Ils sont fous ces anglais!

[Didacus]

[url="http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_1594383.html"]http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_1594383.html[/url]


Anyone else here about this? More brits believe in ghosts than brits believe in God... I can't think of much sadder statistics.


Hence, as Obelix would say: "Ils sont fous ces anglais!".

(ie; they're crazy thems englishmen... It's a recurring joke in a popular french comic strip called "Asterix et Obelix where Obelix would call the romans crazy all the time)

Edited November 3, 2005 by Didacus

[tojo]

How is it possible to believe in ghosts but not in God or gods?

Edited November 3, 2005 by tomasio127

[zabbazooey]

Very, very sad statistics.

[Didacus]

[quote name='tomasio127' date='Nov 3 2005, 02:17 PM']How is it possible to believe in ghosts but not in God or gods?
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Atheists can claim what they like, but their stand on life is based on illogical presumptions. I would almost respect a satanist before I respect an atheist (almost), because at least the satanist believes in 'something' other than themselves. And some atheists are almost as bad as satanists.

[sweetpea316]

Boo on that.

[jgirl]

[quote name='sweetpea316' date='Nov 3 2005, 02:42 PM']Boo on that. 
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Was that an intentional pun?

[jezic]

that is not good, but europe has some problems with faith that need working on.

[Dreamweaver]

Well, the poll doesn't seem very serious. The sample size was only 2,000 people, and the polling company is an entertainment retailer. Who knows what the age and other demographics are.

Although, Britain especially has a huge population of New Agers.

[Guest T-Bone]

[quote name='Didacus' date='Nov 3 2005, 01:34 PM']Atheists can claim what they like, but their stand on life is based on illogical presumptions.  I would almost respect a satanist before I respect an atheist (almost), because at least the satanist believes in 'something' other than themselves.  And some atheists are almost as bad as satanists.
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Most Satanists beleive in God. They just think that Satan will serve them better. (The whole penthouse in Hell vs. basement studio apartment in Heaven thing). Atheists beleive in only themselvs...its a sad existance, no wonder so many of them are unpleasant.

[Cow of Shame]

[quote name='T-Bone' date='Nov 3 2005, 04:46 PM']Atheists beleive in only themselvs...its a sad existance, no wonder so many of them are unpleasant.
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i've only known a couple of athiests, and they were very pleasant people...i guess if all you have is what is here on earth, it can make just as much sense to treat people with kindness as to be out for #1

Edited November 3, 2005 by Cow of Shame

[Veridicus]

That's quite possibly the saddest statistic I've ever read. Although we must keep something in mind. Anyone can conduct a survery and 'prove' just about 'anything.' The results of a survey like this can be heavily inconclusive. I mean there are hundreds of ways of asking a question and each can imply a specific response... I think I remember spending a class period in high school sociology about the importance of respectable empirical studies. This obviously isn't one...

"Just over three quarters, (76%) said that reality TV shows and films like The Blair Witch Project have helped convince them spooks and ghouls really exist."

This is a quote from the article posted above...As far as I'm concerned, if 76% of the people in the survey say that REALITY TV and 'The Blair Witch' convinced them that ghosts exist...I wouldn't really count on these people or this survey to do justice to how many Britans actually believe in God (or ghosts and the toothfairy for that matter). Perhaps if we had a SURVIVOR Vatican City, then 76% of these people in the survey would start acknowledging God!

[tojo]

[quote name='Veridicus' date='Nov 3 2005, 05:19 PM']Perhaps if we had a SURVIVOR Vatican City, then 76% of these people in the survey would start acknowledging God! 
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Survivor Vatican City! I'll audition to be in that! Well, maybe the Real World: Vatican City, I don't want to be naked huddling around a fire eating rats in San Pietro.

[ardillacid]

[quote name='Cow of Shame' date='Nov 3 2005, 05:04 PM']i've only known a couple of athiests, and they were very pleasant people...i guess if all you have is what is here on earth, it can make just as much sense to treat people with kindness as to be out for #1
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If I didn't believe in God i would not be a very nice person THeere would be [i]no[/i] reason to treat prople kindly

[Cow of Shame]

[quote name='ardillacid' date='Nov 4 2005, 01:48 PM']THeere would be [i]no[/i] reason to treat prople kindly
[/quote]

I can see it going both ways...if our humanity, and this life, is all we have, you can argue that we should cherish it above all else. Of course, if this is it, and there are no eternal repercussions to our actions, then have at it. Although, I'd have to wonder about you if the only thing keeping you from being a right bastard was that you were concerned about hell....

Edited November 4, 2005 by Cow of Shame

[Didacus]

[quote name='Cow of Shame' date='Nov 4 2005, 04:03 PM'][snip]

I'd have to wonder about you if the only thing keeping you from being a right bastard was that you were concerned about hell....
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Now now, CoS, I've heard this argument many times before and I would expect a littel better from you.

What is meant here is htat in the absence of a higher power, there is no inner turth, or spirituality. Although one can find a multitude of arguments towards being 'nice' towards one-another in an atheistic context, none of these arguments would reach the genuine goodness of spirituality which stems from a belief in a higher power. I trust you are wise enough to see my point.

Many times it has been posted that fear of hell is the beginning of wisdom.

Also, being 'nice' to an atheist will always work for so long as it will provide a mutual benefit; ie, the idea of self sacrifice is gone. Self sacrifice is the highest 'niceness' that can be personified within humanity if you want to put it in lame terms.



There are disctint differences between the 'nice' of a God fearing man, and the 'nice' of an atheist, and between the two, anyone who has genuinely explored both facets will admit that the 'niceness' of the atheist is the sum of a moral midget's mumblings compared to the 'niceness' of the God fearing man.




Bakc to you Bob...

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Cow of Shame' date='Nov 4 2005, 04:03 PM']I can see it going both ways...if our humanity, and this life, is all we have, you can argue that we should cherish it above all else.  Of course, if this is it, and there are no eternal repercussions to our actions, then have at it.  Although, I'd have to wonder about you if the only thing keeping you from being a right bastard was that you were concerned about hell....
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The way I see it, if something like materialism was the truth, then we are not beings created by God in His image and likeness, with a transcendent dignity and an eternal destiny. The fact of our existence and the meaning of that existence would not be "good" in any particularly meaningful sense, nor would the human person possess a unique dignity. We would be worthless beasts, disgusting robots whose sentience is part of a cruel joke, who exist for a flicker of a time in a state of stupidity, only to become a rotting pile of stench ridden filth in the ground. Sure, someone could "cherish" humanity above all else, but I think the world-view of a materialist/atheist most be entirely different if they truly believe what they say. And thus the nature of love, and "cherishing" and valuing in general would be a quite different thing for such a person.

One can value and do the normal human thing toward their parents, children, spouse, etc. but if one truly believes that all of these people are nothing more than monkey-based, stimulus-response mechanisms destined for total annihilation, I fail to see how a true love and respect is psychologically possible.

To my mind, real love is ordered toward eternity and God, and sees the transcendent dignity of the person in the light of the ultimate mystery of the purpose of being. At the very least I can say, that if I was a convinced atheist, I would resent all other human beings, because they would remind me that my own existence, just as much as theirs, is a cruel joke, and an unimaginable horror. Any I would attribute kindness in all forms to simply evolutionary programming and secret selfish motives.
Everything would be entirely dark and empty, sinister and vile.

It's obviously a complicated topic, but I wonder how many atheists are sincere. It seems like the kind of position that if really internalized would lead to madness. I don't buy the stoic atheists, they don't seem very authentic, its a cop out.