Lord's Day

[Semperviva]

[i]Dies Domini[/i] by John Paul may give you some ideas or at least inspiration.

[mulls]

[quote name='Brother Adam' date='Jul 10 2005, 06:04 PM']mulls,

I'm speaking about things outside of worship (or a community service in your case).
[/quote]



I know. You threw out a generic protestant jab so I countered. That's all.


and what do you mean by community service in my case?

Edited July 11, 2005 by mulls

[Fides_et_Ratio]

[quote name='Oik' date='Jul 10 2005, 07:26 PM']Hahaha!

I thought this thread was about the "quasi-sacrmental" practice by households at Franciscan University of Steubenville!
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[/quote]

[mulls]

since I am a procrastinator by nature, during school I would always wait until Sunday night to do my homework for Monday. and because of that i would always be anxious all Sunday long because I knew I had stuff hanging over my head. to remedy this I tried to follow a friend's lead and implement a full 24 hour sabbath, starting Saturday night around 8 or so. This way I would relax, have leisure time, and be able to focus on the Lord for a full 24 hours, and wouldn't allow myself to worry about anything else until the 'sabbath' was over, 8pm Sunday night.

I'm not disciplined so this didn't really have the total desired affect, but it did help somewhat, and I have friends who it works great for. Maybe this helps.

[Semperviva]

[quote name='Oik' date='Jul 10 2005, 06:26 PM']Hahaha!

I thought this thread was about the "quasi-sacrmental" practice by households at Franciscan University of Steubenville!
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[/quote]
lol, uuuh, are you saying this is a bad thing???? there nothing wrong with breaking bread, drinking wine and saying prayers together at the table...and there are thousands of catholics around the world who say them, not just at steubie..

[IcePrincessKRS]

haha Well, when I first started reading this thread I contemplated moving it because it wasn't a debate.... but not I'm not so sure...

Oh yeah, my Sunday's sound alot like HSMom's. Sometimes we go to the grocery store together as a family, too, and its easier because Matt is there to help, and its fun because we're together. We also like to go to parks and cemetarys to take walks.

Edited July 11, 2005 by IcePrincessKRS

[homeschoolmom]

I love Sunday...

[Oik]

[quote]lol, uuuh, are you saying this is a bad thing???? there nothing wrong with breaking bread, drinking wine and saying prayers together at the table...and there are thousands of catholics around the world who say them, not just at steubie..[/quote]

I'd like to know where else this happens. When I inquired about the practice, I was told that is was an adaptation of a common practice among appalacion (sp!) protestants.

Now, this certainly is problematic. It is akin to "healing" Mass where healing prayers are offered to those suffering "emotional" or "spitiual" problems. In this Masses, the real Sacrament of healing, the Sacrament of Confession/Penance, is completely ignored. Instead, it is substituted with prayers and the use of holy oil anoitings. It is also a quasi-sacramental fabrication. Many catholics throughout the US have these "healing" Masses.

Does that make it right?

There is something very questionable about having a psuedo-representation of the Mass. It just promulgates that attitude of the Mass as abanquet (the Mass is the Sacrifice). It also perpetuates poor theological formation by placing the emphasis of theologies on the wrong things (for instance, the Lords Prayer as a communal expression, not a prayer, the altar being refered to as a table and not what is it, an altar, the lose of the Sanctuary which has now been reduced to just the altar, ect, ect.)

The Church has so many beautiful devoations, why create one (or use ione that has it's roots in protestant practice?)

It is also beyond me why anyone would partake in a "lord's day" celebration at a Catholic University when Mass is available several time a day, seven days a week. You've got the real thing, why farce it?


The Lord's Day is a major reason why I won't join a household at Steubenville.

[photosynthesis]

[quote name='Oik' date='Jul 12 2005, 03:05 AM']The Lord's Day is a major reason why I won't join a household at Steubenville.
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[/quote]
what's a household? is that like a sorority house? or do you live with alumnae/professors?

