those would stop....what other parishes do on thier own is not only an abuse, but plain disobidience to the Church.


yea well this particular church's priest insisted on continuing the altar call and supposedly got permission from the bishop of their diocese to do so...it stinks cuz the kids in that youth group are by far the strongest teens at their age that I have ever encountered as a group...I guess I'll just pray for them

[jiyoung]

i would so go for a phatmass youth program

[toledo_jesus]

Lifeteen debate...I can feel it trying to claw its way...to the surface...must...fight...

---->

[toledo_jesus]

lifeteen is too much trouble and not enough results. bah to lifeteen, I say. just go to Mass for Pete's sake. A more pointless movement I have yet to find.

oh, and that disobedient priest? exactly why movements like lifeteen which mess with the Mass are dodgy at best. Had they simply left the Mass alone...but now the damage is done. their idiocy is in the hands of disobedient people now, and so their abuses will continue.

edit to say: bring on the Phatmass program!

[Philippe]

[quote name='toledo_jesus' date='Jul 25 2005, 03:25 PM']lifeteen is too much trouble and not enough results.  bah to lifeteen,  I say.  just go to Mass for Pete's sake.  A more pointless movement I have yet to find. 

oh, and that disobedient priest?  exactly why movements like lifeteen which mess with the Mass are dodgy at best.  Had they simply left the Mass alone...but now the damage is done.  their idiocy is in the hands of disobedient people now, and so their abuses will continue.

edit to say:  bring on the Phatmass program!
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um actually if it werent for God through lifeteen i would not be here rigt now, i wouldnt know anything about the Church, i probably wouldnt be going to Mass even weekly and none of my family would either. And i'm only 1 of the 20-30 teens in our lifeteen program that has had the same effect. Did you know that everyday at daily Mass there are at least 5 kids from lifeteen. Not enough results? You have no idea

[toledo_jesus]

[quote name='Philippe' date='Jul 25 2005, 06:32 PM']um actually if it werent for God through lifeteen i would not be here rigt now, i wouldnt know anything about the Church, i probably wouldnt be going to Mass even weekly and none of my family would either. And i'm only 1 of the 20-30 teens in our lifeteen program that has had the same effect. Did you know that everyday at daily Mass there are at least 5 kids from lifeteen. Not enough results? You have no idea
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naturally any good that comes from it is to be celebrated. My point is that the gains don't outweigh the damage done when disobedient people are given the tools to dissent. Maybe your lifeteen program is doing fine, but what about that one disobedient priest? he's one too many when we're talking about the Mass here. Surely we agree on that?
I merely postulate that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. You can't vindicate all of Lifeteen with your personal experience...the program needs to be assessed as a whole, including lasting damage such as priests who like altar calls.

[lifeteenchick527]

[quote name='toledo_jesus' date='Jul 25 2005, 04:24 PM']naturally any good that comes from it is to be celebrated.  My point is that the gains don't outweigh the damage done when disobedient people are given the tools to dissent.  Maybe your lifeteen program is doing fine, but what about that one disobedient priest?  he's one too many when we're talking about the Mass here.  Surely we agree on that? 
I merely postulate that if it ain't broke, don't fix it.  You can't vindicate all of Lifeteen with your personal experience...the program needs to be assessed as a whole, including lasting damage such as priests who like altar calls.
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i have to say ive had pretty close to the same experience as philippe through lifeteen...

but as a whole i think that it is a great program; ive met mmmannnyy people in the international lifeteen who wouldnt be going to Mass or wouldnt be Catholic in the first place... i know two people personally who are becoming Catholic b/c they had friends who told them how awesome lifeteen was and invited them to come to Mass with them, and now even when they cant make it to our lifeteen Mass, they go to other Masses...and they r being bapitized into the Faith at the Easter Vigil this coming Easter... b/c they realize how important the Mass in and of itself truly is and the amazing miracle at the Mass. Also i know that i would nvr have learned as much about my faith if it wasnt for lifeteen


God Bless
LTC

[toledo_jesus]

[quote name='lifeteenchick527' date='Jul 25 2005, 09:04 PM']i have to say ive had pretty close to the same experience as philippe through lifeteen...

but as a whole i think that it is a great program; ive met mmmannnyy people in the international lifeteen who wouldnt be going to Mass or wouldnt be Catholic in the first place... i know two people personally who are becoming Catholic b/c they had friends who told them how awesome lifeteen was and invited them to come to Mass with them, and now even when they cant make it to our lifeteen Mass, they go to other Masses...and they r being bapitized into the Faith at the Easter Vigil this coming Easter... b/c they realize how important the Mass in and of itself truly is and the amazing miracle at the Mass. Also i know that i would nvr have learned as much about my faith if it wasnt for lifeteen
God Bless
LTC
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more good things, but still your personal experience. I imagine it would be difficult to get stats on the kind of info we would need to make a critical assessment of Lifeteen.

