theological viewpoints and rituals...

[Aloysius]

so this question of east/west marriage viewpoints has been troubling me... because well, I've sort of come to the eastern viewpoint that since Christ elevated marriage to a sacrament, it is actually administered by the priest. but then, I still don't understand how one views marriages where the couple believes they are administering it to each other.

anyway, so say at my own marriage, I'm still very Roman in most other aspects... still quite Thomistic in theology and traditional roman to the point of loving the Tridentine Mass in ritual... but my theological viewpoint has become that the priest administers the sacrament of marriage...

how does one go abouut syncronizing this? must I, to remain Roman Rite, ascribe to this view of marriage? should I seek some special way to have a marriage liturgy in an Eastern Rite church whilst still remaining Roman Rite? can a Roman Rite priest preside over a nuptial mass not as witness but as administrator of the sacrament?



and where's Apothoun when you need him?

[Laudate_Dominum]

I'm not going to pretend it is a simple matter, but it is something I have given a bit of thought to in the past.
My opinion is similar, I think the necessity of a the priestly ministry for the Sacrament is necessary, but you still cannot have a valid marriage without mutual consent. So the simplistic version of my answer would be that all three persons involved are required. It is "three to get married" as the saying goes. The couple, and the priest who stands In Persona Christi.
But I do not doubt the possibility that Christ could stand in and confer His Grace upon a marriage between Catholics who were unable to be married by a priest.
But this should not minimize the necessity of the priest. If you look at statements of the Church, marriage without a priest is harshly condemned. My theory is more like baptism of desire. Christ is not bound by the Sacraments.

[cappie]

From the Code of Canon Law:

[b]Can. 1055 §1 The marriage covenant, by which a man and a woman establish between themselves a partnership of their whole life, and which of its own very nature is ordered to the well-being of the spouses and to the procreation and upbringing of children, has, between the baptised, been raised by Christ the Lord to the dignity of a sacrament[/b].

§2 Consequently, a valid marriage contract cannot exist between baptised persons without its being by that very fact a sacrament.

Can. 1056 The essential properties of marriage are unity and indissolubility; in christian marriage they acquire a distinctive firmness by reason of the sacrament.

Can. 1057 §1 A marriage is brought into being by the lawfully manifested consent of persons who are legally capable. This consent cannot be supplied by any human power.

§2 Matrimonial consent is an act of will by which a man and a woman by an irrevocable covenant mutually give and accept one another for the purpose of establishing a marriage.

Can. 1058 All can contract marriage who are not prohibited by law.

Can. 1059 The marriage of catholics, even if only one party is baptised, is governed not only by divine law but also by canon law, without prejudice to the competence of the civil authority in respect of the merely civil effects of the marriage.

[b]Can. 1108 §1 Only those marriages are valid which are contracted in the presence of the local Ordinary or parish priest or of the priest or deacon delegated by either of them, who, in the presence of two witnesses, assists, [/b]in accordance however with the rules set out in the following canons, and without prejudice to the exceptions mentioned in cann. 144, 1112 §1, 1116 and 1127 §§2 - 3.

§2 [b]Only that person who, being present, asks the contracting parties to manifest their consent and in the name of the Church receives it, is understood to assist at a marriage[/b].

Can. 1109 Within the limits of their territory, the local Ordinary and the parish priest by virtue of their office validly assist at the marriages not only of their subjects, but also of non-subjects, provided one or other of the parties is of the latin rite. They cannot assist if by sentence or decree they have been excommunicated, placed under interdict or suspended from office, or been declared to be such.

Can. 1110 A personal Ordinary and a personal parish priest by virtue of their office validly assist, within the confines of their jurisdiction, at the marriages only of those of whom at least one party is their subject.

Can. 1111 §1 As long as they validly hold office, the local Ordinary and the parish priest can delegate to priests and deacons the faculty, even the general faculty, to assist at marriages within the confines of their territory.

§2 In order that the delegation of the faculty to assist at marriages be valid, it must be expressly given to specific persons; if there is question of a special delegation, it is to be given for a specific marriage; if however there is question of a general delegation, it is to be given in writing.

Can. 1112 §1 Where there are no priests and deacons, the diocesan Bishop can delegate lay persons to assist at marriages, if the Episcopal Conference has given its prior approval and the permission of the Holy See has been obtained.

Therefore, from a canonical point of view the priest or deacon receives the consent to the marriage of the persons on behalf of the church.

[Laudate_Dominum]

Exactly Cappie.

I used to hold that the difference between East and West on this subject is a matter of emphasis. But from the small amount of research that I've done this seems to be a problematic perspective. However, despite the complexities involved I tend to believe that it holds true in the end.

And please excuse the sloppiness and tautological character of my first post.