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='photosynthesis' date='Jul 12 2005, 06:51 AM']what's a household?  is that like a sorority house?  or do you live with alumnae/professors?
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[/quote]
Click the link below:

[url="http://www.franciscan.edu/home2/Content/Campuslife/reslife/main.aspx?id=111"][u]Franciscan University Household Life[/u][/url]

[Quietfire]

[quote name='mulls' date='Jul 11 2005, 12:25 AM']since I am a procrastinator by nature, during school I would always wait until Sunday night to do my homework for Monday. and because of that i would always be anxious all Sunday long because I knew I had stuff hanging over my head. to remedy this I tried to follow a friend's lead and implement a full 24 hour sabbath, starting Saturday night around 8 or so. This way I would relax, have leisure time, and be able to focus on the Lord for a full 24 hours, and wouldn't allow myself to worry about anything else until the 'sabbath' was over, 8pm Sunday night.

I'm not disciplined so this didn't really have the total desired affect, but it did help somewhat, and I have friends who it works great for. Maybe this helps.
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[/quote]

Sounds nice but it doesnt end 8 pm. Maybe thats why it didnt really work for you.

[photosynthesis]

interesting...so do households live in apartments together and share expenses, or is it just a group of people who live on the same floor? is everyone at Steubenville living in households? it sounds like a Catholic parallel universe.

[Semperviva]

[quote name='Oik' date='Jul 12 2005, 01:05 AM']I'd like to know where else this happens. When I inquired about the practice, I was told that is was an adaptation of a common practice among appalacion (sp!) protestants.

Now, this certainly is problematic. It is akin to "healing" Mass where healing prayers are offered to those suffering "emotional" or "spitiual" problems. In this Masses, the real Sacrament of healing, the Sacrament of Confession/Penance, is completely ignored. Instead, it is substituted with prayers and the use of holy oil anoitings. It is also a quasi-sacramental fabrication. Many catholics throughout the US have these "healing" Masses.

Does that make it right?

There is something very questionable about having a psuedo-representation of the Mass. It just promulgates that attitude of the Mass as abanquet (the Mass is the Sacrifice). It also perpetuates poor theological formation by placing the emphasis of theologies on the wrong things (for instance, the Lords Prayer as a communal expression, not a prayer, the altar being refered to as a table and not what is it, an altar, the lose of the Sanctuary which has now been reduced to just the altar, ect, ect.)

The Church has so many beautiful devoations, why create one (or use ione that has it's roots in protestant practice?)

[b]It is also beyond me why anyone would partake in a "lord's day" celebration at a Catholic University when Mass is available several time a day, seven days a week. You've got the real thing, why farce it?[/b]
The Lord's Day is a major reason why I won't join a household at Steubenville.
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[/quote]


You cannot compare it to a healing mass...You heard it was Appalchian protestant practise...it may be... Hmmmm, sounds a little strange. However, even it was Protestant I don't see anything wrong with adapting or seeing an idea and then making it Catholic all around- thats what tradition and Catholic culture is, it comes from non-Catholic even pagan culture being restored in Christ to the fullness of truth---Lords Day is a tradition which does not perpetuate poor theological formation as you claim. I grew up doing this every Saturday evening in my family. We would dress up, not [i]as[/i] nicely as for Mass, but nice, my sister and I used to set a table place for Jesus at the table, Dad would read chapter one of John's Gospel and lead other psalm prayers which we reponded to, which is a totally Catholic thing and seems way more jewish in its format than Protestant. We in no way saw it as a pseudo-Mass, ersatz liturgy, etc etc-No...it was family communal prayer in preperation for the Lord's Day...it is in no way replacing the Mass. Your questions seems to be asking why pray outside of Mass at all, since Lord day is only meant to increase your disposition towards the liturgy the next morning...it in no way replaces the mass but only helps prepare your heart for the real thing......where we pray ......"we look for the day when we will dwell with you.....we wait in joyful hope for the coming of our Savior, Jesus Christ"

ps-we always understood this was NOT mass, not the eucharist, but breaking bread together is a symbol of that communion, is all...

Edited July 12, 2005 by Semperviva

[p0lar_bear]

[quote name='Oik' date='Jul 12 2005, 03:05 AM']I'd like to know where else this happens. When I inquired about the practice, I was told that is was an adaptation of a common practice among appalacion (sp!) protestants.

Now, this certainly is problematic. It is akin to "healing" Mass where healing prayers are offered to those suffering "emotional" or "spitiual" problems. In this Masses, the real Sacrament of healing, the Sacrament of Confession/Penance, is completely ignored. Instead, it is substituted with prayers and the use of holy oil anoitings. It is also a quasi-sacramental fabrication. Many catholics throughout the US have these "healing" Masses.