[LiL Kat Said]

[quote name='Philippe' date='Jul 25 2005, 05:32 PM']um actually if it werent for God through lifeteen i would not be here rigt now, i wouldnt know anything about the Church, i probably wouldnt be going to Mass even weekly and none of my family would either. And i'm only 1 of the 20-30 teens in our lifeteen program that has had the same effect. Did you know that everyday at daily Mass there are at least 5 kids from lifeteen. Not enough results? You have no idea
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amen.
and
DITTO!!!

I think that God is alot happier about all the people lifeteen has brought back to him than something like some mistakes that lifeteen MADE *past tense* they have recognized the mistakes like alter calls etc. and fixed them. Maybe some parishes havn't but lifeteen told them to, so that is that parish's fault!

[toledo_jesus]

[quote name='LiL Kat Said' date='Jul 25 2005, 09:24 PM']amen.
and
DITTO!!!

I think that God is alot happier about all the people lifeteen has brought back to him than something like some mistakes that lifeteen MADE *past tense* they have recognized the mistakes like alter calls etc. and fixed them. Maybe some parishes havn't but lifeteen told them to, so that is that parish's fault!
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yes, but they were introduced to the parish through Lifeteen, rendering Lifeteen somewhat culpable. if they hadn't messed around with the Mass, those things wouldn't have been done, and so they would not still be done by those disobedient to Lifeteen itself. I agree God is happy about the people who have come to Him through the program...but I maintain that we have a better Mass already.

[photosynthesis]

[quote name='Oik' date='Jun 27 2005, 04:40 PM']Life Teen is very Charismatic (which isn't bad).
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is it charismatic or just contemporary?

i think there's a difference. when i hear Charismatic, I think of a lot of emphasis on the Holy Spirit, and very into mysticism, and the gifts and fruits of the Spirit, etc

I don't have too much experience with LifeTeen, but to me they don't seem charismatic, but just contemporary, i.e. they use P+W at Mass (which isn't in and of itself charismatic) and they gather around the altar during the consecration. That is non-traditional, but not necessarily charismatic, unless the liturgy includes other charismatic elements.

[kateri05]

[quote name='toledo_jesus' date='Jul 25 2005, 07:22 PM']more good things, but still your personal experience.  I imagine it would be difficult to get stats on the kind of info we would need to make a critical assessment of Lifeteen.
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i have some to add to that critical assesment : i don't deny that there are teens who really get a lot out of LIFETEEN but... it tends to breed.... problems.

[littleflower+JMJ]

praying for your youth ministry mike!!

[jgirl]

[quote name='kateri05' date='Jul 26 2005, 01:25 AM']i have some to add to that critical assesment :  i don't deny that there are teens who really get a lot out of LIFETEEN but... it tends to breed.... problems.
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And vocations...

And a devotion to the Eucharist...

[toledo_jesus]

[quote name='jgirl' date='Jul 26 2005, 08:05 AM']And vocations...

And a devotion to the Eucharist...
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again, the good that comes from it is awesome...but the problems that have arisen are in a word inexcusable. As in, no amount of vocations will make up for the fact that Lifeteen screwed up and now their former adherents are refusing to get in line with Lifeteen itself and perpetuating the errors Lifeteen should never have made in the first place. Inexcusable.

[lifeteenchick527]

i can see how u mite feel... but (a) at urparish did u havelifeteen... and if u did, did u ever go to lifeteen... and (b) this is stilll a relatively new program (we just celebrated the 20th anniversary this past may (mybday weekend : ) ), iam sure other groups had their moments of not being great as a whole and all... we made some mistakes while we were "growingup" just like anyone else would... and i think the good that comes out of it is truly the most amazing thing ever

God Bless
LTC

[toledo_jesus]

I'm in Richmond VA diocese and we didn't have Lifeteen at my parish. I'm sure it was somewhere though.
you're missing the point. Lifeteen is 20 years old, and in that 20 year period they instituted liturgical innovations which have since been officially declared illicit. But, the problem is that now, for the past 20 years we have had these things going on and so now *some* people have refused to stop making the mistakes. That is the problem. One single instance of this is unacceptable. But now some lifeteen kids are growing up with this garbage and are victims of the disobedience of their current leaders and the innovation of the past leaders of the movement. So it won't die with Lifeteen saying "oops, we goofed. Quit doing what we said for the last 20 years."
It may be all frocks and jollies now that the official organization has tried to clean up, but their damaging innovations will be a problem as long as there are disobedient members of the laity and the priesthood who seek to personalize the Mass for a particular age group.

[kateri05]

i would argue that a true devotion to the Eucharist would not include the liturgical abuses that i have seen committed that have NOTHING to do with the altar thingy, not to mention all around bad attitudes people in my parish involved seem to have

[Philippe]

toledo what do you want them to do, its called forgiveness and we move on. They made mistakes but its not worth shutting down the program for past errors while its still producing good.

[lifeteenchick527]

ditto wat philippe said
i couldnt have said it better

God Bless
LTC