Immigration and the Constitution Party

[SarahB]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Oct 1 2005, 09:57 PM']I've got more, but let's discuss this ... ooo, yeah, and Sarah, I'm simply [i]dying[/i] to know exactly what benefits immigrants, legal or illegal, are getting that poor Americans can't get.

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Sorry, just saw this.


Health benefits, for one. My best friend's husbands family is here from Puerto Rico. They can get health benefits for nothing, but I can't. And I'm $6,000 below poverty level. His sister's family makes in excess of $50,000 a year and they can get all the medical attention, perscriptions, etc that they want. Poverty level for a family of 3 is somewhere around $32,000 here in Pennsylvania. They make well over that, yet qualify for free benefits. I make well under poverty level for one person, and I can't get anything. Trust me, I've tried. And the only thing I can qualify for through the state is nearly $250 dollars a month. Not something I can afford.


I'm not saying we should toss all these people out of the country and leave them out in the street to starve. What I am saying is that we can't take care of our own. Why should we be trusted with anyone else? And why should we let those who have come here illegally suddenly become legal when there are so many trying to get in here the right way?

[Socrates]

[quote name='SarahB' date='Oct 3 2005, 08:21 PM']Sorry, just saw this.
Health benefits, for one. My best friend's husbands family is here from Puerto Rico. They can get health benefits for nothing, but I can't. And I'm $6,000 below poverty level. His sister's family makes in excess of $50,000 a year and they can get all the medical attention, perscriptions, etc that they want. Poverty level for a family of 3 is somewhere around $32,000 here in Pennsylvania. They make well over that, yet qualify for free benefits. I make well under poverty level for one person, and I can't get anything. Trust me, I've tried. And the only thing I can qualify for through the state is nearly $250 dollars a month. Not something I can afford.
I'm not saying we should toss all these people out of the country and leave them out in the street to starve. What I am saying is that we can't take care of our own. Why should we be trusted with anyone else? And why should we let those who have come here illegally suddenly become legal when there are so many trying to get in here the right way?
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Good points.

[popestpiusx]

[quote name='Socrates' date='Oct 3 2005, 09:04 PM']In a word, no.

This may be how you (and politically correct "multi-cultural" liberals) view our national identify, but it's not how I identify America, nor was it how America's founder's identified it! 

You will find absolutely nothing in the U.S. Constitution or any of the founding documents identifying "diversity" as a founding principle of our nation!  (Nor will you find anything identifying "diversity" as a national principle until around the mid-twentieth century.)
(If anything, historically, America has erred towards xenophobia more than to an active promotion of "diversity," but that's another debate topic.)

In the past times of heavy immigration from Europe in the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries, immigrants were agressively "Americanized."  They had to be learn English as well as American history, and express loyalty to American ideals.  Some may disagree with this practice, but this is historical fact.
And numbers of immigrants were proportionately lower than today, and they were mostly from European Christian countries.

An unchecked influx of people from another culture will vastly erode or change the original culture.  This is a simple fact, not a value judgment.
I am not arguing that all immigration is bad, but simply that there should be stronger limits on it, and especially that illegal immigration be cracked down on.

"Diversity" is not a fundamental American principle, nor is it an unqualified good in itself.  "Diversity" has become an almost meaningless liberal buzzword, used to promote everything from unchecked immigration, to affirmative action programs, to "gay rights."  (And God forbid that anyone oppose "diversity"!)

I realize people will attack me falsely as being racist or xenophobic, but my point is that immigration should have limits, not that all immigrants are "bad." 
While I am open to intelligent arguments against my position, appealing to "diversity" will carry absolutely no weight with me!  I am not a "multi-culturalist."
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All very true.

[popestpiusx]

By the way, I support the Constitution Party. I voted Peroutka in the last election.

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='SarahB' date='Oct 3 2005, 08:21 PM']Health benefits, for one. My best friend's husbands family is here from Puerto Rico. [right][snapback]745121[/snapback][/right]
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Puerto Rico is a commonwealth of the US. Puerto Ricans are US citizens.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' date='Oct 4 2005, 06:59 AM']Puerto Rico is a commonwealth of the US. Puerto Ricans are US citizens.
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Yep. Puerto Rico is actually in a pretty cushy position -- don't have to pay federal taxes, but can avail themselves of federal benefits.

But they don't count as immigrants. If I remember right (and I don't have time to look this up right now) the U.S. has seven territories including Puerto Rico, Guam, the U.S. Virgin Islands, and others I can't remember off the top.

[Jaime]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Oct 4 2005, 07:57 AM']

. If I remember right (and I don't have time to look this up right now) the U.S. has seven territories including Puerto Rico, Guam, the U.S. Virgin Islands, and others I can't remember off the top.
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I think one is Indiana

[Sojourner]

I only wish I didn't have to pay federal taxes. My life would be a lot less complicated.

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Oct 4 2005, 07:57 AM']Yep. Puerto Rico is actually in a pretty cushy position -- don't have to pay federal taxes, but can avail themselves of federal benefits.
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True. But they can't vote in federal elections.

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='hot stuff' date='Oct 4 2005, 08:03 AM']I think one is Indiana
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I thought Ohio annexed Indiana...

[Sojourner]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' date='Oct 4 2005, 08:12 AM']True. But they can't vote in federal elections.
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There is that.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' date='Oct 4 2005, 08:13 AM']I thought Ohio annexed Indiana...
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There has been no annexation of Indiana that I know of. Perhaps we'll find out about it later today, though ...

[SarahB]

My bad. But the fact remains that I could point out that same situation in 2 other families I know. Both not from this country. Both making more than I do. And both getting benefits that I can't get. Or my mom for that matter. Once my dad died and my mom became a widow, *poof* We lost his income so we can't afford to go to the doctor or get medicine, but she makes too much to get any benefits because she works and gets money from Social Security from my dad.

But anyway.... there have been attempts in the past for Puerto Rico to be self governing. Attempts made by the Puerto Rican officials. I think they ought to be self governed. There's no reason we should have any control over them, Guam, etc except that now they're probably so dependant on us that it would be difficult to leave them alone.

And I looked into it a little bit, just quickly. Basically, they're citizens, but they don't enjoy all the benefits and rights. Also, the Supreme Court ruled that the relationship with an unincorporated commonwealth(such as Puerto Rico would be since they are a commonwealth but do not have statehood) should be temporary. We should either make them a state, or let them out on their own. They can't vote in our Presidential elections, and the right to vote is supposed to be right up there with breathing. Yet, they are not allowed. Basically, they're second class citizens. We'll let them be called citizens, but we won't allow them to make any decisions. They don't have any real representation in the Senate or the House, they can't vote for President.....some form of citizenship. They need to get themselves a Patrick Henry.

[homeschoolmom]

Never mind. Changed my mind.