Does that make it right?

There is something very questionable about having a psuedo-representation of the Mass. It just promulgates that attitude of the Mass as abanquet (the Mass is the Sacrifice). It also perpetuates poor theological formation by placing the emphasis of theologies on the wrong things (for instance, the Lords Prayer as a communal expression, not a prayer, the altar being refered to as a table and not what is it, an altar, the lose of the Sanctuary which has now been reduced to just the altar, ect, ect.)

The Church has so many beautiful devoations, why create one (or use ione that has it's roots in protestant practice?)

It is also beyond me why anyone would partake in a "lord's day" celebration at a Catholic University when Mass is available several time a day, seven days a week. You've got the real thing, why farce it?
The Lord's Day is a major reason why I won't join a household at Steubenville.
[right][snapback]640546[/snapback][/right]
[/quote]

Actually, it is an adaptation of the Jewish meal liturgies (the caburrah (sp?) or friendship meal, which is less formal than the Seder meal used at Passover and on other major feasts). Just as the caburrah was not a replacement for Temple sacrifice or even Synagogue worship, the Lord's Day celebration is not a replacement for, much less an imitation of, Mass. It is a preparation for Mass, the opening of the Lord's Day (which is why they are held on Saturday evening), a time for community, and a time for prayer. The main part of it is a Liturgy of the Word, which is a perfectly allowable (even encouraged) para-liturgical rite for meditation on Scripture outside of Mass. The breaking of the bread and passing of the wine is in imitation of the Jewish celebration.

No one is going to say that it is Mass, or that you should go to Lord's Day instead of Mass. Since it in no way portends to be a sacrament, it is a para-liturgical event, not "quasi-sacramental."

There is nothing liturgically or theologically wrong with the Lord's Day celebrations.

[photosynthesis]

are you allowed to drink wine at Steubenville Lord's Day celebrations if you're underage?

[p0lar_bear]

[quote name='photosynthesis' date='Jul 12 2005, 02:13 PM']are you allowed to drink wine at Steubenville Lord's Day celebrations if you're underage?
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I'm not sure if there has ever been anything officially said either way, but yes. Though I want to point out that I don't think you can really see them as an opportunity for underage drinking. For the most part, no one would have more than a swallow or two. With the possible exception of groups who were already known for their drinking (underage or otherwise), I don't recall ever hearing of anyone having enough to get even remotely buzzed.

[scardella]

In my 4 years there, nobody that I'd ever talked to ever gave any sort of indication that they or anyone else thought or was tempted to think that this was a sacrament, that it took away from the Mass, that it replaced the Mass or fulfulled your sunday obligations. Many people there would attend saturday morning Mass, go to Lord's Day later on saturday and go to Mass on sunday.

In my experience, it improved the experience of the Mass, simply because I had already heard the readings, and my household had collectively reflected on it. I felt that on sunday, my retention of the readings was much better and, moreso, my understanding of it was much better.

[i]"To the attack, therefore to the offensive! Hail Holy Queen!"[/i]

[scardella]

[quote name='photosynthesis' date='Jul 12 2005, 10:42 AM']interesting...so do households live in apartments together and share expenses, or is it just a group of people who live on the same floor?  is everyone at Steubenville living in  households?  it sounds like a Catholic parallel universe.
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Oftentimes, a household will have a house or apartment off campus, but only seniors usually are allowed to live off campus. Most household members will live on a particular wing of a dorm. Their "common room" (a lounge on the wing) will usually have household-specific decorations or memorabilia, eg. a household banner, perhaps a mural, pictures of members, etc. along with devional stuff, eg. a household crucifix, statue of the patron saint, etc.

[mulls]

[quote name='Quietfire' date='Jul 12 2005, 10:03 AM']Sounds nice but it doesnt end 8 pm.  Maybe thats why it didnt really work for you.
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[/quote]



that's why i started it Saturday night at 8 pm....to have a full 24 hours. Then at 8pm on Sunday night I could go back to working and such.

[Quietfire]

[quote name='mulls' date='Jul 13 2005, 02:08 PM']that's why i started it Saturday night at 8 pm....to have a full 24 hours. Then at 8pm on Sunday night I could go back to working and such.
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Mulls, a day is from midnight to midnight. Not 8 pm to 8 pm.